Hives in gardens

[nosmoking]

And the question was?

 

[Winker]

That is different to what my doctor told me - so which "expert" is right.

If someone is in trouble, we call 999, are told emergency services are 10 mins away so we should use the epipen we would. What absolute nutters eh.

Maybe you should get a new doctor your old doctor Harold Shipman no longer practices

 

[victor meldrew]

Maybe you should get a new doctor your old doctor Harold Shipman no longer practices

Methinks you've mis-spelled your Nic? the first vowel should have been THE first vowel
VM

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

And the question was?

Would like to start beekeeping next year.
Looking to place hives in friends garden as the wife wont let me keep them in ours.
One side have children but dont mind them being there.
The garden is 60 foot long be 22 and has tall hedges on two sides.
Would like members opinions on the pros and cons of keeping bees in urban gardens.
Thanks

Let's help Dave out shall we - he's had the sense to canvass opinion on this website so shall we stick to the thread.
The use of epipiens is a good subject for discussion but let's do it on another post

 

[chickendave]

Let's help Dave out shall we - he's had the sense to canvass opinion on this website so shall we stick to the thread.
The use of epipiens is a good subject for discussion but let's do it on another post

Dave I would sugest you keep the garden apiary but also find a out apiary about three miles from the garden one
This will enable you to move your bees without any trouble and be totally flexible in whatever you need to do with the bees

 

[madasafish]

Dave
I have 6 hives in our garden. It's half an acre so a bit bigger .. bees are approx 5 metres from nearest part of our house.
I started two years ago.


1. I asked our neighbours first.. and promised them honey - eventually. They got some this year.
2. Hedges and trees between neighbours force bees to fly UP.
3. A pond with nice green water plus lots of mossy banks and gravel which is damp means bees drink in our garden . Neighbours do not have a pond or swimming pool.
4. I have good tempered bees. Even when queenless earlier this year very good tempered.
5. I use TBHs and warres: far less problems of angry bees when inspecting than our BBKA apiary.
6. Only inspect in good weather.
7. Stop inspecting at once if bad tempered.
8. Explained to neighbours about swarms: enlist their help in finding them!
9. Neighbours have grandchildren. Invite them round to look on a very quiet and warm day. (Taking care to keep them at back of hives away from bee flight paths).

 

[Gardenbees]

Would like to start beekeeping next year.
Looking to place hives in friends garden as the wife wont let me keep them in ours.
One side have children but dont mind them being there.
The garden is 60 foot long be 22 and has tall hedges on two sides.
Would like members opinions on the pros and cons of keeping bees in urban gardens.
Thanks

Well, I keep bees in an urban garden. If you can get away with it I highly recommend it: some of the best honey comes from urban areas, which may offer a wider range of nectar sources, a longer foraging season, less mass use of insecticides, and good shelter. I say "may" because none of these are guaranteed, but as a general rule the bees themselves can make a good living in urban areas, esp. ones with lots of gardens, wasteground with unsprayed weeds, railway line verges and so forth. It's also nice to be able to get out to my bees often and spend plenty of time observing them. It is a hobby after all, and they are great to watch.

As you'll gather, the more experienced beeks on the Forum tend on the whole to be more cautious about bees in gardens, because the drawbacks are often revealed some way down the line. Hence my saying "if you can get away with it". You ideally need supportive neighbours, a big garden, some strategic flight barriers (the tall hedges might help) and of course some decent forage for the bees. People tend to start with nucs or small colonies, which are less defensive and easier to handle. It takes a year or more for them to build up into a really big spring or summer colony, during which time their temper can change completely, sometimes without much warning, either due to temporary factors or long-term until a new queen takes over. Even just a week or so with no decent nectar flow can result in a very much more defensive colony, especially if there's a lot of them.

A really big, defensive colony with a serious grudge can render a 60-ft garden almost unbearable to live in without protective wear... the guard bees who normally don't venture more than a few inches from the hive entrance will patrol much further if they feel the hive is seriously threatened. I have a 140 ft garden, but when one of my colonies lost its temper last spring a few bees persistently followed me right up to the house, and waited in the garden for when I, or my dog, emerged. They kept this up for a week, then settled down and have been quite docile ever since. If I was unlucky they could have kept this up for a lot longer - and they are no respecter of garden boundaries. Their memory and range are quite impressive! The worst case of bad-tempered bees I have ever seen was a colony rising up and chasing a beekeeper the full length of a medium-sized field, then hassling his car as he drove away, so I'm afraid few gardens are proof against problems if a colony really sets out to chase people off. Fortunately this is rare - but, given that in the worst case scenario people can actually die from bee stings, it has to be considered.

Having said all that, my garden bees have given me a lot of pleasure, and the neighbours have been interested and supportive and greatly appreciative of the nice honey. If you take all the usual precautions: careful handling, thoughtful timing of operations, good choice of colony, swift replacement of unsuitable queens and at least one back-up location if you need to make a sudden move, then I would recommend bees for a large garden. Just keep it to a couple of colonies to start off with, and avail yourself of other peoples' experience. One visit from an experienced beek or Bee Inspector can do a lot to smooth out worries and teach the best way of handling bees - which is half the battle when it comes to living peaceably alongside them.

PS - plus, all the stuff wot Madasafish just wrote! (cross-posted!)

 

[Winker]

Methinks you've mis-spelled your Nic? the first vowel should have been THE first vowel
VM

Rage?

My oh my. Some people just cant have a adult conversation without resorting to insults i guess.

 

[bob777]

My garden is about the same size as yours I just set my hive up the neighbours didnt notice for about a month when they saw me in my suit,,, You could always tell then that your going to keep rats see what there response is, Go for the bees!!!

 

[Heather]

I keep 9 colonies in my garden-5 one end, 4 the other. Neighbours who know are very supportive- only one of them ever gets a swarm - she just phones to tell me (if I hadn't realised)- she gets a jar of honey. No-one complains -

They are facing high hedges and fly up and away- Don't even see many in my garden- except drinking on the pond.

 

[user 6228]

Dave
I have 6 hives in our garden. It's half an acre so a bit bigger .. bees are approx 5 metres from nearest part of our house.
I started two years ago.


1. I asked our neighbours first.. and promised them honey - eventually. They got some this year.
2. Hedges and trees between neighbours force bees to fly UP.
3. A pond with nice green water plus lots of mossy banks and gravel which is damp means bees drink in our garden . Neighbours do not have a pond or swimming pool.
4. I have good tempered bees. Even when queenless earlier this year very good tempered.
5. I use TBHs and warres: far less problems of angry bees when inspecting than our BBKA apiary.
6. Only inspect in good weather.
7. Stop inspecting at once if bad tempered.
8. Explained to neighbours about swarms: enlist their help in finding them!
9. Neighbours have grandchildren. Invite them round to look on a very quiet and warm day. (Taking care to keep them at back of hives away from bee flight paths).

Can i add
"if bad tempered leave for a week"
"don't split the inspection over two days"
"have portable screening (hurdles, fence panel) available to stop tetchy bees bees seeing movement.

 

[CB008]

An excellent and balanced view which I would endorse. I have 4 hives in a large garden but I am aware that they can turn nasty when you least expect it. The huge benefit of having a home apiary is that you are able to spend so much more time observing their hehaviour which can make it a more rewarding experience. I fotunately only have one neighbour but, as they have a 6 year old, if mine turn nasty then I would have to deal with that immediately.

 

[victor meldrew]

Sound reasoning
It is possible to keep bees at home ,hundreds do and successfully
The thing to keep firmly in mind is ' your neighbours have the right to enjoyment of their garden just as much as yourself'
Should your activities cause upset,it is expedient to take all precautions as per previous post but if problems escalate; be prepared to move your bees from the area . Putting yourself on a war footing will ensure a war, which will benefit neither party and loose previously good friends !
I have previously posted on the proximity of my bees to stables ,however if circumstances change such as a young spirited horse ,tearing around the paddock attracting the unwanted attention of my bees then getting stung , I would move bees bees without argument , the point being, although the changes would have been none of my doing , the horse is within its' paddock and my bees the aggressors?
VM

 

[Gardenbees]

Sound reasoning
It is possible to keep bees at home ,hundreds do and successfully
The thing to keep firmly in mind is ' your neighbours have the right to enjoyment of their garden just as much as yourself'
Should your activities cause upset,it is expedient to take all precautions as per previous post but if problems escalate; be prepared to move your bees from the area . Putting yourself on a war footing will ensure a war, which will benefit neither party and loose previously good friends !
I have previously posted on the proximity of my bees to stables ,however if circumstances change such as a young spirited horse ,tearing around the paddock attracting the unwanted attention of my bees then getting stung , I would move bees bees without argument , the point being, although the changes would have been none of my doing , the horse is within its' paddock and my bees the aggressors?
VM

Voice of reason.

 

[greatbritishhoney]

Sound reasoning
It is possible to keep bees at home ,hundreds do and successfully
The thing to keep firmly in mind is ' your neighbours have the right to enjoyment of their garden just as much as yourself'
Should your activities cause upset,it is expedient to take all precautions as per previous post but if problems escalate; be prepared to move your bees from the area . Putting yourself on a war footing will ensure a war, which will benefit neither party and loose previously good friends !
I have previously posted on the proximity of my bees to stables ,however if circumstances change such as a young spirited horse ,tearing around the paddock attracting the unwanted attention of my bees then getting stung , I would move bees bees without argument , the point being, although the changes would have been none of my doing , the horse is within its' paddock and my bees the aggressors?
VM

 

[Elaine]

An excellent and balanced view which I would endorse. I have 4 hives in a large garden but I am aware that they can turn nasty when you least expect it. The huge benefit of having a home apiary is that you are able to spend so much more time observing their hehaviour which can make it a more rewarding experience. I fotunately only have one neighbour but, as they have a 6 year old, if mine turn nasty then I would have to deal with that immediately.

I agree - it's great to be able to sit in the garden just watching them coming and going. It also has the advantage that inspection time can be easily altered - or if they don't want to play, you can just walk away and come back later without having made any great effort to drive out to the apiary.

 

[andycadman]

At last some reasoned and sensible points of view.
With regard to keeping bees in your garden this forum has really scared me to death at times, in amongst all the excellent advice given on all other aspects of beekeeping.
I kept bees in a secondary school safely for seventeen years in the seventies and eighties. Five to six hives plus nucleus boxes behind appropriate fencing and barriers. The boys and girls wandered daily within several feet of the hives to observe goats, pigs, calves and sheep (as well as the bees) on daily basis throughout the year. In all that time I only had one pupil stung outside the apiary.
I started to keep bees again in my garden three years ago. Then seeing some of the posts relating to bees in gardens on this forum, it really worried me. I thought bees had changed temperament wise in the intervening period. So much so, that I am in the early stages of starting and out apiary. Probably quite sensible anyway.
Bees are wild animals, must be treated with respect and sited in an appropriate place.

 

[thorn]

Nuisance for starters followed by damages (No win no fee!)
VM

I'm a solicitor specialising in accident/injury claims and can assure you that a successful action for damages by a stingee would be highly unlikely simply because you have a hive in your garden. He'd have to show you were somehow negligent in your handling of the bees, and that the act of negligence led to his getting stung, which would not be easy. And as we "no-win, no-fee" boys need a very much better than evens chance of success before we take a case on, the person stung probably won't even find a lawyer to write a letter of claim for him. You can ignore what the insurance companies' press agents keep getting published in the Daily Mail about silly claims. We don't like working for nothing, and the judges aren't any softer now than they were when I started in this game in 1966.
In all my years of practice I've never been consulted by someone who's been stung by a bee, nor come across a case of a successful claim either in practice or in the case books. That's why I'm happy to keep bees in my garden.

 

[user 6228]

....
Bees are wild animals, must be treated with respect and sited in an appropriate place.

All animals should be respected , a lot of people do not respect the animal behavior of those in their care and thoughtlessly abuse them, often out of kindness.
For example. In side every toy yorkshire terrier is a pack hunting animal who needs to know exactly where it is in the pack hierarchy to avoid stress. Changing its order of precedence in its pack,your family, on a daily whim, is going to cause trouble on a comparable scale to mucking up bees, with children being savaged by someones "pet".

 

[Swarm]

I understand your concern andycadman regarding sensationalised posts.

I still have hives in the garden, even though I posted earlier that I am gradually moving them to out apiaries. I doubt they will all go and my neighbours have never complained even when one hive decided to swarm anyway, after I did an AS earlier that day. That was May bank holiday weekend and they had friends over for a barbeque. When I got home, they came and told me how the bees passed, swirling overhead as they all 'ran for their lives' and watched where they collected in the garden next door to them. They had a laugh about it, I apologised for spoiling their party and then went to remove the swarm. They were nice enough but I bet they were thinking 'BLOODY BEES!!!' at the time.
I had one or two followers earlier this year, just the one hive which had superseded. It's not a nice experience and I can imagine it would be a bit of a scare for most people because unlike a wasp, you can't get rid of them unless you kill it or it stings you. After taking a direct hit (no warning buzz) to my forehead, some 40 yards from the hive, it got me thinking back to that barbeque in May. As VM pointed out ... your neighbours have the right to enjoy their garden as well ... and the girl next door has suited up twice, for an inspection and to help collect a swarm. I would hate to see them stung by my bees so I will probably reduce to a single hive and bring on nucs at home and have my hives in places they can do no harm. It makes sense in the long run as we all know how hives seem to increase in numbers.

Back to the worrying posts, I'd say they were the worst case scenarios. Probably far more positive experiences than negative.