Why say NO to doing a course?

[Poly Hive]

I am dredging my head here for what I taught in the Aberdeenshire area evening classes.

Bee races and Hives

An over view of the year.

Caste development table and basic manipulations

Hive types and the pros and cons

Disease

Swarming

Wax

Heather

Overall recap

Practical wax night.

PH

 

[victor meldrew]

Land lady @ my local was complaining about the bar staff not having the basics !
Apparently the previous evening the tills went down (damned computers)
The staff on duty couldn't perform simple arithmetic, which left her running around like a blue a*sed fly . When asked if they had ever learned their times tables they responded with blank stares ! Er What times tables?
Off topic yes but illustrates the need for a grasp of the basics in most situations?

John Wilkinson

 

[BBG]

:

He has been (and still is) the best source of information i have come accross!

Really nice man who educates as he speaks.

 

[darren64]

You mean the people who give knowledge, help and lots of time for no payment just because they love beekeeping and wish to help others.
I'm not one of them btw, but I am very grateful to the self important know it alls who taught me.

the very same know it alls that are only too happy to help when I ring them.

 

[BBG]

In addition

Ref the ongoing courses National Diploma etc etc - who has the time to devote to this length of study, which can stretch over seven years!

I ask questions of experienced beekeepers that they are unable to answer. It doesn't make them bad beekeepers, they deal with their bees daily and have done for many years, decades in many instances AND their bees thrive.

I believe it builds an elitist system where the need for such erudition doesn't exist but leaves good, concerned beekeepers thinking they are inadequate.

 

[victor meldrew]

Chasing certificates don't impress me none however a little quality education goes a long way .
I got the basic certificate after 20 years beekeeping , to please the education officer at the time .
I also passed modules one and two . That's as far as I went ,I realised that progressing beyond would merely be for the hell of it rather than fulfilling a practical purpose in my case or any one else s unless intending to do research work!
There is another route (Bee husbandry which is more practical, hands on) this has the added advantage in supplying a pool of tutors up to the job as it were !
The basic exam requires assessors to hold this certification !

John Wilkinson

 

[Headnavigator]

Ref the ongoing courses National Diploma etc etc - who has the time to devote to this length of study, which can stretch over seven years!

I ask questions of experienced beekeepers that they are unable to answer. It doesn't make them bad beekeepers, they deal with their bees daily and have done for many years, decades in many instances AND their bees thrive.

I believe it builds an elitist system where the need for such erudition doesn't exist but leaves good, concerned beekeepers thinking they are inadequate.

we've got learning all a bit skewed ever since some xxxxx managed to convince us all that a degree was of more value than an apprenticeship, when both have their place.

 

[Poly Hive]

Mine went like this.

did the Scottish Beekeepers Asspciation Beemaster first..= basic down here.

Then sat the Expert, three hour paper, visit to apairy and examination of extraction kit. Went thus...

Sat paper.

visit to bees took five mins... visit for kit took one min then jealous examination of the honey house...lol Oh yes and passed by the way.

PH

 

[Adam]

I understand the 'basic' exam is a pre-requisite for further modules. If I am correct, it is a waste of time, effort and space for many out there! Jobsworth comes to mind.

Rubbish. In my view, for both the benefit of candidates and examiners, having at least have a basic understanding of beekeeping before they submit the exams saves much difficulty and disappointment. People who have no practical experience at all, can hardly write descriptive answers on artificial swarming etc. The basic is not particularly taxing and ensures that candidates have some actual experience.

Otherwise it's a waste of time for candidates, and those marking the papers.

Adam

 

[oliver90owner]

Are you saying it is not a prerequisite to have passed the basic exam before being allowed to take further modules?

Because if you are, I am relieved, and if you do need to pass that basic exam first, then what you just wrote is a right load of twaddle.

Which is it?

RAB

 

[region2]

There is a flowchart thing on the BBKA website but I can no longer find it under the new design!

R2

 

[viridens]

The original question was "How come so many new, or relatively new, beekeepers seem reluctant to go on a course?"

Surely for the majority of keepers, especially beginners, beekeeping is a hobby and not a vocation.
Courses are available for other hobbies such as gardening, photography, home brewing etc. all of which have their own skills, problems and dangers.
How many bother with courses before taking up these hobbies?
Why should beekeeping courses be better attended than these others?

 

[psafloyd]

Rubbish. In my view, for both the benefit of candidates and examiners, having at least have a basic understanding of beekeeping before they submit the exams saves much difficulty and disappointment. People who have no practical experience at all, can hardly write descriptive answers on artificial swarming etc. The basic is not particularly taxing and ensures that candidates have some actual experience.

Otherwise it's a waste of time for candidates, and those marking the papers.

Adam

Nonsense yourself, Adam. I could quite easily have sat (and probably passed) the basic from the reading I have done alone, citing different versions, reasons for differences, etc.

But I completely agree with you it would serve little purpose, except to collect a certificate.

The reason why it was recommended I didn't sit it was so I did have more practical experience to back it up.

Most BKA training courses are designed t provide new beeks with a basic level of competence.

I have been amazed at how little some have read on the Capital Bee course and am amazed at their ignorance on basic matters.

 

[Easy Beesy]

There are good and bad courses just as there are good and bad beekeepers. Some people learn by doing, some by reading, some by attending courses - best is to do all three really. New beekeepers always want answers to questions NOW, not options to make their own decisions. when do I?, what do I?, what do I do now?, Why? are all questions that CANNOT BE ANSWERED WITHOUT BACKGROUND INFORMATION, and the answers often depend on what you want the outcome to be. Thats why there is a sticky! As tutors we try to get you to think - work it out from the information you have to suit your circumstances. Of course 2 beekeepers will give you different opinions/answers - you're lucky you didn't get 5 answers. We all keep bees under different circumstances but the basics are the same, is the point - apiary and hive hygiene, bee nutrition, disease monitoring, swarm management. Most tutors are giving of their time freely, and are beekeepers, not teachers - this is a hobby remember - they don't have the time to checkout 5 different types of hive, run tbhs and omlets along with nationals, try every type of chemical or non-chemical treatment and study enough to answer every question posed by the novice who has read everything up to and including the latest scientifc paper or the 'instant-gratification' brigade who can't even be bothered to find out 'what's the difference between pollen and honey' or the recent boast, 'I've kept bees for 3 years and never seen eggs, does it matter?'.

Sorry for the long post, but as a rule of thumb, if you find yousrlf asking a question that is received with derision or sarcasm, or is answered by 20 members calling themselves "new bees" then take it that you need some education; whatever way you find it is your call.

 

[peterbees]

We encourage members to take the Basic Assessment a few years after completing our beginners' course. One major benefit is that it encourages candidates to learn about bee diseases. Most of our beekeepers have no personal experience of foul brood, (We've had three cases in the last 25 years in our patch) but if they are taking the Basic they have to learn how to recognise EFB and AFB and the other diseases.
Peter, C*nwy BKA, North Wales.

 

[tonybloke]

Nonsense yourself, Adam. I could quite easily have sat (and probably passed) the basic from the reading I have done alone, citing different versions, reasons for differences, etc.

But I completely agree with you it would serve little purpose, except to collect a certificate.

The reason why it was recommended I didn't sit it was so I did have more practical experience to back it up.

Most BKA training courses are designed t provide new beeks with a basic level of competence.

I have been amazed at how little some have read on the Capital Bee course and am amazed at their ignorance on basic matters.

you don't 'sit' an exam when doing the 'basic', you have to actually go through a hive of bees, and describe what you see, etc.
mostly a practical exam, which wouldn't be possible from book / forum learning alone ( hence the req. to have bees for at least a complete year)

 

[For want of a better word]

Many people, myself included, have had a gutsfull of formal education, set syllabus', exams etc. and are wary of commities, associations and self important know-it-alls who tend to come to the fore in local bka's

Now a FREE PRACTICAL session at your local beekeeping club (associated to any national society or not) is not a bad idea!

Let's all re-invent the wheel and decide what colour to paint it!!

and by the way I have suffered so many freshers with 3 A levels at grade A who are then blinded to learning anything else as they have already "done that" !!!


But then who am I to say?

 

[oliver90owner]

Yes, Tony, but is it or is it not a pre-requisite to have this qualification before being accepted for 'higher' level modules?

I don't seem to be able to get a definitive response from those that should know, just a typical politician-type 'avoidance' reply. If I am correct I think it is just 'jobsworth' on the part of the organisers.

Regards, RAB

 

[Silvercleave]

Icanhopit
Surely FREE PRACTICAL is available at most if not all bee clubs?

 

[tonybloke]

Yes, Tony, but is is or is it not a pre-requisite to have this qualification before being accepted for 'higher' level modules?

I don't seem to be able to get a definitive response from those that should know, just a typical politician-type 'avoidance' reply. If I am correct I think it is just 'jobsworth' on the part of the organisers.

Regards, RAB

I was told it is a pre-requisite to have the 'basic' before taking any of the modules.
I've got the Basic, and would recommend all beekeepers to take part, no writing involved, just a practical demonstration of basic knowledge, followed by a question & answer session ( or are they scared?)