First 'inspection'

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Bill_J

New Bee
Joined
Apr 25, 2019
Messages
18
Reaction score
2
Location
N Ireland
Hive Type
None
Hi, I'm new to bees and just recently finished a beginners course at my local association. Course was interesting but 95% classroom based with probably less than 30 mins practical stuff opening up a hive (it was a cold windy day for the practical session). Like all courses of that type, I suppose, it was great for giving a little bit of foundation knowledge but I suspect the real learning won't start until I'm on my own and doing the practical stuff regularly...making decisions and making my own mistakes (probably).

To that end, I bit the bullet last week, sold a kidney, and bought a national hive (with deep 14 x 12 brood box). I set it up and bought a Nuc of bees a few days later (native bees). The first problem I encountered was with transporting the bees. I'd bought a poly nuc, specifically for the purpose of getting them from the seller (40 minute drive away) to my home. The seller insisted, though, that a much better idea would be for me to bring my brood box, floor, crown board and some straps. His reasoning was that it would be easier just to move the bees once rather than from his nuc..to my nuc...to my hive. That made sense. The only issue I had was that the seller sold me the bees on 6 standard sized frames and my brood box is 14 x 12. I'd read on here and elsewhere that is not necessarily a problem and that the bees would fill the gap with wild comb until I was able to work the standard frames out of the brood box and gradually replace them with 14 x 12s.

The journey home at midnight, with the well strapped brood box, was incident free (thankfully) and once home I was able to place the brood box in position and uncover the entrance for the bees to fly the next morning. Over the next week I was desperate to take a look at what they were doing but I resisted and simply watched them fly in and out laden with pollen, which was reassuring. Yesterday I took the plunge and took a peek. I won't call it an 'inspection' because I'm not entirely sure what I was looking at (yet) but I did see the Queen (she's marked red). I also saw that the bees has drawn out almost an entire 14 x 12 frame and I saw plenty of capped cells but unsure whether they were brood or stores. I'm annoyed with myself for not looking closer and identifying exactly what I was looking at but I guess that will come with time. I also saw that the bees had indeed produced a load of wild comb attached to the bottom of each standard frame, as predicted by everything I had read on here. Oh, and I also saw quite a few drone cells towards the bottom of several frames (even I couldn't fail to identify them!). My head is spinning with loads of questions to ask and a thirst for knowledge but can I start with the drone cells. I've heard conflicting information on whether I should leave them alone or remove the drone cells. Someone told me to remove them as it is good measure against Verroa but the guy who sold me the bees said to leave them as 'it's good to have drones in the colony'. My instinct is to leave them for now but what do you guys think?

(Sorry for the ramble on but excitement of having bees getting the better of me and wife isn't interested in listening to me waffle on about them.)
 
Hi, I'm new to bees and just recently finished a beginners course at my local association. Course was interesting but 95% classroom based with probably less than 30 mins practical stuff opening up a hive (it was a cold windy day for the practical session). Like all courses of that type, I suppose, it was great for giving a little bit of foundation knowledge but I suspect the real learning won't start until I'm on my own and doing the practical stuff regularly...making decisions and making my own mistakes (probably).

To that end, I bit the bullet last week, sold a kidney, and bought a national hive (with deep 14 x 12 brood box). I set it up and bought a Nuc of bees a few days later (native bees). The first problem I encountered was with transporting the bees. I'd bought a poly nuc, specifically for the purpose of getting them from the seller (40 minute drive away) to my home. The seller insisted, though, that a much better idea would be for me to bring my brood box, floor, crown board and some straps. His reasoning was that it would be easier just to move the bees once rather than from his nuc..to my nuc...to my hive. That made sense. The only issue I had was that the seller sold me the bees on 6 standard sized frames and my brood box is 14 x 12. I'd read on here and elsewhere that is not necessarily a problem and that the bees would fill the gap with wild comb until I was able to work the standard frames out of the brood box and gradually replace them with 14 x 12s.

The journey home at midnight, with the well strapped brood box, was incident free (thankfully) and once home I was able to place the brood box in position and uncover the entrance for the bees to fly the next morning. Over the next week I was desperate to take a look at what they were doing but I resisted and simply watched them fly in and out laden with pollen, which was reassuring. Yesterday I took the plunge and took a peek. I won't call it an 'inspection' because I'm not entirely sure what I was looking at (yet) but I did see the Queen (she's marked red). I also saw that the bees has drawn out almost an entire 14 x 12 frame and I saw plenty of capped cells but unsure whether they were brood or stores. I'm annoyed with myself for not looking closer and identifying exactly what I was looking at but I guess that will come with time. I also saw that the bees had indeed produced a load of wild comb attached to the bottom of each standard frame, as predicted by everything I had read on here. Oh, and I also saw quite a few drone cells towards the bottom of several frames (even I couldn't fail to identify them!). My head is spinning with loads of questions to ask and a thirst for knowledge but can I start with the drone cells. I've heard conflicting information on whether I should leave them alone or remove the drone cells. Someone told me to remove them as it is good measure against Verroa but the guy who sold me the bees said to leave them as 'it's good to have drones in the colony'. My instinct is to leave them for now but what do you guys think?

(Sorry for the ramble on but excitement of having bees getting the better of me and wife isn't interested in listening to me waffle on about them.)

Hi Bill!

I think you and I are at the same stage so I can't offer any advice, but I'll be keenly watching responses on this thread for my own benefit :-D
 
Same! Very interested.

Did you get a chance to take any photos? That can help.

Capped brood usually has a brown velvety look and they are slightly raised (unless they are drones and these have little domes). Pollen is usually colorful. Capped honey is usually flat and mostly white. A real experienced beek will be able to tell you more.
 
Hi there. I too am at a similar stage. I was not told on my beginners course to remove drone cells. I believe it is normal to have a small percentage of drones.
 
Seems there's a few of us at the same stage. Hopefully an experienced beekeeper will comment re: drone cells...leave alone or destroy them? Even though I've done 'the course' it feels like I'm stumbling around in the dark a bit with zero knowledge. Thank God for this forum and Youtube. Lol.


Oh, and I didn't get any photos of within the hive, (maybe next time). I had planned to but with hive tool in one hand, smoker in the other and a face full of angry bees, I was too busy faffing about like Frank Spencer, to remember to take any. Not to mention the thick 'goat skin bee proof' gloves I was wearing that made my fingers too fat to operate a phone camera. Things can only improve. Lol.
 
This is one frame from my inspection on Sunday:
insp01-brood-frame-w-honey.JPG


Here's quick guide to what I see there:
insp01-brood-frame-w-honey-marked.png


This was an existing frame that came with my nuc from last week, so the brood, and I assume the stores, were from before I took possession. The larva, dunno, and there were some eggs there too, if I remember correctly, so they could have been in the last few days.
 
Please! Experienced beek's weigh in and correct any misinformation I may be purveying.
 
Yes it's funny. Beginners course done (well still on going really) transferred my nuc and didn't look at anything apart from spotting the queen. Think it's going to be a steep learning curve!
 
Yes it's funny. Beginners course done (well still on going really) transferred my nuc and didn't look at anything apart from spotting the queen. Think it's going to be a steep learning curve!

I suppose it's not exactly necessary, but more for your information and monitoring to check and know? They'll get on doing what they need to do, bees. But if you spot, say, only drone brood, or no brood, or multiple eggs per chamber... it can prepare you for a problem in the hive.
 
Not an experienced beek, so don't get excited! It's not easy to see(on my phone) but that narrow band across the top of main brood area is usually used for pollen storage. I can see some but if there are larvae in there HM may have run a bit short on space last week. As long as they are fetching plenty in it shouldn't be a problem though.
I'm still waiting to start my course��. Hurry up June 1st.
!
 
To that end, I bit the bullet last week, sold a kidney, and bought a national hive (with deep 14 x 12 brood box). I set it up and bought a Nuc of bees a few days later (native bees). The first problem I encountered was with transporting the bees.

The only issue I had was that the seller sold me the bees on 6 standard sized frames and my brood box is 14 x 12. I'd read on here and elsewhere that is not necessarily a problem and that the bees would fill the gap with wild comb until I was able to work the standard frames out of the brood box and gradually replace them with 14 x 12s.

I saw plenty of capped cells but unsure whether they were brood or stores. I'm annoyed with myself for not looking closer and identifying exactly what I was looking at but I guess that will come with time. I also saw that the bees had indeed produced a load of wild comb attached to the bottom of each standard frame, as predicted by everything I had read on here. Oh, and I also saw quite a few drone cells towards the bottom of several frames (even I couldn't fail to identify them!). My head is spinning with loads of questions to ask and a thirst for knowledge but can I start with the drone cells. I've heard conflicting information on whether I should leave them alone or remove the drone cells. Someone told me to remove them as it is good measure against Verroa but the guy who sold me the bees said to leave them as 'it's good to have drones in the colony'. My instinct is to leave them for now but what do you guys think?

(Sorry for the ramble on but excitement of having bees getting the better of me and wife isn't interested in listening to me waffle on about them.)

That's a long post :)

Firstly.. whoever sold you those as Natives has deceived you, Natives amm are very dark bees yours are awfully stripey for Natives.

Yes, the bees will draw comb under the standard frames but this time of year a lot of it will be Drone comb, I don't cull Drones, I don't feel the need and Bees love Drones so if you clip them off the bottom they'll just modify your comb elsewhere and build Drone comb there.

Your divided Picture is spot on from what I can see so don't worry you've clearly got a better understanding of it than you think :)
 
I had planned to but with hive tool in one hand, smoker in the other and a face full of angry bees, I was too busy faffing about like Frank Spencer, to remember to take any. Not to mention the thick 'goat skin bee proof' gloves I was wearing that made my fingers too fat to operate a phone camera. Things can only improve. Lol.

Oh wow! not only are they not Native Bees but they're angry sods too! I'd be contacting the seller!
If they are savage then you have done very well to stay calm, I appreciate that they are very defensive but cumbersome thick gloves may actually make them worse, they seem to like stinging leather gloves and the pheromone from each sting will draw in more bees to the fray, also, with reduced sensitivity they can make handling harder and without meaning to you may squash more bees this again will provoke a defence.

I use thin Nitrile gloves mostly but if dealing with a defensive hive Marigolds are pretty sting resistant but you can still feel if you are in danger of squashing a bee.
 
Whoops! Those photos are mine, not Bill_J’s. The bees in the photos should be buckfasts.
 
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can I start with the drone cells. I've heard conflicting information on whether I should leave them alone or remove the drone cells. Someone told me to remove them as it is good measure against Verroa but the guy who sold me the bees said to leave them as 'it's good to have drones in the colony'. My instinct is to leave them for now but what do you guys think?

Your supplier was correct - bees need drones, colonies are not happy unless they've got a balqnced population in the summer with at least 20% drones.
Culling derones to control varroa is both pointless (it has little long term effect) and extrmely short sighted, some think that the obsession with drone culling (and incessant shook swarming - but park that for now, in fact never visit it again :D) could be a contributing factor in early failing queens and poor matings.
Nice brood frame phot by Adam BTW, showing the classic food arch (honey and some pollen) over the brood nest.
 
Hahaha! that's a relief then, I've confused myself :icon_204-2::dupe:

I’d very much love to see Bill’s dark bees! FWIW: you can operate a phone using nitriles. You CAN get stung through them, tho’ l, as I found out when I rolled a little lady under a lug.
 
There is no need to cull drone cells for varroa control, there are better methods that do not waste the bees resources, and as mentioned they will just go and build them elsewhere.

You can approximate the age of the brood. An eggs remain an egg for 3 days, then it hatches into a larva which is fed for about 6 days, the cell is capped on the 9th day. The new adult emerges on the 21st day (24 for drones), it is a "nurse bee" inside the hive for another 18-19 days before it ever goes out to forage.

Read books, browse the web, read up on the handouts you got from the course you attended (you did get handouts didn't you?). Have faith in your knowledge and abilities.
 
You CAN get stung through them, tho’ l, as I found out when I rolled a little lady under a lug.

Leave the welding gloves for apiary visitors (makes you look very heroic !) Use a pair of marigolds with nitriles on top ... get some Olbas Oil and rub a few drops onto your hands once you have gloved up. Enough feel to handle the frames and still feel the bees and no more stings to your hands. The bees move away from the smell of Olbas Oil (there are other products that have the same effect but I find Olbas Oil works well for me.)
 
Leave the welding gloves for apiary visitors (makes you look very heroic !) Use a pair of marigolds with nitriles on top ... get some Olbas Oil and rub a few drops onto your hands once you have gloved up. Enough feel to handle the frames and still feel the bees and no more stings to your hands. The bees move away from the smell of Olbas Oil (there are other products that have the same effect but I find Olbas Oil works well for me.)

Is Olbas oil just eucalyptus oil? I have some eucalyptus but not specifically Olbas..
 

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