Aggressive or just extremely P'd off?

[Blunt Spike]

Hi everyone, I had a look into one of my new colonies 2 weeks only to find several swarm cells on the frames. I had been feeding over the June gap and they were drawing frames out at a real fast pace and the queen was a prolific layer until the queen cells appeared. Unfortunately I wasnt in a position at that time to do an artificial split so I destroyed the QCs. I checked the colony over the next week and noticed that the queen had stopped laying (she is still in the hive.)
I gave it a further week to give her chance to start laying but she hasn't.

Yesterday I went back into the hive....still no eggs so I moved the queen and 4 frames of bees and stores into a poly nuc. Into the hive they came from I put a frame of eggs and another of brood of various sizes in the hope they will create a new queen. At about this point the bees became very aggressive bouncing of my head and several stings later I managed to close everything up ok.

However, these bees are kept on a patch of ground behind my garage which is about 40 feet from my back door, I like to sit in my garden and usually the girls leave us alone, but all day until dark yesterday there were about 15 to 20 bees ( I guess some of the guard bees?) Who were patrolling outside my back door and bouncing off the mrs and I and trying to sting until dark. This morning I went outside and within 30 seconds a bee was buzzing around me again.

Is this just a case of I've really upset them....considering I moved one colony(swarm) and made another Q-. Will they calm down over the next few days?

Thanks in advance for you taking the time to read my post and hopefully give me your thoughts.

 

[Beefriendly]

In my experience they might...But unlikely.
Time to move them.

 

[Blunt Spike]

Ahh, that's what I was hoping wasnt going to be said. Ok, not terrible news, just brings my plans for next spring forward a little.

Many thanks for the advice.

 

[enrico]

There is no definite answer except that your garden should never be a no go area. When I started many years ago I soon learnt that 100 feet from the back door was 300 feet too close!
E

 

[drex]

Queen less hives do get upset. I run double brood and split the broods for inspections, putting the top box on a stand of its own. Within a minute or two I can tell which box the queen is in, from the behaviour of the bees in the queen less box.

 

[philipm]

Probably because you've made them queenless always good idea to have a back up plan if they turn nasty.Wiping out queen cells is never a long term solution. Where I live we didn't have a June gap this year or last.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

But it's July!!

 

[viridens]

My garden hives are all within 30 feet of my back door. The mood of the hives changes with their agenda, sometimes you can manipulate with little reaction. But after anything which they find upsetting, especially anything involving poking around brood, My experience is a ramping down cycle of:
Bees pinging your face and maybe stinging if you give them the chance
Bees in your face and checking you without stinging
Bees showing extra interest and appearing to check you out
Bees showing little or no interest
Which for me takes about three days, rarely longer.

 

[pargyle]

Yesterday I went back into the hive....still no eggs so I moved the queen and 4 frames of bees and stores into a poly nuc. Into the hive they came from I put a frame of eggs and another of brood of various sizes in the hope they will create a new queen. At about this point the bees became very aggressive bouncing of my head and several stings later I managed to close everything up ok.

BUT... what you have done is upset their plans.. They wanted to swarm and instead of working with them and letting them think they HAVE swarmed (ie: Do an A/S) you knocked down all the queen cells (never a good idea) .. and stopped them. Then you have removed the queen and the nurse bees .. and any foragers will have flown back to their original hive .. and you've given the original hive a load of brood to nurse in the hope that they will raise a new queen - whilst putting a load of nurse bees in the Nuc.

It's no wonder they are pissed off ..

Leave them alone now, they will probably settle down in a day or so. Keep an eye on the stores situation in the nuc you've created as there won't be much of a foraging force .. you may have to feed the Nuc but watch for robbing as the foragers that returned to the original hive might remember there's a nice frame of honey that's easy pickings and tell their mates about it.

I hope you marked the frame of eggs you put in the original hive so you don't have to go through the whole lot to find out how many queen cells they make..(I use a drawing pin to indicate a frame I'm interested in) if they feel like making a new queen with what you have given them. if they make some - pick the best two and destroy any more they have made. Then let them get on with it ..

As banned RAB would say ... think like a bee ... it's about time he was let loose.

 

[Blunt Spike]

Thanks so much to everyone who has taken the time to read my post and reply to it. Every day is a school day and with each mistake I hopefully learn a little more!

Best wishes to all.

 

[pargyle]

Thanks so much to everyone who has taken the time to read my post and reply to it. Every day is a school day and with each mistake I hopefully learn a little more!

Best wishes to all.

Find a beekeeper who has all the answers and never makes a mistake.. no matter how long they have kept bees ? More chance of finding fresh dinosaur eggs .. getting some to admit to it is a bit difficult occasionally ! Thiose are the ones who have dinosaur eggs for breakfast !

 

[Clemcook]

I had the exact same situation when my bees were at home. It all went wrong after I split and they got stronger. They ran out of their flow and seemed to start on the garden in autumn, they became unpredictable, moody and went out of their way to cause a nusence.

Soon after they were moved. My advice would be to move sooner rather than later when they are stronger still.

 

[Beagle23]

Find a beekeeper who has all the answers and never makes a mistake.. no matter how long they have kept bees ? More chance of finding fresh dinosaur eggs .. getting some to admit to it is a bit difficult occasionally ! Thiose are the ones who have dinosaur eggs for breakfast !

 

[Hebeegeebee]

"- pick the best two and destroy any more they have made". A very good way of getting the first queen out to leave, thus depleting the colony. If you leave 2 queencells in a nuc, the chances are that you will not lose bees to a swarm. With a large colony, the chances are that it will split into two.

 

[MartinL]

I had a look into one of my new colonies.

I moved the queen and 4 frames of bees and stores into a poly nuc.

Into the hive they came from I put a frame of eggs and another of brood of various sizes . . . At about this point the bees became very aggressive bouncing of my head and several stings later I managed to close everything.

Just a few questions for clarification of your situation;

• 
  What is the provenance of the "New Colony"

• After you split was in the Nuc, how many different colonies contributed to the now angry one? Perhaps a little deodorant may have been a nice distraction at that point?

• Don't forget the weather is going to have a contribution too, Round here it's been threatening Thunderstorms in the evenings. Always sure to make their mood "LOW"!

• Probably most important, what about the neighbours, how many other back doors are close to yours??

If I get it wrong on the allotment or cricket pitch my neighbours don't get barred from their garden at the time they most want to be in it.

 

[Blunt Spike]

Just a few questions for clarification of your situation;

• 
  What is the provenance of the "New Colony"

• After you split was in the Nuc, how many different colonies contributed to the now angry one? Perhaps a little deodorant may have been a nice distraction at that point?

• Don't forget the weather is going to have a contribution too, Round here it's been threatening Thunderstorms in the evenings. Always sure to make their mood "LOW"!

• Probably most important, what about the neighbours, how many other back doors are close to yours??

If I get it wrong on the allotment or cricket pitch my neighbours don't get barred from their garden at the time they most want to be in it.

The bees have calmed down now thankfully. They were from the Q- colony. I will go in tomorrow to check for QC's on the frame of eggs and brood I put in when I took the old queen out.. No neighbour worries and although they are 40 feet from my back door there is a garage between the two.
Lesson learned on several fronts and I'm going to move them to a better location as soon as possible.

Many thanks to all for all your advice.