Latest snake-oil varroa treatment pretending not to be a varroa treatment

[Beesnaturally]

Deleted

 

[mbc]

I expected that feedback. I might try that next time. I know there are 380 bees in my cup. The results are relevant to this hive and my own decisions regarding future varroa control.
Are wash and roll result numbers interchangeable?

On this tack has anyone experience of the CO2 v testing kits?

 

[Beesnaturally]

shouldn't but sh*t happens. Selective pressure can result in all sorts of weird things, given enough opportunity. Only takes one mutation to confer some form of advantage to a small population of varroa and then they can easily become the predominant sub species. Why risk it?

It's not usually mutation, but a shuffling of present genetic combinations, including low frequency alleles.

Physical damage sounds good, but physical damage is one of the main drivers of evolution.

That's not to say this won't work for a long time. Whether, when, and where, it's a good long term plan is another matter.

 

[Olbe]

Ceri,
What's the effect on brood underneath? Will the queen get to lay between the strips and the frame?

If there is space enough for the bees to get between the solid fibre (cardboard) strips and the comb face queens will lay under them and the brood survives , if the strips are too close to the frames that the bees cannot get access then any brood that is already there will die.

 

[Micklemus81]

The varroa strips were the only treatment you did over summer/autumn?

Where did you get them from?

I have read your post with interest. One of the forum readers was kind enough to say there are a few 'posts' discussing the subject of Randy Oliver's experimentation.
It surprises me that right at the top of this discussion the heading is labelled
'snake oil' & that is derogatory and suggests the fact that whoever labelled it so is averse to anything that might be sensible and worthy of discussion.
I think this is particularly derogatory due to Randy Oliver's experimentation and the fact that he is a meticulous Biologist. Much of his writings however are beyond the average patience or intelligence of many a beekeeper, but not all beekeepers.
I do not think that due to his status and experience he would do what he has done re the oxalic acid and glycerine strips if it was not worth his sharp attention to detail. What do you think of that?
Because it's not within the legislation are the bee police going to confiscate our bees?
What I find faintly ridiculous is the fact that we can spray the acid directly onto bees from an old washing up liquid sprayer?
Are we sticking our necks above the trench in saying that Randy Oliver is right in his research. After all he is working in conjunction with the Argentinian university who have used this method since 2015.
I wonder if this will be another 'good idea' that us lot here in the UK will be 10 years
( I say this as an approximation) behind the USA? Ok I realise there are many exceptionally intelligent people here as well as anywhere else in the world. There is still hassle though because there are many technicalities regards keeping bees so forum users have to tread very carefully. being a contributer to any forum should not be a stressful fight to the death as the bees are experiencing with the viruses they are getting from varrao mites that lax beekeepers are failing to address..

 

[Erichalfbee]

What I find faintly ridiculous is the fact that we can spray the acid directly onto bees from an old washing up liquid sprayer?

Blame FERA

Boston bees has given up beekeeping and abandoned us BTW.

 

[Micklemus81]

mmm, and you have just underlined it - very clever and ta very much (as they say in yorkshire) .
I have also: parked on double yellow lines; used a human generic of a topical vetinary medicine on a cat (and vice versa); had sex in a public place (though not recently sadly); fished without a licence; used the hoover after 6PM; flown a kite in a park; oh and used a fake name on the internet.
As a Welshman I have also on multiple occasions dodged the noose by being within the walls of Chester after dusk. (or is this urban myth)
I have 3 top bar hives and keep the honey for personal (and family) consumption.
I'll not loose sleep; but it would be nice to be able to have a conversation about this interesting topic without legal debates which end up spiralling into sophism.

I'm a new beekeeper since 16 July 21.... First I, love your style..... My pal donkey's years ago Portmadoc was about same as me he really was a card but the sharpest salmon fisher I've ever met..... he'd got no time whatsoever with idiocy. It is worrying re the implications then again as I said in another two posts - we can spray the stuff(Oxalic acid) straight onto bees but not administer it as an extended release acid. Seems too good to be true, or as some would say too stupid to say don't try it?
The Argentinians say in data that it works. Have there been any trials in the UK to prove that it either works or does not work?
Those who have tried it apart from Dr Jennifer Berry -Georgia who says it doesn't work say it does work....
A beekeeper breeder (you tube) who is dabbling (moonlighting) as he says with 200 hives says, this might just be the silver bullet we've all been waiting for.
Some beekeepers will criticise anything if it is not what they 'do', even if they have not tried a certain procedure themselves. It has been well documented that those with any original idea or even be seen to agree with that original idea, will get flack.
Some are all too ready to insult in a subtle manner. Forums are in this instance I would have though exist because we love bees and will do anything to better bees existence. Or am I wrong????

 

[Erichalfbee]

There are laws regarding what you can and cannot use on the bees. It doesn’t matter a jot if you keep all the honey for yourself. Nobody is ever going to find out especially if you are not registered on Beebase
The minute you sell your honey, which is food, things change drastically and rightly so. Would you feed you children of grandchildren something that has been illegally messed about with?

No matter how much you admire USA beekeeping and research please remember that they allow beekeepers to treat their bees with antibiotics.

 

[Micklemus81]

There are laws regarding what you can and cannot use on the bees. It doesn’t matter a jot if you keep all the honey for yourself. Nobody is ever going to find out especially if you are not registered on Beebase
The minute you sell your honey, which is food, things change drastically and rightly so. Would you feed you children of grandchildren something that has been illegally messed about with?

No matter how much you admire USA beekeeping and research please remember that they allow beekeepers to treat their bees with antibiotics.

I am aware of what they do because I took notice of my Aunt who was a school teacher and she knew I had a love of reading. She 'advised' me that reading is the key to knowledge. Nowadays it's the internet but no one should take anything for granted. Please may I ask, can Apibioxal Oxalic acid be used in a hive that has honey super/s 'on' ?
I have always firmly believed antibiotics should be used only when it is necessary to use them. However all doctors cannot be relied upon to make that life or death decision because it's money that influences their decisions now when it definitely should not be the case, should it?
I see the RNA genome science has been trialled by a professional beekeeper in the USA. He has operations all over the States.
That research looks very promising. I see in Australia, rust a bacteria or virus is being controlled all along their east coast on plants that could not be controlled any other way than by the RNA biology.
These days it's a world as a whole situation but it's a wonder the Argentinians would give us anything that might be of benefit to us lot!

 

[Mint Bee]

https://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/productinformationdatabase/files/SPC_Documents/SPC_807534.PDF

As for genomic solutions, we are only just getting medicines approved for human use after decades of research in the area. can you post the link to the US beekeeper who is trialing RNA genome science?
Thx

 

[Erichalfbee]

Please may I ask, can Apibioxal Oxalic acid be used in a hive that has honey super/s 'on' ?

No

 

[Erichalfbee]

https://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/productinformationdatabase/files/SPC_Documents/SPC_807534.PDF

As for genomic solutions, we are only just getting medicines approved for human use after decades of research in the area. can you post the link to the US beekeeper who is trialing RNA genome science?
Thx

It might be this
Development of Honey bee Virus Vector
There was talk on the forum a couple of years back. I asked Prof Evans.
I think it works only by inoculation but I might be wrong.

 

[Wilco]

However all doctors cannot be relied upon to make that life or death decision because it's money that influences their decisions now when it definitely should not be the case, should it?

I object to this remark. It is simply incorrect in a UK context.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I object to this remark. It is simply incorrect in a UK context.

Yes well spotted.
Perhaps it’s indicative of this gentleman’s opinion of all of us here?

 

[Etton]

I also asked how it cleaned my hive - and didn’t get an answer either.

It’s so tempting to try isn’t it? Just replace the strips every six weeks.

I used Abelo strips last autumn, seemed to work well, no hives lost and low varroa counts. I vaped early on then added strips as extra precaution.

 

[madasafish]

I am aware of what they do because I took notice of my Aunt who was a school teacher and she knew I had a love of reading. She 'advised' me that reading is the key to knowledge. Nowadays it's the internet but no one should take anything for granted. Please may I ask, can Apibioxal Oxalic acid be used in a hive that has honey super/s 'on' ?
I have always firmly believed antibiotics should be used only when it is necessary to use them. However all doctors cannot be relied upon to make that life or death decision because it's money that influences their decisions now when it definitely should not be the case, should it?
I see the RNA genome science has been trialled by a professional beekeeper in the USA. He has operations all over the States.
That research looks very promising. I see in Australia, rust a bacteria or virus is being controlled all along their east coast on plants that could not be controlled any other way than by the RNA biology.
These days it's a world as a whole situation but it's a wonder the Argentinians would give us anything that might be of benefit to us lot!

It's a good thing you don't write rubbish like that about specific UK cases as the ensuring libel cases would bankrupt you. But the forum would never let them stand so your are well protected from your own ignorance/prejudices.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It's a good thing you don't write rubbish like that about specific UK cases as the ensuring libel cases would bankrupt you. But the forum would never let them stand so your are well protected from your own ignorance/prejudices.

Don't worry....we have our eyes on the posts. Spot anything then just report it please

 

[Wilco]

Yes well spotted.
Perhaps it’s indicative of this gentleman’s opinion of all of us here?

I'm not sure that's an entirely accurate deduction. I suspect they will make their views clear themselves but whilst I may disagree with some of their views, and the one I reacted to above is hopelessly misinformed, in fairness I suspect that they have a better view of beekeepers.

 

[linoleum bonypart]

Ridiculous laws …. Dribbling in winter is ok but you can’t use impregnated strips …. Time sense was used

 

[Erichalfbee]

Who is going to pay to licence them?