Should I remove brood that is hanging from my brood frames?

[radhartgeorge]

Some of my brood frames are almost completely full, others (outer frames) are empty. The full ones had brood cells both on the top of the frames (which was basically destroyed when I removed my queen excluder, which the brood was half attached to) and hanging cells on the bottom of the frames.

My question is should I scrape off the hanging brood (which makes resting the frames on their bottom edge impossible during inspections) or should I leave it?

Attached photo shows destroyed brood at top. Next posts photo will show hanging brood.

Thanks!
Rad

 

[radhartgeorge]

Hanging brood pic

Hanging brood ( right hand side)

 

[VEG]

up to you really, i usually remove it though.

 

[Midland Beek]

That's what the sharp bit on the end of your hive tool is for.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Nice bit of drone culling while you're at it.
Look for the queen though!

 

[Madge]

I don't like culling brood - not even drone cells.

As you said, the hanging brood is a problem when inspecting. It will help if you use a dummy frame in your brood box. Once you've removed the dummy frame you'll have space in the box and won't need to put the brood frame down outside the box. Go through all the frames moving them along as you go and then put the dummy back again at the other side once finished.

(Perhaps I should call it a 'follower board'. One side should be flat to mimic the hive wall.)

 

[oliver90owner]

Some full and some empty, no honey arch and what appears to be very dark comb. I will guess and suggest you have frames in cold way and the brood at the bottom was at the back of the hive?

I am thinking these bees may need feeding and possibly dummying down, perhaps with a frame (initially) of new foundation after that brood emerges.

I am surprised, if all is well with the colony, that they would be brooding at the tops of the frames, so I am thinking it is not such a strong colony although it looks like she is laying well. They are trying hard but need a little help from the beekeeper are my thoughts.

RAB

 

[mbc]

If you remove a nice straight bit of comb from the bottom then they might rebuild it going crossways and so make damaging it, and possibly risking damaging the queen, inevitable on inspection. My advice for that bit in the photo would be to leave it, but there comes a point, if there is a bit of drone brood built wild at the bottom of most frames, that it gets difficult to get the first frame out without rolling bees. Its a judgement call really.

 

[radhartgeorge]

QCs at the bottom?

Beeno has suggested that the two cells at the bottom of the first photo might be QCs... I am not sure. Any thoughts?

 

[mbc]

Beeno has suggested that the two cells at the bottom of the first photo might be QCs... I am not sure. Any thoughts?

Play cups, no sign of being extended, I wouldnt worry now, but do take a look and see if they are charged next time you're in, as you should with any play cups when inspecting this time in the season.

 

[oliver90owner]

Beano has suggested that the two cells at the bottom of the first photo might be QCs.

No, was not a suggestion, was as though it were fact.

See my post on other thread.

 

[radhartgeorge]

I Decided to remove the hanging brood

Firstly, I'd like to thank everyone for their input. Whether it ended up correct or not I'm very grateful for sharing your experience.

I have just got back from today's hive inspection. Photos of this can be seen here:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/q6oce8b6k0shhz4/JOhia6P96U

I have given up trying to use this forum's photo uploading function - am I the only one that thinks this needs attention?

When I inspected the brood box, I took particular care to look for queen cells (which Beeno suggested he saw on my photo). The cells in question I thought were not long enough but I opened them up with a matchstick anyway and I am very relieved to say that they were completely empty and bone dry- one of them was actually open at the bottom.

Thankfully, there were no other suspect QCs anywhere in the brood box, just quite a lot of hanging brood (not sure if this is the correct term) from the bottom of the frames, all of which looked like drone cells but this could just be the way they look when they are not based on foundation.

There was mixed opinion on whether I should get rid of these hanging cells but in the end I decided to get rid of it. It felt pretty weird (wrong) cutting off all this brood in various stages of development but hopefully it's for the best.

For those that were concerned that the queen had gone, I can (thankfully) say that the queen is still there, safe and sound. This time I made sure she was below the excluder- even though I suspect the cells in the supers were from laying workers.

Anyway... that's all really. I'm really relieved that they weren't QC and it hasn't swarmed.

Thanks again for your advice.
Rad

 

[Madge]

... I am very relieved to say that they were completely empty and bone dry- one of them was actually open at the bottom. ...

They were probably both open at the bottom - that's why they're called 'cups'. I think they're also quite old.

 

[itma]

Some of my brood frames are almost completely full, others (outer frames) are empty. …

Is there any barrier (foundation frame, frame full of stale pollen or granulated stores?) between the overfull and the empty combs?



Drone brood culling in Spring is a useful varroa control (and monitoring) technique.
Many beeks deliberately insert a short frame so that drone brood comb will be added beneath (and ultimately chopped off before the drones emerge).
Its also a source of good quality (show?) wax - at least as good as cappings.

Drone brood culling is also a good idea for any hives with below-par temperament - you don't want them out there, polluting the local gene pool. If this applies, cull them until you can requeen with something better.

 

[Midland Beek]

So what's the plan? You going to increase colony numbers when you have the appearance of queen cells? Beekeeping with just one colony tends not to work very well.

 

[radhartgeorge]

The plan was to have two hives and I have a 2nd 14x12 all set up and ready for that purpose but I have only just got my head around the basics (this is the 2nd year beekeeping) and had hoped to tackle this matter later in the year, not the day before our family holiday! Typical: save your bees or pack. Guess which my wife thinks is more important...

 

[oliver90owner]

MB,
Not quite yet, I think.

Some of my brood frames are almost completely full, others (outer frames) are empty

My reading of that does not signify just the outer 2 frames. It is 'the rest' and that could be 'most'. Maybe four or even six or more?

On top of that we find he has (at least) one super on this 'only part-filled' brood box. I am thinking development will be, or has been, seriously slowed, especially as we have had some fairly cool weather of late.

Although I posted about the cold earlier, the OP seems to have completely missed, or ignored it

 

[radhartgeorge]

Oliver90owner,

The outermost frames are almost completely empty, coming in from that they fill up pretty quickly which either brood or sign that brood has been there recently.

Photos of all frames here: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/q6oce8b6k0shhz4/JOhia6P96U

I did not mention it on my post but your point about the weather being cold and the bees needing more super space was a good one and I put on another super of drawn out frames yesterday.

Rad

 

[Margaret Elisabeth]

MB,
Not quite yet, I think.

Some of my brood frames are almost completely full, others (outer frames) are empty

My reading of that does not signify just the outer 2 frames. It is 'the rest' and that could be 'most'. Maybe four or even six or more?

On top of that we find he has (at least) one super on this 'only part-filled' brood box. I am thinking development will be, or has been, seriously slowed, especially as we have had some fairly cool weather of late.

Although I posted about the cold earlier, the OP seems to have completely missed, or ignored it

When I inspected yesterday the queen had gone off lay completely and I had a quick panic, then remembered that the bees had not been flying every day so food is getting short. Feed went on right away. when I went back later to replace the insulation before sunset they were all over the feed like a banquet. and sounded happy again. Might be time to check all hives have enough to keep them going and feed syrup if short.

 

[beeno]

Hi all,
Do tell me, if the queen cups had been charged, which is obviously impossible to see from the photo, would they then have been called charged queen cups or charged queen cells?
From David Cushman's website
"Queen Cup Rim Size
During early 2000 I had various Email conversations with Rex Boys. Some of the following text is Rex's.
Play cells, also known as queen cups, are the little cells that look like acorn cups, that appear as though the bees started building a queen cell, then changed their mind and curved in the entrance to be, what appears to be, the diameter of a worker cell. These cups are always around and become part of the furniture so it is easy to forget to look inside them but you do so at your peril because they are the real thing."
If my terminology was off I apologise, but my heart was in the right place which the majority understands.