Strike

[victor meldrew]

Without a silver spoon, if that makes a jot of difference. I've done everything, achieved everything without anyone elses help, all off my own back...

It's called drive and determination and a survival spirit, with a sprinkling of positive mental attitude garnished with a real passion for making the best of what comes my way.

It's a dish that is free to anyone should they care to take a bite

My god man You are indeed a star in your own mind
VM

 

[Somerford]

If I recall correctly there were 600 or so public sector workers not affected by the proposed changes.

I've been doing a bit of reading. The cold, hard facts are (well, facts from the Office of Budget Responsibility and HMRC) that public sector pensions cost more each year than they gain from contributions. At the moment it's about £4.5 billion each year short. By 2016 it will be closer to £9billion. I cannot find data on how teachers (who for some reason seem to be the big point of discussion here) fare as a separate group.

So, to keep the status quo (whatever you want...) we need to get between 4 and 9 billion every year from somewhere. Therein lies the problem. Where do we propose to get all that cash from?

The entire UK tax take from income tax (I don't think NI is in there) in 2008/9 (most recent I can find) was £147 billion. So, to keep these pensions ticking along we need to hand over 3% to 6% of all income tax - just to pay for the gap between current pensioners and those currently paying in. That's a lot. it won't get any better either, as in times such as these the tax take drops (more unemployment) and the public sector is contracting, so there are less of them paying in. It's a bit like a Ponzi scheme!

So - the question is, to unions, those opposing the changes etc. - how will you raise all that cash each and every year?

Discuss.

Well researched Nosema....and this is the point the government are making...

It really won't get any better. Our entire social welfare system costs nigh on £200 billion a year and rising. It simply can't go on

 

[Somerford]

My god man You are indeed a star in your own mind
VM

No, I am quietly confident, and no one will drag me down no matter how they try or throw Sh1T my way.

You can smile and laugh out loud...good. Glad I made you think for a moment.

No one writes me a review. My success is through others. My leadership helps guide them to achieve. My team are the ones who show how good my abilities are by their results.

My team grew their market share by 5% this year...in a recession....

But of course in your eyes that 'just happened' didn't it ?

S

 

[tonybloke]

So - the question is, to unions, those opposing the changes etc. - how will you raise all that cash each and every year?

Discuss.

erm, stop spending money on bombing other peoples countries?

scrap the Trident so-called deterrent

collect some return from the banks ( seeing as how we bailed them out )

get George (viscount?) Osbourne to pay his taxes in the UK?

 

[victor meldrew]

No, I am quietly confident, and no one will drag me down no matter how they try or throw Sh1T my way.

You can smile and laugh out loud...good. Glad I made you think for a moment.

No one writes me a review. My success is through others. My leadership helps guide them to achieve. My team are the ones who show how good my abilities are by their results.

My team grew their market share by 5% this year...in a recession....

Ah! Arthur Daley himself

 

[For want of a better word]

My god man You are indeed a star in your own mind
VM

And Mr Budgen man,,,...when you suffer a life threatening illness will you book yourself into the local private clinic.. or do what us scroungers do and rely on the NHS

NHS .. worked for it on an incredibly low wage for 7 years... now that was charitable work.. paid from 9 to 5.30.. worked usually from 8.00 am to past 7.00pm most weekdays and often at weekends,,, how I wished I could take 2 weeks doing charitable works! BUT I PAID INTO THE PENSION FUND !!!
Left because I could not afford a home for my family,,... and grafted on a number of London building sites on the Lump!
I am pleased for you Mr Budgen .. or is it Mr coop...​

You are missing the point by lightyears!

 

[Somerford]

I go to whichever hospital is nearest my dear

Where is all this 'Mr Budgen/Mr CoOp' nonsense stemming from ?

S

 

[Nose Ma]

Trident - total cost £9 billion, a sunk cost. Annual cost - I cannot find. No savings other than ongoing (not saying I support it, just it's not actually all that much).

Total funding to banks - hard to get, but as at September about a mind-blowing £400billion. Yep, getting that back would help. Apart from one tiny problem, we borrowed the money to bail out the banks. Insane or what! Well we have debts of about £982 billion as at now, PLUS the $£400 billion we hosed on the bankers. So that won't actually help too much. It would reduce the structural deficit, but not the annual "loss" the country makes. As in, we earn in all taxes etc. less than we spend on the NHS, schools, all the bits that make a country work etc.

I cannot speak for George Osbourne, but I doubt he owes an extra £9 billion a year in tax if he is doing any dodgy stuff (I couldn't find the data from a quick google).

If you are hinting at "tax the rich", well it's an idea. Would you be surprised to learn that the top 10% of earners in the UK pay 57% of all the tax collected? The top 1% account for 27% of the tax take on their own.

 

[For want of a better word]

Somerford.. Mr Budgen..Mr COOP...

I can see you are a born leader that always has the last word.... truly an inspirational star in your own world.

Please stick to the point and resist personal slanging matches or ADMIN will cut us all off at the ....................................................................................................

 

[dpearce4]

Oh how my heart bleeds

do you know, i think the bloody lot of them are only one step removed from the scroungers on the dole.

Jobs for life Not True we are facing bigger redundancies than the government have told you. now in excess that 700,000 in the next 2 years.
long holidays Yes this is True but unpaid in my case only get payed for 39weeks, like most who work in education. Only teachers get payed for holidays.
9-3.30 I wish try 8am -5pm with no break!! Plus planning most evenings of 2hours when i get home.

non-contributory pensions Absolute rubbish i pay 11% of my wage in pension contributions.

oh how they must struggle Yes i do i cannot afford to run a car anymore, i now cycle over 20miles a day to work.

In my job working with Pupils that are Excluded from mainstream schools trying to teach them, i am verbally abused at least 10 times per day, i am phyiscally theatened daily, i have been assulted at least 10 times since i started working here 3 years ago. I have had knives used against me and other impliments either thrown at me or theatened to me.

I do all this for £7per hour on a 37 hour contract i dont get a lunchbreak as i am expected to work pupil breaks. My employers expect me to Plan, resource and deliver 25hours of lessons, plus mark work, plus as i teach gardening and cooking keep a kitchen clean (the cleaners refuse to as not part of their contract).

I do this because I love my job, i put up with all the abuse i get every day because i want to make a difference.

IF there wernt people doing jobs like i do then YOUR children would suffer as these pupils would distroy their education.

You dont think i deserve my pension that will be £3,000 per year (yes thats rignt only £3,000 not £24,000 that some in the media say i will get!!!) when i am allowed to retire at 65. I am 43 now so have another 23years to go before I can retire I will have payed in to my pension well over £30,000 and i know i will not get that back in retirement.

Please Guys dont believe all the C rap you read in the papers, some is true yes but dont forget the people that own the papers are Tory funders.

 

[Somerford]

In my job working with Pupils that are Excluded from mainstream schools trying to teach them, i am verbally abused at least 10 times per day, i am phyiscally theatened daily, i have been assulted at least 10 times since i started working here 3 years ago. I have had knives used against me and other impliments either thrown at me or theatened to me.

I do all this for £7per hour on a 37 hour contract i dont get a lunchbreak as i am expected to work pupil breaks. My employers expect me to Plan, resource and deliver 25hours of lessons, plus mark work, plus as i teach gardening and cooking keep a kitchen clean (the cleaners refuse to as not part of their contract).

I do this because I love my job, i put up with all the abuse i get every day because i want to make a difference.

IF there wernt people doing jobs like i do then YOUR children would suffer as these pupils would distroy their education.

You dont think i deserve my pension that will be £3,000 per year (yes thats rignt only £3,000 not £24,000 that some in the media say i will get!!!) when i am allowed to retire at 65. I am 43 now so have another 23years to go before I can retire I will have payed in to my pension well over £30,000 and i know i will not get that back in retirement.

Please Guys dont believe all the C rap you read in the papers, some is true yes but dont forget the people that own the papers are Tory funders.

Good on you

But I have a simple answer for these miscreants. take away their rights..their mobile phones, their x boxes, their play stations, their laptops, their shiney trainers, their hair wax, their nose piercings, their 'fun' and they stay removed until they can learn that society doesn't accept such behaviour. We encourage it though the trash that's on the tv, the ridiculous people the press idolise and the society that says you're underpriviledged if you don't have a tv, a mobile, a pc etc etc.

Oh, and bring back corporal punishment.

And hanging.

S

 

[Skyhook]

this bloke sums it up!!
http://youtu.be/J0SPio6RE-s

Was that Ricky Gervais?


.

 

[For want of a better word]

Good on you

But I have a simple answer for these miscreants. take away their rights..their mobile phones, their x boxes, their play stations, their laptops, their shiney trainers, their hair wax, their nose piercings, their 'fun' and they stay removed until they can learn that society doesn't accept such behaviour. We encourage it though the trash that's on the tv, the ridiculous people the press idolise and the society that says you're underpriviledged if you don't have a tv, a mobile, a pc etc etc.

Oh, and bring back corporal punishment.

And hanging.

S

​

This is a Monty Python Sketch surely.... Drone on and on and on.. frothing in be beer... falling over backwards... WHAT... stick them in the Army... in MY DAY..


{ seems a bit strange for someone only born in 1974!}

Those kids would LOVE a good CANEING !!... remember Ali G... bet you hated him!!

 

[Storm™]

Here's a thought- let's ban all private and work-based pensions. If MP's and civil servants had to live on the state pension, it might suddenly improve!

Hahaha Ain't that the truth.

Somerford i am afraid you're a little incorrect. On a few things.

I am friends with a few teachers and I live with one. She teaches primary school children ages @4 to 6. She leaves the house rain or shine whatever the weather at 7. So up at 6. She is only a few miles down the road from her workplace. She does not return home until 6. Then she looks after her kids. Her mother has them two days a week and a carer for three. She would not burden her mother but cannot work for 3 days only and cannot afford more care. But she is desperate to work. So off she goes gets home kids dropped off and she cracks on with dinners. Then sorts her kids out and then bed for the kids and then she cranks up the Internet to create lessons for the day. After which she finally gets to bed once she has finished marking. Yep even at that age. Care plans. Assessments. Ways ahead. Every child matters. So much paperwork. And then as you say she gets a brilliant long holiday. Which she has to take when the kids are off. But she cannot afford a holiday abroad because the fares are much higher then. So she has never been abroad.

Now she is not unusual nor the lower end of the scale. She has to asses the lower end - teaching assistants. That's also part of her job. Maybe your lack of knowledge is due to some deep seated feeling. Were you abused by a teacher perhaps. Touched you inappropriately. Lol just kidding. But seriously it's a little too much to rant when you clearly have not much idea about what teachers actually do. And this isn't only about teachers is it.

A contract is a contract. You cannot say you will pay 10p in the pound tax for a few years because money is tight. That lands you deep sh?t. And that isn't even a contract. That's an edict. So how is it legal the other way around when that was a contract. They took on the contract on the basis of the contract presented to them and of the rewards that loyalty to it offered. But that's fine to trash that. Yet again blaim the labour government. sorry but that argument is hollow. It's not like the Tories were completely in the dark. And i saw someone blame labour also - yep but they took over a shower of sh&te from the Tories. So they are both as bad as each other just in different ways at different times. However if this action is not supported by everyone then it will happen everywhere to everyone. They said the Tories would never risk taking on the Unions. That it would be career suicide. Said it time and time again. And yet here we are. It will be the finish of the Tories of that I am sure. They can only blame teachers for so long. Cameron saying that he was privately very happy that the unions had walked into this trap. That's why he is a prat. And calling today's action a damp squib. He wishes but his words today have shown how bombastic and autocratic this government is. And that will be his undoing. It's Thatcher all over again. Except there is no Major to step in and fix it all for the Tories and keep them in.

 

[mbc]

Good on you

But I have a simple answer for these miscreants. take away their rights..their mobile phones, their x boxes, their play stations, their laptops, their shiney trainers, their hair wax, their nose piercings, their 'fun' and they stay removed until they can learn that society doesn't accept such behaviour. We encourage it though the trash that's on the tv, the ridiculous people the press idolise and the society that says you're underpriviledged if you don't have a tv, a mobile, a pc etc etc.

S

Attitudes like this, if carried through by those in power, could very easily cause social unrest and even possibly rioting in our cities....Oops !

Time to shake the bloody lot of you up just like Maggie did in the 1980s with the miners.

Some of us remember going without as our famillies saved to send relief parcels to the suffering miners.

I pay into a pension, but I suspect like most ordinary people in Britain now, its not by choice, and I have no faith whatsoever that by the time I'm due to draw this pension it will be worth anything much at all.

 

[merylvingien]

!

Just flicked through breifly and read a few of the whiners and whingers who want everything handed to them on a plate, then go on to complain about the top end earners getting everything.

What utter whinging drivel...

Fact is, you get better than average pensions anyway, yet still want more. I bet very few who striked today actually know in monetary terms what they are striking about. Its just they got 2% rather than 3

If you are unhappy with your pay, go and get a different job! Simples.

If you are that intelligent, go and get a higher earner job like the ones you whinge about and get all the benifits, low tax at 50% and so on.

 

[For want of a better word]

Attitudes like this, if carried through by those in power, could very easily cause social unrest and even possibly rioting in our cities....Oops !



Some of us remember going without as our famillies saved to send relief parcels to the suffering miners.

I pay into a pension, but I suspect like most ordinary people in Britain now, its not by choice, and I have no faith whatsoever that by the time I'm due to draw this pension it will be worth anything much at all.

 

[Teemore]

I'm a "Public Sector Worker" and have been for over 12 years now with different organisations.

For half that period I was in a Union but no longer. At one stage my job involved working with Trade Union reps on employee relations issues (usually to do with anciliary staff in schools, people who could not manage their staff effectively and people who did not want to be managed .....) and whilst some of the reps had a bit of sense about them and helped to resolve problems, others you just couldn't work with. Those 'others' always came across as anti establishment, even in general conversation and in a couple of situations the people they were representing asked for someone else to act on their behalf... I have watched some of these 'others' move on up the career ladder in the Unions: some of them are the ones I now see spouting on local TV.

I was in work yesterday and aside from trying to do my own work, was left fielding queries that would normally have gone to staff who were on strike. The interesting thing is that whilst the majority of staff were on strike, we had about 10 people in work who, up to a week ago were Union members but withdrew their membership as they did not agree with the strike. Their big objection was that in the strike poll, only 29% of the members who voted were in favour of strike action and that was in a poll that had a low response. Why then did they go on strike? I'm told it was because they are affiliated to a TU in GB who went on strike so they had to go on strike here too.

Do I support the strikers? Only in their sense that people should be free to express their views. Am i happy to pay more for my pension? Yes. I entered my working life with the view that I would always be putting a few pounds away every month to fund car and house purchases but also to give me a nest egg for my retirement. If I want something, I save for it.

 

[Brosville]

"If you are unhappy with your pay, go and get a different job! Simples" - is a hopelessly naive and simplistic view - I once worked with handicapped kids - the work is not at all well paid, and the vast majority of those who do the job do so as a "calling" - they could well do much better financially by having chosen a different career path, but instead they settled for the satisfaction in "doing something worthwhile", and have often had years of specialist training and education - one of the few recompenses was that upon retirement they'd have a reasonable pension - successive governments have squandered the funds, (or allowed them to be squandered by private schemes), and now they're "moving the goal posts" so I think it's entirely reasonable for people to show their utter dismay when what they've worked, paid in for and been promised vanishes....
The present government is completely out of touch with the common people
(my own MP has just bought himself a Scottish castle....) and seems hell bent on removing funding from the poorest and weakest in society, and those who have chosen "caring" careers for altruistic motives - yet at the other end of the scale, the bankers get even bigger bonuses!
It's also a case of "make your bloody minds up" when it comes to government - on one hand they encourage red in tooth and claw capitalism, and are then horrified at the results of a "consumer society" that no longer has the means to buy those empty dreams... (hence the recent riots)...

This strike and the riots are simply symptoms of a sick society that needs root and branch reform - at the moment "greed is still good" - it's what "feeds the machine", and is ultimately just fuelling discontent and the problems we're seeing (and helping speed our headlong rush towards eco-meltdown)

 

[victor meldrew]

When nobody does real work and the Arthur Daleys of this world sell money backwards and forwards to each other we will get a collapse ,
Oops it's already happened
VM