Asian Hornet Presentation at National Honey Show

[rolande]

As a bit of a comparison of approaches:

 

[Karol]

As someone who unfortunately has to deal with asian hornets my best recommendations would be:

• catch, apply custard early on and release before they've built up.
• keep your colonies strong certainly from September onwards as late season is the worst time
• trap - any asian hornet taken out is a bonus
• make sure the entrance is too small for a hornet to get past should volumes be problematic

I didn't apply the custard early and have paid the price this season having lost 3 colonies. One in particular was very large and was my fault. Believing their sheer size to be sufficient to ward off any intruders I went on holiday for 10 days without putting in place an anti-hornet entrance. I came home to find hornets coming and going at will - I killed around 40'ish that evening at dusk - I was swatting too quick to count. The next day over 2.5 hours I killed 301 asian hornets which is by far the most I've ever had over a day. Once the message goes out that there's a free meal the pressure really piles on.

Fipronil custard will not work on a mature nest. Its whole premise is to kill the queen to stop the development of the nest before any sizeable brood is produced and most especially before any sexuals are set down (I was going to say laid but that would be a bit too Carry On!)

So FC needs to be deployed the instant VV shows its ugly head.

Usual caveat applies that such advice is aimed at the continent. Despite landfall this year the UK does not yet have an established infestation. We need to wait and see what 2024 brings.

 

[Karol]

Oh, I agree, there's no chance of the Govt. or their departments waking up fast enough to enable the use of the only really effective tool available, before the NBU are overwhelmed and AH here to stay.

Ask yourselves why VV hasn't spread further East on mainland Europe?

 

[Newbeeneil]

As a bit of a comparison of approaches:

I have to say I was not over impressed with the guy Bob Binnie was chatting to. I got the feeling he had never listened to anyone involved in the attempted eradication in Europe.

 

[Rob H]

In case people havent seen it, Nigel Semmence's presentation from the National Honey Show 2023 on what the situation was at the end of October is up on youtube -

I found Nigel to be quite arrogant in his delivery at times and really quite aggressive towards one or two of the questioners. I got the distinct impression he really didnt want to be there.

 

[ericbeaumont]

really quite aggressive towards one or two of the questioners

I'd look at it more kindly: he was ragged after 40 minutes on his feet and like a honey bee, defensive rather than aggressive.

 

[madasafish]

The Government will undoubtedly change in the next 13 months. So another new Environment Secretary to replace the current new one.
SO expect no political advice till 2025 .Nor any new thinking or money..(if you do, you are naive).

So DIY is king. I have already stated my views elsewhere: anyone relying on sensible guidance is going to wait till 2026 at the earliest.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

unfortunately Eric that doesn't fit with the legislation in place, whether one agrees with this or not .I doubt there will ever be any 'official' use or recommendation of the custard method. As it stands, It would acknowledge off label use of pesticides, something that no government agency would legally be allowed to support. firstly, its not a approved formulation and would require the mixing of an additional protein solution to the fipronil, something very rarely licensed for over the counter medicines (general public cant be trusted to follow basic instructions, but could be licensed to approved pest controllers possibly). Secondly why would a company be bothered to go through the effort of generating expensive stability and efficacy data, plus the cost of the new formulation application when there are recipes to be found on line anyone can use unofficially. Its not for DEFRA, VMD, etc., to propose new medicines / formulations,; they just review what is put in front of them. Whilst data in the public domain may be indicative, I doubt on its own it would be suitable for a license application. Thirdly, catch and release is against the law for non native species. applies equally for AH, signal crayfish or grey squirrel and loads others unless under license from the government.


Despite the extensive work from the inspectors, it very much feels like we are being left to sort this out as beekeepers ourselves if we are to provide some sort of control.

#mazzamazda

Looking at the situation regarding the fipronil custard realistically. If a beekeeper catches an AH, applies the dose and releases the weaponised hornet. Unless he/she are observed in the action by someone disagreeing with the method or tells the world there's a zero chance of detection. A hornet going back to its nest doesn't leave an exhaust trail like a missile so source unidentifiable. The custard dose is delivered, the colony distributes it among the occupants who then die.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Ask yourselves why VV hasn't spread further East on mainland Europe?

Climate may slow it's progress elsewhere but I doubt it will prevent it enjoying Southern England.

 

[Erichalfbee]

So DIY is king

Yep
A method is in the stickies.

 

[ericbeaumont]

whether policy inactivity ... will make the the outcome significantly worse that it could have been

expect no political advice till 2025 .Nor any new thinking or money

Heard a contrasting story while on the phone to a Welsh engineering firm, in which political will and practical determination achieved rapid resolution: during the Second World War a delay in resolving an engineering issue with Spitfire parts was dragging, so on the Friday Churchill phoned the company, growled at them and by Monday morning the problem had been resolved.

No politician with Churchillian growl roams Whitehall today, but we are at war.

 

[Mint Bee]

Looking at the situation regarding the fipronil custard realistically. If a beekeeper catches an AH, applies the dose and releases the weaponised hornet. Unless he/she are observed in the action by someone disagreeing with the method or tells the world there's a zero chance of detection. A hornet going back to its nest doesn't leave an exhaust trail like a missile so source unidentifiable. The custard dose is delivered, the colony distributes it among the occupants who then die.

totally agree. Its a bugger's muddle so its going to be left to individuals to do what they feel they need to do

 

[OldFarm]

Looking at the situation regarding the fipronil custard realistically. If a beekeeper catches an AH, applies the dose and releases the weaponised hornet. Unless he/she are observed in the action by someone disagreeing with the method or tells the world there's a zero chance of detection. A hornet going back to its nest doesn't leave an exhaust trail like a missile so source unidentifiable. The custard dose is delivered, the colony distributes it among the occupants who then die.

You don't have to catch them to apply the custard. They will continue to feed while you dab them.

 

[Newbeeneil]

I found Nigel to be quite arrogant in his delivery at times and really quite aggressive towards one or two of the questioners. I got the distinct impression he really didnt want to be there.

I was at the talk at the NHS and my impression was that Nigel would have loved to have elaborated on many points but was restricted by Policy and lack of results from scientific DNA analysis.
I thought his overall talk was informative.

 

[rolande]

No politician with Churchillian growl roams Whitehall today, but we are at war.

I'm tempted to stand as an independent next time around, I certainly couldn't be less effectual than our current chap.

 

[Moobee]

Just like generic Oxalic

whatever that is.....

 

[JamezF]

whatever that is.....

Hive woodwork cleaner...

James

 

[Karol]

Climate may slow it's progress elsewhere but I doubt it will prevent it enjoying Southern England.

As far as I'm aware we have not had confirmation of surviving mated foundresses from UK nests. As far as I'm aware we have also not had confirmation of sexuals being released in the UK (unless I've missed that piece of news). It's not just climate it's also topography which between the two dictate ecology and therefore sustainability and furthermore replication (which is distinct from reproduction). Low replication rates mean low survival.

It is interesting but not surprising that in Portugal and Spain, VV hugs coastal areas simply because there is sufficient abundance of protein along the shoreline to support reproduction and that abundance wanes inland.

We will always be at risk from outbreaks for as long as there is a seed population on the continent. Provided the number of outbreak nests remains at a low level, the NBU should be able to stay on top of things. If and when the NBU become overwhelmed then there is an elimination strategy which is not unlawful provided that relevant laws are not transgressed. So for example, pest controllers would not legally be allowed to provide such a service but beekeepers privately cannot be prohibited from off label use provided that hives/bees are not treated directly (usual caveats apply that thete is no justification for using the strategy in the UK at present and anyone doing so does so at their own personal jeopardy).

 

[Karol]

Just like generic Oxalic

Respectfully I'd have to disagree on two grounds. Firstly there are licensed equivalents so there is no mitigation for using an unlicensed uncontrolled product. Secondly, OA is used to treat honeybee infestations and therefore falls under the VMR.

There is no licensed equivalent to FC and it's used on a pest which does not fall within the scope of the VMR.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Respectfully I'd have to disagree on two grounds

I meant that just as generic oxalic is used with disregard for the "law" so will FC be once/if beekeepers are left to fight on their own