Latest snake-oil varroa treatment pretending not to be a varroa treatment

[Boston Bees]

Hi Guys, I put varroa strips (al la Scientiffic Beekeepong) in all three colonies this year and skipped the Jan vape. So far so good - all flying today.

The varroa strips were the only treatment you did over summer/autumn?

Where did you get them from?

 

[BugsInABox]

https://www.abelo.co.uk/shop/varroa-control/oxalic-acid-strips/

 

[Erichalfbee]

Some people rave about these. I don’t think they are that effective and I wouldn’t use them as my autumn treatment
It might be a good idea to do a sugar roll or alcohol wash at your first inspection. I certainly would.

 

[BugsInABox]

Some people rave about these. I don’t think they are that effective and I wouldn’t use them as my autumn treatment
It might be a good idea to do a sugar roll or alcohol wash at your first inspection. I certainly would.

That's the plan, I'll update.

 

[Erichalfbee]

That's the plan, I'll update.

Let us know what you find?

 

[BugsInABox]

Will do; meanwhile this is Randy's 2018 research. Pretty sure we've been over it here before.

https://scientificbeekeeping.com/extended-release-oxalic-acid-progress-report-4/

 

[BugsInABox]

And this his teaser from his newletter I subscribe to. (sad news about the tumour )::

Update on extended-release oxalic acid (OAE)
I've also completed further testing on extended-release oxalic acid, which I'll be posting soon. ABJ asks me to wait for two months after publication to post, so if you're eager, subscribe to the Journal.

Preview summary of my findings to date
1. For full efficacy of OAE with pads laid across the top bars between the brood chambers, it takes the equivalent surface area of one Swedish sponge -- roughly 55 sq in (355 cm2), holding 50 g of OA dissolved in 50 g of glycerin.
We prefer the 1:1 OA:gly ratio, but New Zealanders typically use a 1:1.5 ratio, and the Argentinians use 1:25 (which I find messy to handle, and causing disruption of the colony).
2. The pads must be placed so that bees walk over them – not under a hive cover. A shim between the brood chambers may help.
3. For cardboard strips hung over the frames, it (surprisingly) requires more surface area (80-115 sq in/ 520 – 740 cm2) per double-deep hive.
4. We don’t yet know whether it helps to divide the matrix, but got good results last year with it divided into two pieces.
5. Maximizer pads are a lower-cost alternative to Swedish sponges, and are a bit easier to scrape off the top bars after treatment.
6. The optimal treatment window for OAE may be application when you put on honey supers (May or June), with removal in August. It takes 60-70 days to obtain full efficacy, and efficacy is better when there is little mite drift from highly-infested colonies (including ferals).
Disclaimer: This application method is not yet approved in the U.S., and I do not in any way encourage unpermitted use!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Some people rave about these

And quite a few have been caught out by depending on them as their sole method of varroa control

 

[BugsInABox]

And quite a few have been caught out by depending on them as their sole method of varroa control

I dont recall that - though I have been absent from these parts for a few months
I have a vap as back up and will do some rolls as soon as I can get in. Just hope they survive that long.

 

[Boston Bees]

Will do; meanwhile this is Randy's 2018 research. Pretty sure we've been over it here before.

https://scientificbeekeeping.com/extended-release-oxalic-acid-progress-report-4/

But ... has Randy ever tried applying the OA in a form like these strips that just sit on the frame top-bars? I don't think he has. So not sure you should read across his results to what these strips will do?

 

[Boston Bees]

I dont recall that - though I have been absent from these parts for a few months
I have a vap as back up and will do some rolls as soon as I can get in. Just hope they survive that long.

What caused my colonies to fail? | Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum (beekeepingforum.co.uk)

 

[Mint Bee]

Disclaimer: This application method is not yet approved in the U.S., and I do not in any way encourage unpermitted use!

from Abelo's website - Oxaclic acid strips are not intended for use when bees are located within the hive.

so you have just told everyone that you have used an unlicensed treatment in your hives, against the instructions from the vendor. good work all round

 

[BugsInABox]

so you have just told everyone that you have used an unlicensed treatment in your hives, against the instructions from the vendor. good work all round

mmm, and you have just underlined it - very clever and ta very much (as they say in yorkshire) .
I have also: parked on double yellow lines; used a human generic of a topical vetinary medicine on a cat (and vice versa); had sex in a public place (though not recently sadly); fished without a licence; used the hoover after 6PM; flown a kite in a park; oh and used a fake name on the internet.
As a Welshman I have also on multiple occasions dodged the noose by being within the walls of Chester after dusk. (or is this urban myth)
I have 3 top bar hives and keep the honey for personal (and family) consumption.
I'll not loose sleep; but it would be nice to be able to have a conversation about this interesting topic without legal debates which end up spiralling into sophism.

 

[BugsInABox]

What caused my colonies to fail? | Beekeeping & Apiculture Forum (beekeepingforum.co.uk)

Thank's Boston,
Last year attitudes here to the strips seemed more neutral - as Dani hints. Is the view forming here that it's the Abelo formulation or that Randy's findings shouldn't be generalised? I'll definately let you know my intial figures.
Neil

 

[Boston Bees]

Thank's Boston,
Last year attitudes here to the strips seemed more neutral - as Dani hints. Is the view forming here that it's the Abelo formulation or that Randy's findings shouldn't be generalised? I'll definately let you know my intial figures.
Neil

I have no view on Randy's findings.

But he uses radically different (and much more direct) methods of applying the OA than these strips. So I would be very nervous of reading his results across to these strips.

To slightly exaggerate, if Randy's OA application methods are equivalent to a Covid vaccine shot into your arm, these strips seem more analogous to resting the vaccine syringe gently on top of your head, and hoping that the vaccine somehow finds its way into you .... I am being slightly flippant, but hopefully you see my point.

 

[BugsInABox]

But ... has Randy ever tried applying the OA in a form like these strips that just sit on the frame top-bars? I don't think he has. So not sure you should read across his results to what these strips will do?

This an image form his trial. Though the Abelo's strips lend themselves to being hung over the top bars. So yes, it is different. But maybe more like a vaccine injected in the leg rather than the arm?

 

[Boston Bees]

This an image form his trial. Though the Abelo's strips lend themselves to being hung over the top bars. So yes, it is different. But maybe more like a vaccine injected in the leg rather than the arm?
View attachment 30700

That looks like a vastly larger surface area of application product to me.

Is the chemical make-up even the same?

Have you queried why Randy doesn't apply it in thin solid strips laid across the top bars. He could easily have done so. I suspect there's a reason.

 

[BugsInABox]

That looks like a vastly larger surface area of application product to me.

Is the chemical make-up even the same?

Have you queried why Randy doesn't apply it in thin solid strips laid across the top bars. He could easily have done so. I suspect there's a reason.

Yes, fair enough.

 

[Erichalfbee]

At least with the shop towels the bees remove the material so do have intimate contact with the material. I have tried the Abelo strips a few times. Mostly they were left alone. One colony threw them out in large pieces.
I seem to recall that with Randy the towels worked in some areas but not in others

 

[Mint Bee]

Bugs, you obviously lead an interesting and law breaking life

I didn't say there was any sanity in the law (in general) and availability of licensed OA products. it is was it is until someone with more money that sense decides to get a generic license for pure OA authorised. If you are happy putting any old crap into your hives and supplying honey to friends and family then fill your boots. With 3 hives to treat that really is tight to avoid spending the money on one of the approved treatments. As they also say in Yorkshire, I believe, nowt so queer as folk