Donation reversal

[Queens59]

As the rules state that:

If you have a product to sell and beekeeping is not your main business but a hobby you may advertise your items,if you are unsure then it may be best to contact admin before submitting your advert.

He broke this rule...has been a member long enough to know the rules - so he paid knowing he was not abiding by them. Warm him but keep the donation...if he has been a useful member...or keep it and ban him if he hasn't...

 

[wightbees]

As the rules state that:

If you have a product to sell and beekeeping is not your main business but a hobby you may advertise your items,if you are unsure then it may be best to contact admin before submitting your advert.

He broke this rule...has been a member long enough to know the rules - so he paid knowing he was not abiding by them. Warm him but keep the donation...if he has been a useful member...or keep it and ban him if he hasn't...

This does not make sense to me.Does it mean that if its my second business with lower pay than main Business ,that its ok to sell bees.
Or does it mean that if its not a business at all(not registered with HMRC) ,only a hobby its ok to sell bees here?

 

[taff..]

This does not make sense to me.Does it mean that if its my second business with lower pay than main Business ,that its ok to sell bees.
Or does it mean that if its not a business at all(not registered with HMRC) ,only a hobby its ok to sell bees here?

quite.

I don't see the difference in a commercial beekeeper raising 10 nucs to sell, and any other beekeeper raising 10 nucs to sell. the end result is the same, 10 nucs being sold at what, £120, £150 each. the only difference is the 'commercial' man 'might' pay taxes on the sales where the hobbyist may well not declare the income.

 

[protheroe]

quite.

I don't see the difference in a commercial beekeeper raising 10 nucs to sell, and any other beekeeper raising 10 nucs to sell. the end result is the same, 10 nucs being sold at what, £120, £150 each. the only difference is the 'commercial' man 'might' pay taxes on the sales where the hobbyist may well not declare the income.

if its a commercial operation then its not just 10 nucs or so,its going to be dozens upwards which equates to many thousands of pounds

 

[Polyanwood]

The point for me is that we love this forum and the way it has developed has been more collaborative and much less authoritarian than other forums. I am grateful that this forum is not powered by adverts and full of pop ups. I am glad that we are a community of beekeepers and we chat about bees and that we don't suffer repeated commercial postings from people wanting to sell stuff, because that is tedious. I am glad that we have rules, that we have agreed and that most people stick to them.

When people break the rules, particualrly if they do so knowingly, that is tiresome, as it means that someone else has to act as enforcer. Running this forum is no-one's paid job. We all benefit from it.

I think that there should be a penalty for breaking the rules knowingly. He already got free publicity. £15 donation is a small price to pay. If there is another transgression I think his posting rights should be suspended for a few weeks. I think it is cheeky asking for a donation back at all, but especially under the circumstances. He should suck up the £15 loss ( if you can call a donation a loss!).

 

[wightbees]

Who was it ?????????????????????
They been here long ????????????

 

[protheroe]

Who was it ?????????????????????
They been here long ????????????

since 2008

 

[taff..]

if its a commercial operation then its not just 10 nucs or so,its going to be dozens upwards which equates to many thousands of pounds

yes, possibly, but the hobbyists intention is exactly the same as the commercial guy's.

raise nuc's, advertise them wherever possible, sell them at a profit.

 

[region2]

OMG - we have a for sale section, they obviously thought they were following the rules and donated, got it wrong so asked for donation back. Give it back and carry on...

I agree with someone (above) who said that anyone should be able to advertise in the for sale bit - why is everyone so 'frightened' of commercial sellers? On eBay the businesses declare themselves as such so why can't the forum members do the same?

R2

 

[Black Comb]

I'm with Beejoyful and Taff.
How do you define commercial or full time? How do you know?
I've said this in other threads, but the way the rules are applied on this forum are very idiosyncratic.

Perhaps you should have option 5 : keep the donation and allow him to sell some nucs.

 

[protheroe]

yes, possibly, but the hobbyists intention is exactly the same as the commercial guy's.

raise nuc's, advertise them wherever possible, sell them at a profit.

but the hobbyist is more toward covering costs than making money.I keep a few hives and i would have to sell a nuc just to buy a tub of apiguard,another 3 or 4 nucs to cover feed costs and as for frames and new hives and supers ???????

 

[taff..]

but the hobbyist is more toward covering costs than making money.I keep a few hives and i would have to sell a nuc just to buy a tub of apiguard,another 3 or 4 nucs to cover feed costs and as for frames and new hives and supers ???????

really????

£120-£150 nuc to buy a tub of apiguard, get real, a couple of jars of honey would cover that

 

[Bee-Key-Pur]

That was nice, and also seems to be according to the rules regarding advertising things for sale.

No donation, no advert. Isn't that what the rules say?

Why shouldn't a "full time beekeeper" be able to advertise what they have to sell? People sell other things, and quite a few of them are "full time" at either raising nucs, queens, running courses or making hives. Some people do all of them, and advertise, without any hassle. Others are 'known' to do one, the other, or all, and get quietly recommended so don't need to advertise.

Fair enough. They gave money so they could sell something. You've now said they can't, even though they've paid the fee. I don't think you can have it both ways, otherwise it looks as if the rules are flexible, depending on who the seller is.

Anybody who sells something is being "commercial" in some way or another, few do it to give all the money they raise to a charity.

 

[protheroe]

really????

£120-£150 nuc to buy a tub of apiguard, get real, a couple of jars of honey would cover that

a tub of apiguard is knocking on 100 pounds,im not on about a single treatment.

 

[taff..]

a tub of apiguard is knocking on 100 pounds,im not on about a single treatment.

yes, I'm aware of that, and with your 25 hives I expect you'll easily be able to sell 25Lb of honey at £4 a Lb.

 

[newportbuzz]

yes, I'm aware of that, and with your 25 hives I expect you'll easily be able to sell 25Lb of honey at £4 a Lb.

my nucs from this year will be used to pay for an extractor. treatments. more frames. more boxes. more wax. and not least sugar for winter feed.
My honey goes to bribery for out apiarys favors etc very little of it sold.

not saying this is the common case but it is the case for me.

 

[protheroe]

my nucs from this year will be used to pay for an extractor. treatments. more frames. more boxes. more wax. and not least sugar for winter feed.
My honey goes to bribery for out apiarys favors etc very little of it sold.

not saying this is the common case but it is the case for me.

same for me,a lot more going out than coming in the last 2 years,still borrowing a 4 frame extractor and cant see me buying one anytime soon

 

[fox403]

My thoughts....most are scared to sell on here because of the backlash u will get in the forums if anything goes wrong,,,,the section is empty which is a shame as the more that use it the more price's would come down,,,u just have to take a look at bidfor(donkeys) website

Sent from my MB525 using Tapatalk 2

 

[taff..]

my nucs from this year will be used to pay for an extractor. treatments. more frames. more boxes. more wax. and not least sugar for winter feed.
My honey goes to bribery for out apiarys favors etc very little of it sold.

not saying this is the common case but it is the case for me.

so you raise nucs with the sole intention of selling them, that sounds like a pretty commercial decision to me


I'm not saying there's anything wrong with selling nucs, be it by a 'commercial' or 'hobbyist' beekeeper, and I'm in agreement that bees have to cover their own costs. what did people do before nucs had any real value? is not only in the last few years that the price of nucs has gone through the roof?

selling honey and other products of the hive.

 

[FreeFall]

I
Perhaps you should have option 5 : keep the donation and allow him to sell some nucs.