Sex alleles

[Finman]

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Bad thing is, that can speak about alleles, but you do not know, what kind of alleles you have in the hives.

Then you take 20 virgins from next hive, and next year you have a narrower genepool.

What can you do? - Nothing. Except to buy new queens outside of your genepool.
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But during last 54 years, I have not seen that my hives have lost sex into willow bushes. Perhaps in future.

50 alleles, should I find them?
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[jenkinsbrynmair]

Lest we forget....British ships carried around 3.4 million enslaved Africans to the Americas.

No forgetting about it - perfectly true and when the Royal Navy started blockading and running down other slave traders (not Americans - they were given free reign to carry on) they dropped the 'freed' slaves off on the sugar islands or St Helena where they were, for their own good indentured to work on the British plantations.

 

[Finman]

Next step was cotton & slave competition against Indian cotton. And you got some textile workers from Nepal to central England.

 

[Beefriendly]

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Bad thing is, that can speak about alleles, but you do not know, what kind of alleles you have in the hives.

Coming to a Beekeeping shop near you, soon.
The portable model BEE_DNA sequencer, essential equipment for the modern beekeeper. Use it alongside your hive tool and smoker on every inspection.
Keep on top of your alleles.
As an added introductory offer get the add on gene synthesizer free (offer limited to first 20 orders). Re-program your queens to produce VSH offspring. Plus enhanced foraging and vigor by simple trans-gene re-sequencing and transfer. You too can get 250kgs of honey per hive per month with this simple snake oil machine. Don't let the Fin's get all the honey.
Do NOT be tempted by cheap Chinese ebay copies. This is the real deal.
From $5,000,000 plus local state taxes.
Also included free is a Charles Atlas body building schedule which you will need for lifting all those full supers around.
Paypal and BVisa accepted.

 

[Beefriendly]

No forgetting about it -

Don't mention the opium....whoops!

 

[Finman]

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Oh dear. Natural beekeepers have nothing like these problems!

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[Millet]

Having studied Module 7 Selection and Breeding of Honey Bees made me ask this question to which I have yet to find an answer.

The text books say there are up to 19 different sex alleles, I read a paper (can't remember where, sorry) stating that there may be 50 or more sex alleles. Are certain alleles associated with certain sub species? Are there any alleles that are Unique to say Am mellifera, lingustica or carnica?

Has any work been done in this area?

I bet you wish you never asked now..

 

[Finman]

I bet you wish you never asked now..

Question was good. It revieled that beekeepers know nothing about alleles. Same with me.

But since now I am only worried. Dibloid drones...what else... Crawling virgins...

 

[bpmurray]

From $5,000,000 plus local state taxes.

Actually, you don't need a full sequencer, just the important markers, and you can do it on the cheap using simple chromatography.

 

[REDWOOD]

Why would a beekeeper want to know anyway other than curiosity. I had a skip through all the PDF files posted and read all related articles and it bored the pants of me to be honest but each to their own


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Why would a beekeeper want to know anyway other than curiosity. I had a skip through all the PDF files posted and read all related articles and it bored the pants of me to be honest but each to their own


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

But it's obviously very important for those who want another bit of paper to put on the wall.

 

[Finman]

But it's obviously very important for those who want another bit of paper to put on the wall.

When you visit in Glanaman Village, get from Alibaba paper

https://www.alibaba.com/product-det...048589.html?spm=a2700.7735675.30.9.qrrrwi&s=p

Minimum order 10 000.
.

 

[Finman]

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Back to civization...

I have not understand what the interst is towards sex alleles and towards diploid drones. But I found an article from the year 2013, which tells what is the idea in this.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/10/131031090344.htm

A worker bee has two chromosomes in fertilization, and a larva will born as female worker.

If two genes in each 2 chromosome are too close or same, the fertilized egg will hatch as diploid drone. Bees eate the new larva very quickly. And you will not see that buck.

That means that the colony loose eggs in inbreeding. Interesting thing , but what then. What does it means to hive yard, not only sex gene .

But lets look the old genetics,what humankind have known thousands of years:if animals are too close relatives, their descendant may be dead, sick and what ever. Most of human fault embryos will die before birth. About 30% out of human fertilized eggs of boy embryos will disappear in embryo stage.

Mutations are raw material of evolution. Mutations are alternative forms of genes. (allele).

All mutations are not usefull. They are often harmfull and mere functional errors. These things made inherit diseases and faults in invidual.

There are two genes, and if one gene works, the error gene does not harm indivuals life.

The bee has 10 000 genes, and now we talk about couple of sex genes. When two genes are too close in those two sex cromosomes, worker will become drone larva and bees destroy them. So will not see those dibloid drones.

BIG ISSUE IS INSEMINATION HARMS, not sex genes. It is same as problems in dog races, and in what ever domestic animals what we have.

How inbreeding problem appears, when we have two narrow genepool:

You may pick genes from another genepool, which make a colony resistant to

- nosema
- chalkbrood
- European faul brood

- empty holes too much in brood combs, what means that big larvae have disappeared.

- You can see too, how hybrid colonies are often biggest and most productive in your apiary-

- How eskimos picked genes directly from wild wolf, that they get stronger dogs. They got back too the genes of beast...


So, question is about too small apiary and the faults what a narrow genepool bring to bees. I have met these things in my apiary several times and and how to get rid of these faults is to buy new mated queens.


Sex gene thing is only 1/10000 malfunctions in genome.

But in England, when you have there 100 hives around you apiary, you have enough hybrid vigour around you.

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[Finman]

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Special greeting to Fusion.

You hinted that when I started to study genetics in university 50 years ago, after that I have not read or heard about genetics.

My main principles are, how angry I am in these forums, that

- I do not insult about people's occupation, how they get earnings in their living and to their family.

- I do not insult people's education what ever it is.

- I do not insult the age of forum members. We all become one year older every year.

- I do not put idiot sentences into forum members mouth what they have not said. Idiots reviele themselves without me.
.

I love to make traps, to where idiots drop by themselves. They reviele their stupidnes sooner or later.



.
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[B+.]

I love to make traps, to where idiots drop by themselves. They reviele their stupidnes sooner or later.

I think it would be far better to use your knowledge productively to teach Finman. Your 'traps' can damage the learning of those trying to understand what you are talkling about

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

It's called trolling

 

[For want of a better word]

.
Back to civization...

I have not understand what the interst is towards sex alleles and towards diploid drones. But I found an article from the year 2013, which tells what is the idea in this.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/10/131031090344.htm

A worker bee has two chromosomes in fertilization, and a larva will born as female worker.

If two genes in each 2 chromosome are too close or same, the fertilized egg will hatch as diploid drone. Bees eate the new larva very quickly. And you will not see that buck.

That means that the colony loose eggs in inbreeding. Interesting thing , but what then. What does it means to hive yard, not only sex gene .

But lets look the old genetics,what humankind have known thousands of years:if animals are too close relatives, their descendant may be dead, sick and what ever. Most of human fault embryos will die before birth. About 30% out of human fertilized eggs of boy embryos will disappear in embryo stage.

Mutations are raw material of evolution. Mutations are alternative forms of genes. (allele).

All mutations are not usefull. They are often harmfull and mere functional errors. These things made inherit diseases and faults in invidual.

There are two genes, and if one gene works, the error gene does not harm indivuals life.

The bee has 10 000 genes, and now we talk about couple of sex genes. When two genes are too close in those two sex cromosomes, worker will become drone larva and bees destroy them. So will not see those dibloid drones.

BIG ISSUE IS INSEMINATION HARMS, not sex genes. It is same as problems in dog races, and in what ever domestic animals what we have.

How inbreeding problem appears, when we have two narrow genepool:

You may pick genes from another genepool, which make a colony resistant to

- nosema
- chalkbrood
- European faul brood

- empty holes too much in brood combs, what means that big larvae have disappeared.

- You can see too, how hybrid colonies are often biggest and most productive in your apiary-

- How eskimos picked genes directly from wild wolf, that they get stronger dogs. They got back too the genes of beast...


So, question is about too small apiary and the faults what a narrow genepool bring to bees. I have met these things in my apiary several times and and how to get rid of these faults is to buy new mated queens.


Sex gene thing is only 1/10000 malfunctions in genome.

But in England, when you have there 100 hives around you apiary, you have enough hybrid vigour around you.

.

Very good post Mr Finnie my sweet.....

But without 100s of colonies for bees about your forest glade, bursting with fireweed... how do you maintain your gene pool with a mere 40 or so colonies.... by importing in bees from Denmark?

Just wondered

Yeghes da

 

[Finman]

I think it would be far better to use your knowledge productively to teach Finman. Your 'traps' can damage the learning of those trying to understand what you are talkling about

You are adult man. Take care yourself.

 

[Finman]

Very good post Mr Finnie my sweet.....

But without 100s of colonies for bees about your forest glade, bursting with fireweed... how do you maintain your gene pool with a mere 40 or so colonies.... by importing in bees from Denmark?

Just wondered

Yeghes da

I buy every year couple new queens.

But I have seen that making hybrids from selected bee strains move the stock quickly to unwanted direction.

Non swarming and non attacking features are result of gene error, selected by man.

Once I bought queens from 5 different sellers. And what I got: Local mongrels.
They swarmed and stung like natural bees ought to do.

Their gene errors healed, and they hybrid vigour returned all nasty habits of bees.

The worst happened 3 years ago, when forest carniolans crossed to my giant hybrid hives. 120% out hives swarmed.

When hives started to rear brood after winter, after 4 weeks from start they had swarming cells. And the colonies did not even fill one box.

Now I renewed all queens. I bought them from 1500 hive owner from Central Finland. Cost is equal 100 kg honey.


But this all makes beekeeping interesting. I do not cry.
.
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[Finman]

It's called trolling

No. It is called British Intellectual Poking. I learner the style in England 20 years ago on my work trips.

Your puclic toilet things are Welsh *.* Poking. And all those pee and poo things are just best Welsh intelligentzia.

When I have tried from google Welsh & intellectual search, google says: No answer.


May the Force be with you, Jenkins.
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