Carniolan Queen bee

[Finman]

If the Italians don't prepare adequately for winter, this will manifest itself in their spring development. ?

How do you know that Italians do not prepare adequately for winter? From where you got that?

Biggest beekeepers in Finland have Italian bees 3000 hives, 1500 hives, 1200 hives...

This will manifest..... Judging with what?

 

[B+.]

How do you know that Italians do not prepare adequately for winter? From where you got that?

From you

If you feed pollen patty to Italians, it builds up as fast as Carniolan.

Carniolan has pollen stores after winter, and it can start earlier brood rearing than Italian. But even Carniolan cannot keep huge pollen stores, because it needs most of all honey stores.

If you have to give the Italians special treatment for them to build up as fast as the Carniolans, they haven't prepared as well for winter

 

[Finman]

Then, why are you advocating different treatment for one group of test subjects? This is not a fair test.

I am not in university either. Nobody pays me to perform these tests.

I produce honey, and you produce test results. That is difference in our beekeeping.

What do you mean that I advokated different treatment in the year 1991 to my hives?

I gove 500 g patty to all hives?

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[B+.]

I produce honey, and you produce test results. That is difference in our beekeeping.

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I beg to differ.
I produce honey as part of the process. My mean yield last year was 72.225Kg.

 

[Finman]

From you



If you have to give the Italians special treatment for them to build up as fast as the Carniolans, they haven't prepared as well for winter

What what.... i fed hives with pollen patty in spring 3 weeks before willow starts blooming. I used to start on second week of April. To all hives.

I do not need to give any special treatments to Italians. I extract honey from brood frames and fill them with sugar.

 

[Hivemaker.]

I extract honey from brood frames and fill them with sugar.

No where for the queen to lay if you do that, not a good idea this time of year.

 

[Finman]

I beg to differ.
I produce honey as part of the process. My mean yield last year was 72.225Kg.

And others got under 10 kg/hive in Britain.

Well. Eagle has landed.

What you should do is to test your honey balance.

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[B+.]

What you should do is to test your honey balance.

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Now, that is just rude!

 

[Finman]

No where for the queen to lay if you do that, not a good idea this time of year.

You know, I feed hives for winter in September and idea is that queen do not lay any more in September.

This time of year summer is coming, and after summer comes autumn.
Our apple trees just started blooming.

 

[Hivemaker.]

You know, I feed hives for winter in September and idea is that queen do not lay any more in September.

They do lay in September, October and November here, most important time to lay, some even lay all through the winter, but we have a very different climate from where you are, so things have to be done differently.

 

[Finman]

Only if honey production is our only aim.

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I have another aim too: To become rich.

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[Motobiman]

If natural reproduction was the only way bees reproduced, I might agree with you. However, I test my colonies and breed from those with the highest breeding values (just like cattle, poultry, etc). This means that I have to make new colonies too. So, I don't want swarmy bees. I want bees that are gentle, pest and disease resistant, and work hard. I will help with the reproduction of good stock

And therein lies the problem I suspect.

Bees have been doing what bees do for millions of years and beekeepers think they know better.

Did you ever consider your interference is actually part of the problem rather than part of the solution?

 

[B+.]

Did you ever consider your interference is actually part of the problem rather than part of the solution?

No

 

[For want of a better word]

And therein lies the problem I suspect.

Bees have been doing what bees do for millions of years and beekeepers think they know better.

Did you ever consider your interference is actually part of the problem rather than part of the solution?

Honey yields have been increased by using these Mediterranean types of GM bees.....
Think I will stick with my Native Amm !
Honey tastes better without all this sugar infusion malarkey!

Nos da

 

[Finman]

Honey yields have been increased by using these Mediterranean types of GM bees.....

Sell honey and buy sugar . It makes you happy.

 

[Motobiman]

No

Nothing more to be said then.

 

[Fusion_power]

With natural mating, sperm tend to clump in the spermatheca, they are not "mixed" haphazardly. This results in the queen at any given time laying eggs that are mostly fertilized from one of the clumps. After a few weeks/months, she may lay eggs that are predominantly fertilized from a different drone's sperm.

One of those "confound the scientists" observations is that some drones are more prepotent than others. If an italian queen is mated with 1 single africanized drone and a dozen european drones, for some strange reason, more of the eggs she lays will be fertilized by the africanized drone's semen than would be expected. This indicates that something is favoring the sperm of one drone over sperm from another.

 

[Hivemaker.]

Abstract

Sperm usage was investigated in a naturally mated honey bee queen. We collected worker progeny arising from eggs that were laid sequentially during three sampling periods. Paternity was determined by analysis of three polymorphic microsatellite loci, leading to the conclusion that the queen had mated with seven males. Direct analysis of the sperm from the spermatheca revealed no evidence that sperm from additional males was present inside the spermatheca. Frequencies of different subfamilies differed significantly and ranged from 3.8% to 27.3%. In the short term, the frequencies of subfamilies among the eggs laid did not change over time. The frequency of eggs of a particular subfamily was statistically independent of the previous egg's subfamily. Thus, there is no evidence for non-random fine-scale sperm usage, and we estimate the effect of sperm clumping to be less than 6%. We conclude that the sperm is mixed completely inside the queen's spermatheca. Our results suggest that taking brood samples from comb cells next to each other is a statistically correct way of independent sampling of subfamilies at a given time in honey bee colonies. Furthermore, any bias in subfamily frequencies in offspring queens due to sperm usage can be excluded. However, the analyses of progeny samples taken 12 months apart do not allow us to exclude moderate fluctuations of subfamily frequencies in the long-term.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s002650050436

Abstract: A honey bee queen mates with a number of drones a few days after she emerges
as an adult. Spermatozoa of different drones are stored in her spermatheca and used for the
UHVWRIWKHTXHHQ¶s life to fertilize eggs. Sperm usage is thought to be random, so that the
patriline distribution within a honey bee colony would remain constant over time. In this
study we assigned the progeny of a naturally mated honey bee queen to patrilines using
micrRVDWHOOLWH PDUNHUV DW WKH TXHHQ¶s age of two, three and four years. No significant
changes in patriline distribution occurred within each of two foraging seasons, with
samples taken one and five months apart, respectively. Overall and pair-wise comparisons
between the three analyzed years reached significant levels. Over the three-year period we
found a trend for patrilines to become more equally represented with time. It is important
to note that this study was performed with a single queen, and thus individual and
population variation in sperm usage patterns must be assessed. We discuss long-term
changes in patriline composition due tR PL[LQJ SURFHVVHV LQ WKH TXHHQ¶s spermatheca,
following incompOHWHPL[LQJRIGLIIHUHQWGURQHV¶ sperm after mating.

Does Patriline Composition Change over a Honey Bee Queen’s Lifetime? (PDF Download Available). Available from: https://www.researchgate.net/public...tion_Change_over_a_Honey_Bee_Queen's_Lifetime [accessed May 21, 2016].

 

[Motobiman]

So that's all clear then . . . . . . . . But

http://www.mdpi.com/2075-4450/3/3/857/pdf

So does this suggest early re queening is effective in maintaining desirable traits?

 

[Gilberdyke John]

I have another aim too: To become rich.

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It's getting late