Donation reversal

[BKF Admin]

We have a commercial member who last week made a donation of £15 to the forum.

They then placed an ad on the forum for Queens and Nucs for sale.

The advert has been removed due to the seller being a full time beekeeper.

They have now requested a full refund of the donation.

What should we do as a forum ?

 

[nosmoking]

I have voted for the top option but I think your fees should bee deducted.

 

[oliver90owner]

Blatant. Like chucking a brick through someone's window, and then expecting to get it back so they can do it again!

I also note other salesman tricks from some commercial beeks (may not be this one) such as 'my bees ... are free of this or that problem' when posting on a thread where the topic is specifically that particular subject.

Typical salesman attitude, in my book. Doesn't wash with me but may sway some who are not quite so immune to this sort of thing.

 

[DontWorryBeeHappy]

My personal opinion is that the donation was an unconditional gift, it was made with no promises of anything in return.

This forum is very clear about it's motivation and principals and policy on adverts. Consequently I believe you should keep the donation.

As for placing the advert. Apply the same sanction as you would for any other member. Treat everyone as equal.

 

[oliver90owner]

Treat everyone as equal.

Certainly, but this is not simply a case of trying on the advertising, and putting their hands up and saying 'fair cop' when sussed, is it? Rather more than a knuckle rap required in a situation like this.

 

[beeboybee]

Give the £15 back and get rid of the advert...... Not worth the hassle.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[AnotherNewBee]

How about:

Welcome the member to the forum, keep the donation and thank him for it, explain the non-commercial rule and let the member know that they are welcome to request/place an ad in the beekeeping directory.

There is a For Sale/Wanted subforum. The first post I looked at in there (a 2009 one) looks pretty much commercial to me. Begin to apply the non-commercial rule equally and fairly or remove any posts - even the very old ones - from For Sale/Wanted that appear to be, in any way, commercial as they can lead to confusion about the forum rules.

 

[Poly Hive]

How about a third way?

Given many people have great problems in getting their first bees, we could have a subsection of the forum for sale items for Nucs and queens only. Nothing else, no kit and caboodle just bees. However the pros would have to pay a factored sub for this service and of course no posting. Say £1500?

PH

 

[For want of a better word]

Keep the donation and allow the member to continue posting.... £15 quid for ALL the Free publicity !
Perhaps with all his commercial expertise he may be able to pass on useful tips for all of us to benefit from...
A donation is a donation after all

I did not demand my donation to the Labour Party back when they go twissled out of forming a government at the last General Election!!!!

 

[Hivemaker.]

How about:

Welcome the member to the forum

The person has been a member since 2008,but of course i realize you would not know this,but the person in question should know the rules of this forum by now, i would of thought.

 

[AnotherNewBee]

The person has been a member since 2008,but of course i realize you would not know this,but the person in question should know the rules of this forum by now, i would of thought.

Fair comment. Your question is, then, has he made useful contributions. I don't need an answer - it's a question you need an answer to, not me.

The rest of my reply still applies. In fact, I'd go as far as recommending removal of the For Sale/Wanted subfora completely. This will eliminate any possible confusion whether from old or new members.

It looks as though this thread could lead back to 'that old chestnut'. Allow commercial posting, or don't allow commercial posting. There is no half way. Anything remotely commercial - including sale of apparently personal property - should be stopped so there can be no doubt or confusion either way. If someone wants to sell something they can be directed to the Beekeeping Auction.

 

[VEG]

If they have been a member that long then how many posts apart from "I have bees for sale" have they made?
They should know the rules being a member that long.
Keep the money let them stay and warn them about the advertising in future.
There seem to be a few that only post here at certain times of the year when they have bees for sale.
Point them in the direction of the beekeeping directory! Thats what it is there for

 

[dpearce4]

It is well known that if you want to sell nucs etc on here you have to donate before doing so (to me that means it is a charge for the advert), so if your not allowing him to sell then you shouldnt keep hold of his donation/charge.

you need to apply the rules equally across the forum members, also if i hadnt of bought some secondhand kit from a commercial member that was advertised on here then i prob wouldnt have been able to afford to start off.

 

[scuttlefish]

IMHO - "thanks for the donation, but you've been here long enough to know that commercial sales postings aren't allowed".

 

[BeeJayBee]

We have a commercial member who last week made a donation of £15 to the forum.

That was nice, and also seems to be according to the rules regarding advertising things for sale.

They then placed an ad on the forum for Queens and Nucs for sale.

No donation, no advert. Isn't that what the rules say?

The advert has been removed due to the seller being a full time beekeeper.

Why shouldn't a "full time beekeeper" be able to advertise what they have to sell? People sell other things, and quite a few of them are "full time" at either raising nucs, queens, running courses or making hives. Some people do all of them, and advertise, without any hassle. Others are 'known' to do one, the other, or all, and get quietly recommended so don't need to advertise.

They have now requested a full refund of the donation.

Fair enough. They gave money so they could sell something. You've now said they can't, even though they've paid the fee. I don't think you can have it both ways, otherwise it looks as if the rules are flexible, depending on who the seller is.

Anybody who sells something is being "commercial" in some way or another, few do it to give all the money they raise to a charity.

 

[village girl]

My personal opinion is that the donation was an unconditional gift, it was made with no promises of anything in return.

This forum is very clear about it's motivation and principals and policy on adverts. Consequently I believe you should keep the donation.

As for placing the advert. Apply the same sanction as you would for any other member. Treat everyone as equal.

a donation must be just that, given of free will with no expectations of a return or preferential tretment, the forum rules are clear and to ask for a refund of the donation sugests that the donator was hoping to get round the rules with the donation. the money should not be returned, just my opinion

 

[newportbuzz]

cant have double standards got to refund the donation as it was linked to the sale advert.

on a side note either the for sale advert should stand or all the other for sale adverts should be removed cant have both they cancel each other out.

be realistic as to where you draw the line but you have then to be unfaulting in your enforcement of the line.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Definitiion of donation: bestowal, gift, grant (definition of bestowal: to present as a gift)
That means no strings or conditions attached.
Thanks for the cash - feel free to post good advice to the forum members goodnight God bless love Admin

 

[VEG]

Maybe a change in the wording is needed as to a charge for selling a nuc, but if it applies to a nuc then why not anything else put here for sale?
Rules need to be clarified as someone above said anything sold is making money for that person so can that be classed as commercial?

 

[Stiffy]

If they have been a member since 2008 they have either been asleep or are now trying to flout the rules. Either way give them their money back and say goodbye......their loss