Paper re allergy and immunotherapy

[Sutty]

I did a quick calculation regarding stings. I only tend to use a jacket and nitrile gloves and I have quite a few iffy colonies so I reckon I get stung on average 5 times a day for the 4 days I do the bees. Say I only do it for 6 months a year so 20 stings/week x 26 weeks so approx 500 stings/year. ...... do we thing that's a good or bad thing..... btw I get very little reaction to stings.

Probably protective against systemic reactions from those papers.
You probably get a few winter stings while checking for stores or adding fondant etc too.

 

[Hedgerow Honey]

I'm on chemo and biologic immune suppressants.
First few stings of the year can be a nightmare, but gradually any reaction reduces as the season progresses. I did get floored in March 21, throat went tight, dizzy etc, yet following week no reaction whatsoever.
I do now have four Epipens with us at all times.
I have taken stings from around age five with no real issues until the chemo drug was added to my prescription last year.

 

[madasafish]

I'm surprised more than one member knows what a Gom Jabbar is, or is that as a result of the success of the recent movie .

Some of us were very keen SF readers in our youth.. (I refer to books - long before any film)

 

[JamezF]

Some of us were very keen SF readers in our youth.. (I refer to books - long before any film)

I always have been, particular highlights from my teens being the likes of "Stranger In A Strange Land", "Ringworld", Asimov's "Robots and Empire" series and of course the "Dune" series. "The Fountains Of Paradise" is another of my all-time favourites. These days it seems harder to find writing I like though. Most recently I read "The Three Body Problem" by Lui Cixin and whilst the concept was fascinating, it needed serious editing as far as I'm concerned. Some of Peter F Hamilton's work is ok, but still doesn't leave me with the feeling that reading it was time very well spent.

James

 

[Erichalfbee]

I'll add Stephen R Donaldson's Chronicles of Thomas Covenant to those. His Gap series was a bit too much for me though.
Much SF is now very samey and I've exhausted the Fantasy genre too, so it's on to popular science.
I found "The Emperor of all Maladies by Siddhartha Mukherjee unputdownable

 

[JamezF]

Ah, well, if we're wandering more towards fantasy then obviously Terry Pratchett must get a mention -- I've been reading his books ever since "The Colour Of Magic" came out. Much the same for Julian May's "Saga Of The Exiles" series (and those that came afterwards).

The Gap series is quite dark and tends to polarise opinion I think. It might be time for a re-read.

James

 

[Skinfaxi]

I'm on chemo and biologic immune suppressants.
First few stings of the year can be a nightmare, but gradually any reaction reduces as the season progresses. I did get floored in March 21, throat went tight, dizzy etc, yet following week no reaction whatsoever.
I do now have four Epipens with us at all times.
I have taken stings from around age five with no real issues until the chemo drug was added to my prescription last year.

Have the biologicals had any impact on your reactions.
Humira simponi

 

[Wilco]

Stainless Steel Rat anyone?

 

[JamezF]

Stainless Steel Rat anyone?

Always good for a laugh. I tried to find the ones I've not read a couple of years back, but some I couldn't find at all and others were ridiculously expensive.

James

 

[Saffabee]

I have read about this before and it worries me as I only got stung once last year through my nitrile gloves and because I have the gloves I can pull the sting out pretty quick so don’t get any reaction. Haven’t been stung so far this year. Wondering if I should purposely get stung to ensure I am getting my dose of venom? I don’t have particularly grumpy bees except when queenless but they don’t tend to sting just tend to ping veil a bit.

 

[Hedgerow Honey]

Have the biologicals had any impact on your reactions.
Humira simponi

Funnily enough, Humira ( Adalimumab) is the bio I am prescribed.
First few stings of the year are a real nightmare, effects range from nothing to quite severe swelling. After a few though most symptoms disappear, but I always get a runny nose, nothing else after a few

 

[Skinfaxi]

Funnily enough, Humira ( Adalimumab) is the bio I am prescribed.
First few stings of the year are a real nightmare, effects range from nothing to quite severe swelling. After a few though most symptoms disappear, but I always get a runny nose, nothing else.

I wish you all the best with it.

 

[Antipodes]

My understanding is that even if you get 200 (+) stings a year, year on year, you can still become rather suddenly anaphylactic....perhaps after many years beekeeping. Is there any evidence that this is not the case?

 

[Newbeeneil]

My understanding is that even if you get 200 (+) stings a year, year on year, you can still become rather suddenly anaphylactic....perhaps after many years beekeeping. Is there any evidence that this is not the case?

I went to a lecture by an immunologist who did the allergy treatment at a local hospital. He said the using data provided by French beekeepers, statistically the most likely time for anaphylacsis in beekeepers was in their 15th year of beekeeping. (I wonder if it's a French thing)

 

[polymath]

https://www.frontiersin.org/article...immunotherapy,and IgA type bloking antibodies.

Here's an interesting extract.

SR is systemic reaction.


Beekeepers are a vulnerable and high risk population for the development of allergic reactions to honeybee stings. In this specific group, the SR rates are higher than the general population and range from 14 to 38% (25). Receiving more than 200 stings per year is nearly totally protective from a SR whereas receiving fewer than 25 stings per year is related to a SR rate of 45% (25). In a British beekeeper survey, risk factors for SR were found to be female gender, positive family history of bee venom allergy, premedication with antihistamines before hive attendance and 2 or more years of beekeeping before the first SR (26).

HI, having gone through full desensitization here is the data from the suppliers of the immunization theorapy treatment. Met the guy from the company who sells it:

You see, as the data shows below whilst on the VIT course you have less than a 5% chance of having an amphipathic attack. But that is still one in under 20 people and when you say it like that it still sounds quite high to me.

%

Normal population 0.5 - 3

Large local reaction 5 - 10

Allergic patients on VIT maintenance <5

Patients 10y after a course of 5 yr VIT 10

Source: Moffitt Southern Medical Journal 96:1073 (2003) Golden, 2000

 

[Sam G]

As a beekeeper with severe and sudden anaphylaxis (I'm unconscious and breathing like a blocked drain within 90 seconds of a sting) over the last few months I've seen many contradicting research papers and have heard many immunology specialists give completely different opinions about the chances of becoming anaphylaxic and how long /how many stings it takes.
It was then pointed out by another medical practitioner that the reason for all this generalising is that the immune system itself is very unpredictable. Further add to this that every human has their own unpredictable immune system which will react slightly differently to everyone else's. No 2 immune systems are completely the same. For one person it might take 5 stings, for someone else, it might take 5000.

The only thing I've learnt for sure, is that if you read one 'proven' theory, you don't need to look far to find conflicting evidence in another!

 

[Sutty]

As a beekeeper with severe and sudden anaphylaxis (I'm unconscious and breathing like a blocked drain within 90 seconds of a sting) over the last few months I've seen many contradicting research papers and have heard many immunology specialists give completely different opinions about the chances of becoming anaphylaxic and how long /how many stings it takes.
It was then pointed out by another medical practitioner that the reason for all this generalising is that the immune system itself is very unpredictable. Further add to this that every human has their own unpredictable immune system which will react slightly differently to everyone else's. No 2 immune systems are completely the same. For one person it might take 5 stings, for someone else, it might take 5000.

The only thing I've learnt for sure, is that if you read one 'proven' theory, you don't need to look far to find conflicting evidence in another!

A lot of truth there!
One of the problems is that it is so difficult to study - inducing anaphylaxis in volunteers has some ethical difficulties. There are animal models which may or may not be reliable representations of humans. There also appear to be several different mechanisms at play. Extremely complex, and as said, variable between individuals.

 

[Antipodes]

For one person it might take 5 stings, for someone else, it might take 5000.

Sorry, just to clarify Sam, did you understand from the experts that the general thought/consensus is that everyone has an "end point" with regards to sting numbers whereupon the next sting will tip them over to anaphylaxis? (obviously not everyone will live long enough and get enough stings to reach that point .....if that's what they are saying).

 

[Sam G]

Sorry, just to clarify Sam, did you understand from the experts that the general thought/consensus is that everyone has an "end point" with regards to sting numbers whereupon the next sting will tip them over to anaphylaxis? (obviously not everyone will live long enough and get enough stings to reach that point .....if that's what they are saying).

Hi Antipodes,
No, I don't think they were suggesting that this is the case for everyone. More that, with enough exposure, some people will, some won't. But the exposure limit for the ones who do, can vary to the point of unpredictability. You can find varying figures, but a common statement is anything between 14 to 30ish percent of beekeepers will eventually end up suffering anaphylaxic reactions to stings

 

[Sutty]

Sorry, just to clarify Sam, did you understand from the experts that the general thought/consensus is that everyone has an "end point" with regards to sting numbers whereupon the next sting will tip them over to anaphylaxis? (obviously not everyone will live long enough and get enough stings to reach that point .....if that's what they are saying).

This seems highly improbable as other allergies don't behave like that. Anaphylaxis might be more common with sting allergies as the allergen is injected rather than just skin contact, inhalation or ingestion. But you do need to develop allergy to have anaphylaxis - though 1st symptom can be anaphylaxis.
We don't automatically develop allergy to every substance we contact regularly thankfully - otherwise I'd be allergic to bacon and beer!