BBKA education

[BBG]

As a practical assessment might be a bit tricky. Robot beekeeper via a webcam maybe?

As for the modules, suggest it, know I'd be quite happy to just be able to do it online, not exactly rocket science to implement either. You can do the rest by just by downloading the syllabus and working your way through it. We tend to do it as a workshop for those that are interested but nothing to stop someone doing it on their tod and just taking the exam at the end of it, know a few people who take that approach too. As for the fee it's a whole £17 for the modules and £10 for the Basic if memory serves me right.

Sorry to interrupt the flame war with actual on topic discussion we now return you to our scheduled session of

Hi Nellie

on this page near the bottom they mention £45 per module

http://************************/examinations_and_assessments.php

Unless I have misread it.

 

[broandy]

45 quid sheeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzzzzz tut

 

[Richard Bache]

Hi Nellie

on this page near the bottom they mention £45 per module

http://************************/examinations_and_assessments.php

Unless I have misread it.

BBG, that is the price for the correspondance course per module, i.e. getting someone to give some tuition (distance learning style), per module. It is not necessary to pass the exams, but some people find it useful.

 

[BKF Admin]

BBKA member, but not necessarily agreeing with everything they do.

Richard I think you speak for hundreds if not thousands of members of this forum.

I am also a BBKA member(not paid for,does that make me an honorary member?) but also do not agree with everything they do.

Trouble with the BBKA forum was if you voiced your concerns you either had you concern deleted or got banned.

 

[Brosville]

At risk of tempting someone into making a right nelly of themselves (again), I'll make the point that I don't think many people have any problem with training courses as run by the BBKA - it's "horses for courses", some find them useful, some don't.
What I do bitterly resent is that the courses (and the insurance) are held up as carrots so that the good people who form the vast majority of the membership are coerced to add their funding and tacit support for ALL of the things that are done in the association's name in order to enjoy those "benefits", and I find that dreadfully wrong on every single level.
To address that "change from within" argument again, I have no problem with people who are happy to go that route, as I've said umpteen times I'm not comfortable with that, and reckon that an equally effective way of changing things is "from outside" (which does not involve compromising one's principles) - the more of us who eschew membership, the sooner the penny may drop that the association would be far better off in instituting the necessary changes to encourage everyone to join!

 

[thada1]

Exams aren't for everyone, but certainly some people will benefit from them as an incentive to expand their knowledge and challenge their views. I speak as someone who has gone through the bulk of the BBKA examination system. Does it matter that they count for nothing on your CV? It didn't to me: I did it because I enjoy it. It has helped me develop into a much more rounded beekeeper than experience alone could have taught me. There are weaknesses and I am sure that every beekeeper will have a view on what should be changed about the BBKA examination system: I certainly think it should be changed and updated. I fully appreciate that many people dislike the concept of examinations, but nonetheless enjoy beekeeping and progress in beekeeping well. Of course there will be beekeepers who have not attained any certificates who are very good beekeepers, just as much as there will be some who have passed exams who are not great beekeepers. If you want to try exams, go for it. If you don't fancy exams, don't resent others who may want to: beekeeping is supposed to be fun after all! Exams are a route to improving your standards, but by no means the only route.
Although some within the BBKA suggested that beekeepers should hold the basic as a licence to keep bees, I cannot see that ever being feasible as the number of beekeepers who go down the exam route has always been the minority. For the vast majority, exams therefore are unnecessary, but some (myself included) certainly have (and do) benefit from them.

COI: BBKA basic assessor and tutor for the correspondance course. BBKA member, but not necessarily agreeing with everything they do.

hear hear

 

[Nellie]

Nellie you were fast becoming a BBKA education troll.
Glad to see you want to move on with the original topic.

Not everyone wants to take exams,I realise its the lifeblood of the BBKA but for many beekeepers reading a book and self teaching is all they want.

Make no apologies for supporting their education programme it's one area that I think they actually do very well. As with others I definitely feel that there are aspects of it that need updating but overall I think it's worthwhile at least reading the syllabus even if you've no intention of actually taking the exams.

Fully appreciate that not everyone wants to take exams and have no issue with that either. Certainly don't believe that holding a certificate of some sort whether from the Bee unit, the BBKA or Greggs the Bakers should be required to keep bees but I do understand why Councils are increasingly asking for people wanting to keep bees on allotments to hold the Basic Certificate.

in the context of the original question though where presumably there is some interest in what they're about to begin with, then my answer remains that Yes, they're certainly worth investigating and if it still sounds interesting ask your local association what they can do to help, that's part of what they're supposed to be there for. I'm running workshops for people in our association who want to take the basic, one of the other guys is running a workshop for people wanting to take the modules. In both cases actually taking the exam isn't compulsory, but I feel it's important to offer our members the option to build on their knowledge if they want to.

 

[BKF Admin]

Nellie I may be being a little cynical here and I apologies if I have got it wrong but I get the impression that if the BBKA forum had more posters you would not grace us with your presence along with one or two others.

Looking back through the majority of your posts it seems that you are mainly here to peddle the BBKA modules and exams to our membership as the BBKA's website gets little traffic.

Do you think its a fair assessment of your main participation on the forum ?.

 

[beebreeder]

just had a count up 7 posts in 24 hours, very busy!!!!!!!!
kev

 

[broandy]

just had a count up 7 posts in 24 hours, very busy!!!!!!!!
kev

Am just sitting on the fence eating my ice cream lol

 

[Brosville]

in this day and age this is what you need..........
http://moodle.org/ - can cut costs to the bone.........

 

[Nellie]

Nellie I may be being a little cynical here and I apologies if I have got it wrong but I get the impression that if the BBKA forum had more posters you would not grace us with your presence along with one or two others.

Looking back through the majority of your posts it seems that you are mainly here to peddle the BBKA modules and exams to our membership as the BBKA's website gets little traffic.

Do you think its a fair assessment of your main participation on the forum ?.

Let's see, is it because there isn't much going on with the BBKA forum, the Biobees forum the SBA forum, the omlet forum, the River Cottage Forum, the allotment beekeepers forum, the myriad of other forums unrelated to beekeeping that I also frequent that I just sit around drumming my fingers waiting with baited breath for a chance to don my education cape and leap over here to save the day with some timely information about doing the Basic Assessment? I wouldn't flatter yourself.

The question was asked about exams so I posted, I didn't start the thread. I'm peddling nothing, though I've got some wax going spare if you want some.

Lets see, a few posts baiting Brosville because he's an *****. Two threads about education that turned into the usual whinging about the BBKA, Woodpeckers, swarming, setting up apiarys. Few posts about gloves, few more posts about woodpeckers, silly link to a comedy video in the off topic forums, a mead recipe, more baiting Brosville, more stuff about gloves, bit about painting hives, bit of general advice about getting started beekeeping, stuff about finding queens, something about brood in supers, bit more stuff on doing the module 1 exam, posts about EFB in bath, bit of discussion about not using foundation, posts about adding more supers, more stuff about gloves, bit about bees taxing wax/propolis, random post in the swarm vid, opinion about 14x12 frames, another scrap over the relative merits or otherwise of the BBKA, couple of posts in the "have your say" thread, More stuff about 14x12s, stuff about varroa, "comedy" post in off topic, respond to a request for a mentor in Bristol, opinion about magazines, more stuff about varroa, more Brosville baiting, stuff on varroa, opinion/advice on allotment beekeeping, stuff about putting electronric stuff in hives.

So yeah, I'd say you're mistaken, my primary role on this forum is both to cheerlead the use of 14x12s and Nitrile/latex gloves but clearly to bait Brosville.

 

[Queens59]

Two threads about education that turned into the usual whinging about the BBKA

Silly question Nellie...but if the BBKA ( and yes, presently a member) was so brill - do you think so many would post negatively on here?

1 - No support locally
2 - No answers to questions posted on the other forum
3 - Attended a county show and ignored by all but 1 member
4 - No details on member contacts
5 - No info on location of association apiary
6 - No info on availablity of items for hire or price or how to hire
7 - One contact from alleged 'mentor' in 8 months

If they were great locally, I wouldn't bash/winge and I am sure some groups are GREAT...but many aren't and I think when you have paid membership you have a right to expect something for your money. We don't bash for fun, but to encourage change...or at least we can hope for change...and can't do that on their own forum!

 

[beebreeder]

don't know whats going on if anything

 

[the naked beekeeper]

Lets see, a few posts baiting Brosville because he's an *****.

Do you care to clarify why you think that?
Or are you just into immature mud-slinging?

 

[Nellie]

Two threads about education that turned into the usual whinging about the BBKA

Silly question Nellie...but if the BBKA ( and yes, presently a member) was so brill - do you think so may would post negatively on here?

1 - No support locally
2 - No answers to questions posted on the other forum
3 - Attended a county show and ignored by all but 1 member
4 - No details on member contacts
5 - No info on location of association apiary
6 - No info on availablity of items for hire or price or how to hire
7 - One contact from alleged 'mentor' in 8 months

If they were great locally, I wouldn't bash/winge and I am sure some groups are GREAT...but many aren't and I think when you have paid membership you have a right to expect something for your money. We don't bash for fun, but to encourage change...or at least we can hope for change...and can't do that on their own forum!

Cant speak for other local associations as I've never been a member of any other than Bristol and I'm certainly not going to claim that Bristol is perfect by any stretch of the imagination but we strive to improve what we offer for the membership fee. Not especially happy to admit it but we're not too hot on one to one mentoring at the moment. As I'm presumably about a post away from getting banned for advertising something or other I'll not go into much more detail other than to say that I don't believe points 1 to 6 apply to Bristol Association though if you can find our forum you're doing well, it's even better hidden than the BBKA one.

The local association isn't the BBKA though so the bulk of your points appear to relate to the (lack of) support coming from your local association and I'll be honest and say I don't know what to suggest to affect a change at local level when there's apparently nothing being offered to begin with.

Membership of Bristol gives membership to the BBKA as part of the fee. Other than the insurance and the newsletter I'm not entirely sure what else you're supposed to get from the BBKA as a matter of course, I'm just a member of the BBKA, nothing more, and while they're run the way they are I'm not especially interested in getting any more involved with the BBKA than pushing our ADM reps to continue to push for change.

Exam workshops, examiners, apiary days, loan extractors, beginner's courses, summer day school/talks etc are all provided by Bristol/Avon Association rather than the BBKA. Far as I can gather the BBKA is supposed to represent the national interests of the local associations and by proxy their members but what do I know? I'm education officer not rep to the BBKA or actually that interested in the political makeup past not being too happy that they seem more intent on telling me what's good for me rather than listening to what we want from them.

Agree with you that if the local association is taking money for membership then they should be providing something for that money over and above sending you a BBKA membership card and leaving you to get on with it. There must be an AGM and if you're a member then I believe you should have voting rights in it. At the very least that does give you some avenue to at least voice your frustration with the existing incumbents. It's easy to say "get involved" and put yourself forward to the committee but it's also bloody hard work and I appreciate that a lot of people have neither the time nor the inclination to get involved in that way.

It's difficult to second guess and I'm obviously talking from a point of ignorance regarding your current situation but I do recognise and acknowledge the frustration, it's why I put myself into the role to begin with, I felt effectively abandoned during my first year and left to get on with it. To be fair to Bristol that was a situation that was recognised before I joined the committee and this year was vastly improved. We want to continue getting better especially for the new guys who do have pretty high expectations so we've got to continue to meet their needs whilst still catering for the next influx of potential new beekeepers.

 

[Nellie]

Do you care to clarify why you think that?
Or are you just into immature mud-slinging?

I thought immature mud slinging was the modus operandi around here.

I could post a reasoned explanation but I thought I'd just refer to him by an obviously "amusing" name and claim that his being spotted posting something seemingly useful and helpful was just a nefarious plan to achieve world domination with liberal sprinklings of exclamations marks and froth that'd make a daily mail journalist proud.

I'm assured by people who's opinions I respect that underneath the spittle and ranting there's actually a decent chap and beekeeper to be found, I'm obviously just unfortunate enough to generally get the ranty, shouty version instead.

 

[Hombre]

Veg & Hombre
I don't why you are doubting this.
My wife is part of Country Markets. You can not sell honey through them without a BBKA basic certificate. Fact.

Just for the record, I wasn't doubting anything, but questioning the actual relevance of a basic bee keeping certificate to a farmers market. More concern about product health & hygiene and product indemnity insurance is understandable.
As I originally mentioned, I do believe that there are bound to be quite a number of bee farmers that have run successful companies for many years and never taken a basic certificate examination. As the years have passed, then it will have become seemingly less relevant to them to do so. From what you are saying, then these established businessmen/bee farmers would be denied access to a farmers market to sell their produce. Or would a little sense prevail provided the relevant health & Hygiene certificates and current product indemnity insurance?

What exactly happens if the bee keeper was also an artisan brewer or a baker also selling his beer or bread alongside his honey? An interesting concept. I will seek to learn more about farmers' markets as I am not obviously aware of the rules.

= = =

Give us a lick of your lolly BroAndy, all this talk of money makes me dizzy. I noticed you being very kind to someone the other day, I hope you had a good season and the girls are all just about tucked up for the winter.

I almost missed the bun fight too. I should have booked ring side seats. Perhaps we could share a bag of popcorn at the next bash? Comfy seats of course.

Certainly no one seems short of an opinion or two on this thread of late, it's been a lively discussion..

Obviously you don't give a fig roll what I think, but it's one of the main reasons that I don't have much time any more for this forum.

The choice is yours of course, I'm sure that you'll be missed.

 

[Nellie]

We don't bash for fun, but to encourage change...or at least we can hope for change...and can't do that on their own forum!

Nuts, can't edit. If your local association doesn't have their own forum then can't you suggest they have a rep on here or the "other one" if they feel more comfortable using that site?

I've never personally considered asking to publicise any local association information on here because I'm not prepared to see the hard work of others subjected to the level of half truths, ridicule and spite that even the mere mention of BBKA brings forth. Some of you might consider that you bash to encourage change, for an awful lot of people though here it's a raison d'?e. And I'll ask who you're pushing change to? I'm not seeing many people standing up as a rep for a local association.

I've got no objection to valid criticism and for the most part when it comes to the BBKA you'll find me in agreement. I obviously can't say much about other local associations and have no remit to speak on behalf of Bristol Association directly but that doesn't stop me having an opinion or trying to help.

 

[Queens59]

Wish I could stand Nellie, apart from the obvious mentality of jobs for the boys around here, I am housebound and had to give up other committee work and charity/church events/responsibilities too.