Hybrids & defensive/aggressive behaviour

[JamezF]

alternatively, it could be the local stock that's absolutely awful and it needs input from elsewhere to make it manageable

I have some swarms at a couple of out apiaries that are astonishingly calm, yet half a mile further away the locals are absolute gits. I can't help wondering if it's at least partly down to the fact that the local (ex-?)SBI lives not far from the first group.

James

 

[Newbeeneil]

I have some swarms at a couple of out apiaries that are astonishingly calm, yet half a mile further away the locals are absolute gits. I can't help wondering if it's at least partly down to the fact that the local (ex-?)SBI lives not far from the first group.

James

Probably, I know I pick up swarms from my ex SBI every year. Last year it was 3!

 

[SWEET]

As far as bees are concerned, if an F1 queen mates with a local drone, results can be horrifying

Usual replies without much context, so here goes.

Queens mate with many drones so you'll get a mix of traits across the board, she may well mate with a defensive drone(s) and those traits can display and become dominant. She might have been carrying those defensive genes yet needed the right drone to unlock that behaviour. Your queen sub sister groups share 75% ish DNA with the half sisters sharing around 25% (assume 10-15 drones mated etc). So even if a few of those drones were defensive only a small percentage of the bees in hive would be vile. Again assuming she managed to mix things up a bit regards the fathers.

I guess if you were completely surrounded by vile bees your results would be poor, but queens travel a huge distance to mix things up and the pool of drones would be vast. Surely there are 1000's stocks around Bristol?

 

[Erichalfbee]

but queens travel a huge distance to mix things up

https://theapiarist.org/queen-mating-flights/#:~:text=Actually, if only 5% of,1.5 miles (2.4 km).

 

[SWEET]

https://theapiarist.org/queen-mating-flights/#:~:text=Actually, if only 5% of,1.5 miles (2.4 km).

Yep, like he covers in detail.

 

[ericbeaumont]

results can be horrifying

More accurate and less emotive to describe the results objectively: variable, depending on drones in that area.

 

[The Poot]

What is a defensive drone? I’ve not been stung by one yet.

 

[SWEET]

What is a defensive drone? I’ve not been stung by one yet.

Plenty on here ho ho

They carry the data to create super nasty hellish bees.... most of the traits your lovely bees have, come from the father drone(s).

Her spermatheca will hold all the sperm from the drones she mated with. Each time she lays an egg, sperm is released to fertilise (or not) each one.
Here is a pic showing the drones sperm - (from a vid I created)

 

[jarmo henttu]

What is a defensive drone? I’ve not been stung by one yet.

it is in genes. You surely know it. The queen may mate with 15 queens, and she may need only one defensive drone. The the cony has 3000 -7000 defensive workers.

 

[The Poot]

it is in genes. You surely know it. The queen may mate with 15 queens, and she may need only one defensive drone. The the cony has 3000 -7000 defensive workers.

I was trying to lighten the mood by being facetious…..

 

[Swarm]

Has winter really been that long?

 

[jarmo henttu]

I was trying to lighten the mood by being facetious…..

It was a nice try...

 

[SWEET]

If you want full control (or just cull poorly open-mated queens).

 

[Hedgerow Honey]

@Mint Bee I’m not just using colour alone there are many traits I’m using .

Have you done any wing morphology?, this would be the only method that can reasonably predict the strain you have and is often overlooked in discussion such as this as it takes time, skill and a good computer program, none of which I have myself.

Our apprentice just recently finished this section of the BFA apprenticeship on their final gap week & used 30/40 bees from each of a colony on a number of different apiaries.
The results were really surprising as there were differences between colonies headed by queen's that arrived in the same batches last year and you would assume were mated with similar drones.
Colour, temprement, and desired traits are generally just an opinion, are they not?.

Myself I do not understand why there is all this politics around who has what queen. I have never seen so much written by the rare breed cattle breeders slating commercial dairy operations.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Myself I do not understand why there is all this politics around who has what queen

Same here. Would you say it was more of a “Hobby” horse?

 

[Sutty]

Myself I do not understand why there is all this politics around who has what queen. I have never seen so much written by the rare breed cattle breeders slating commercial dairy operations.

Though if the dairy herd bulls could mate randomly with the rare breed cows it might cause some angst!

 

[warsaw_hive]

Though if the dairy herd bulls could mate randomly with the rare breed cows it might cause some angst!

Exactly. Farmers round here have all sorts of breeds, but they are separated by hedges and barbed wire. When a bull escapes bad things can happen, a small Dexter cow cannot give birth to calf fathered by a large breed bull (I'll spare the forum the gory details).

I live in a part of the country where there has been a big push to preserve AMM. You couldn't not know about it. Now a beekeeper is perfectly entitled to disregard that if they want, but I am perfectly entitled to moan about that beekeeper.

 

[Swarm]

Though if the dairy herd bulls could mate randomly with the rare breed cows it might cause some angst!

Absolutely, in those cases breeding is controlled so not a good analogy. More accurate would be filling a wild cat area with domestic moggies.

 

[Murox]

Absolutely, in those cases breeding is controlled so not a good analogy. More accurate would be filling a wild cat area with domestic moggies.

Aah! regrettably its already happened and wild cats are now confined to a few small enclaves.

 

[Swarm]

Worth a watch.