Goodness gracious, is there no end to this ? It's pretty clear to me that using the word 'natural' in beekeeping circles is like waving a red rag at a bull. I picked my previous words carefully in order not to criticise or alienate 'conventional' beekeepers as I believe that most of you share a common love of the bees and you do what you do in their best interests. Indeed, I was at pains to suggest that there are beeks on the 'more natural' side of beekeeping that are equally bigotted. Yet you still come back with very disparaging remarks that are wholly unacceptable.
I don't believe that 'unconventional' - is that a better word ? beeks are any more 'holier than thou' than some conventional beekeepers, there are extremists on both sides of beekeeping - indeed, I don't even like to think of it as 'two sides' - it's beekeeping with different styles. All I was trying to say was that it is counter productive to be close minded (on either side of the divide) - the fact is that you do have to spend a great deal of money, time and effort on monitoring and 'treating' bees for Varroa etc. and if there is a less invasive way of making bees healthier and productive then surely we should all be considering it ? The only people discouraging alternative ways should be the pharmaceutical and beekeeping supply firms that stand to lose a fortune if they can no longer sell their 'essential' beekeeping products.
Do people feel so threatened that they need to brand all 'natural' (oh - sh..t there's that word again !) as johnny-come-latelys who will give up at the first sting ? I know several people who started beekeeping with National Hives and conventional methods who didn't last two seasons .... I think, mainly, as a result of not knowing enough BEFORE they started out and the complexity and time involved in trying to combat the threat of disease, parasites, weather, feeding etc. and then, after all this effort, still see a colony diminish, die or leave. Not continuing with beekeeping is certainly not a phenomena that's found only on the 'more natural' side of the fence. Indeed, I think, if you looked at any enterprise or hobby there are always going to be those poeple who carry on and enjoy it and those who realise it is not for them and pack up, the 80/20 rule probably applies to this as well as everything else.
I've joined my local association and signed up for a course in January - I hope to learn from ALL the experience that there is within my local beekeeping community - regardless of how they keep their bees. I don't have an issue with cow dung hives - I doubt that I would have one myself - but I respect alternative ideas and view their results with interest. Equally, I believe that the experience and knowledge of ALL longstanding beekeepers is an immense resource that should be treasured and leveraged so that we can all learn from one another.
Anyway, we really must stop these gross generalisations, sweeping statements and the attitude that only one way is best - and more importantly curb the enthusiasm for rudeness, cynicism and ridicule. We could debate on the basis of facts (and agree to disagree) as there is clearly a huge interest - just look at the number of views these three threads have gathered over the last few days !! I'm sure it's not all just JB fans having a peek ...
But let's get rid of the slanging match and get professional about discussing the issues - it's not nice the way this has been going.
I don't think I'm going to fuel this thread any more - perhaps a new thread should be started with the first debate being what we are going to rename so called 'natural' beekeepers that won't antagonise those 'conventional' beekeepers who react so badly to any suggestion that there is another way or disparage those beekeepers who seek to keep bees in a less conventional manner.... and I think all beekeepers should be happy beekeepers so we can discount that one for starters !
Phil
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