BBKA Bee Breeding certificate.

[B+.]

If you don't do II how could you supply a 3 Gen Pedigree as per the PDF B+ attached, or do you have an isolated mating station?

That's a good question, but, I'm not going into why one person passed and I didn't. I think it's all pretty clear that the number one criteria was rearing local mongrels. As far as I can see, that's the biggest problem with it (although, moving the goalposts after the event is a definite no-no too!)

 

[colinc]

I would say moving the goalposts after people agreed to participate and had sent in plans is the biggest no no.
They should have said “you are all beta testers and no one will win the cap badge of approval from the BBKA” or they should have stuck with their initial criteria for “queen breeding without racial prejudice”, not decided halfway through to turn it into a political exercise at the participants expense to put across the BBKA’s halfbaked agenda.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[kevrhcfag]

That's a good question, but, I'm not going into why one person passed and I didn't. I think it's all pretty clear that the number one criteria was rearing local mongrels. As far as I can see, that's the biggest problem with it (although, moving the goalposts after the event is a definite no-no too!)

The reality is the problem is with the Title of the Certificate. Using that criteria is not a Bee Breeding Certificate its a Queen Rearing Certificate with an appreciation for selection. Nothing more nothing less as it suits the BBKA agenda / philosophy on its local and doesn't matter whats its like.

 

[B+.]

I would say moving the goalposts after people agreed to participate and had sent in plans is the biggest no no.
They should have said “you are all beta testers and no one will win the cap badge of approval from the BBKA” or they should have stuck with their initial criteria for “queen breeding without racial prejudice”, not decided halfway through to turn it into a political exercise at the participants expense to put across the BBKA’s halfbaked agenda.

For the sake of clarity: the participants of the pilot programme weren't asked to pay a fee. However, you'd be expected to pay an entrance fee once the assessment was offered publicly (just as you'd do with the other BBKA exams).
The reason I said the focus on mongrels was the biggest issue for me was that it effectively pre-selected the target audience. How can the BBKA claim to represent all of its membership when they say, only a portion of the membership are eligible to apply?
Moving the goalposts after the event would be a no-no for every assessment, no matter what the subject. It's so bizarre that it shouldn't even be possible!

 

[For want of a better word]

Fundamentally, it's all about whether you can light a smoker (which I rarely do anymore), recognise the queen, workers and drones (adult and pupal stage) and a bit on disease management (notably, EFB and AFB). There's not really that much more to it.
I did my "Basic" so long ago that the BBKA had to dig through old paper records to confirm that I'd taken it. It wasn't even on their computer system.
Having the "Basic" under your belt was a pre-requisite for the Bee Breeders certificate (and rightly so IMO). If you hadn't already taken it, this could explain why you weren't part of the pilot group. Sometimes, having a bit of paper opens doors and changes how people view you. It doesn't mean you can't do it. It just means you haven't passed the exam.

I was... I have and realised I would fall at the first post when I mentioned AI and Amm !
AND since I was busy organising a Bee breeding and Bee Improvement course here in Cornwall made an executive decision that it was not for me as I really did not have that much spare time to faff about..

Yeghes da

 

[Finman]

.
Isolated mating stations to mongrels?

 

[Hivemaker.]

I really did not have that much spare time to faff about..

Having plenty of spare time to faff about is very scarce during the active season.

 

[B+.]

The reality is the problem is with the Title of the Certificate. Using that criteria is not a Bee Breeding Certificate its a Queen Rearing Certificate with an appreciation for selection. Nothing more nothing less as it suits the BBKA agenda / philosophy on its local and doesn't matter whats its like.

I met someone who is on the BBKA exam committee last night. It seems this is the way the "Old guard" want it. The more junior members disagree but have no real say.

 

[Hebeegeebee]

I think it reasonable to say that the cert was a 'Mongrel Breeding Certificate' and as has been pointed out, would seem to fit in with the BBKA's idea of breeding locally adapted bees. I don't have an isolated mating site although I have some colonies around my home apiary. However, considering there will be many colonies around me that I have no control over, it's not possible to 'flood the area' with my drones, my description is that I just 'moisten the area' a little bit with them.

It still seems odd that someone with the skills of B+ did not pass and I did.

 

[mbc]

It still seems odd that someone with the skills of B+ did not pass and I did.

Possibly demeanour was taken into account

 

[B+.]

Possibly demeanour was taken into account

I'll ignore the attempted jibe.

The assessment should have been an objective examination of my bee breeding knowledge/skills. That, after all, is why people engage in the process. If "other criteria" are going to come into play, then, I doubt many people will apply. Don't forget, when the certificate is offered publicly, people will be required to pay an entrance fee. Who would do that if the process was so subjective?

 

[For want of a better word]

Having plenty of spare time to faff about is very scarce during the active season.

Unless one only has a few colonies to faff around with....

Yeghes da

 

[Teemore]

Unless one only has a few colonies to faff around with....

Yeghes da

Once again, I am reminded of Manley's description of the "types" of beekeeper.

 

[B+.]

The BBKA have issued a new syllabus (https://www.-------------/files/lib...y_bee_breeding_-_syllabus_2017_1506329279.pdf). There are some major revisions but still not what I'd call a proper bee breeding certificate

 

[Beefriendly]

I showed this syllabus to a solicitor friend of mine. He said, if anyone could be bothered to pursue it, that it was almost racist in its content, as it excluded so many other bee types. You can't do that sort of thing these days.

 

[B+.]

I showed this syllabus to a solicitor friend of mine. He said, if anyone could be bothered to pursue it, that it was almost racist in its content, as it excluded so many other bee types. You can't do that sort of thing these days.

Well, actually, a lot of breeding work is done on racial grounds.
Personally, I think the EU funded SMARTBEES project is behind a lot of this (https://www.bienenjournal.de/fachberichte/diversitaet-wird-oft-falsch-verstanden/). Prof Bienefeld has a bit of a "bee in his bonnet" about it but, actually, the Germans export their queens all over the world. I can't see breeders paying much attention to it.
It's just a pity that the BBKA are being influenced by the politics instead of seeing the bigger picture (especially with BREXIT on the horizon).

 

[mbc]

It's just a pity that the BBKA are being influenced by the politics instead of seeing the bigger picture (especially with BREXIT on the horizon).

perhaps it's the biological truth of the benefits of trying to avoid further mixing up of the gene pool that's influencing them rather than politics

 

[B+.]

perhaps it's the biological truth of the benefits of trying to avoid further mixing up of the gene pool that's influencing them rather than politics

What benefits? The BBKA are promoting mongrel queen rearing with their new bee breeding certificate (as discussed earlier).

 

[madasafish]

What benefits? The BBKA are promoting mongrel queen rearing with their new bee breeding certificate (as discussed earlier).

I read the syllabus . What immediately hit me was:
"Topics for Oral Discussion
The Candidate will be able to describe the following and explain their relevance to
practical beekeeping:
5.1. The different races of honey bees commonly used in Europe and their
characteristics."

http://tinyurl.com/y7fbrl9l

If you are breeding bees from mongrels and reject the idea that importing bees is a good thing, then surely this question is superfluous as asking it suggests that mongrels might not be the answer...to whatever the question is..

I must admit I did not understand most of the syllabus so maybe I am just being an ignorant pleb..as usual.

 

[For want of a better word]

It's just a pity that the BBKA are being influenced by the politics instead of seeing the bigger picture (especially with BREXIT on the horizon).

Who are the BBKA.... seems that "THEY" are a minority who have climbed the wobbly ladder to the top... some with set views beekeepering wise.... the majority of membership just follow like good little sheep.... this is politics?

Nos da