Q & Answers the definition of a nucleus

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mikethebee 

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Q; I would like to know that all the brood is from the queen that's actually in the nuc rather than brood lifted from other hives with a freshly deflowered virgin just dropped in. This would mean that the nuc would have to have been together for a month or so before selling. It would ensure - for Roger's peace of mind, that the queen was at least starting off OK and was capable of sustained laying and not a dud. What has ROGERs peace of mind got to do with a beekeeper selling a nucleus or anybody else for that matter? He don?t sell nucs or do he? Don?t throw stones?

Q; It would be good if a BBKA stadard was developed and published and nuc sellers could then at least say that "This nuc complies with the 2009 BBKA standard,

MAY I POINT OUT again the BBKA have not got a standard? They have been happy to let the associations bung any old unwanted frames in a box and sell as a nuc to newbes tell me I?m wrong. Read EZ/BEE product printed definition of a nucleus 2006.
I like the tick boxes but it would lead to a higher nuc price.

We are going down the road of being controlled and dictated to by the BBKA imagine that!

Q;Roger, if you published a draft standard here, you would get plenty of different views (can you bear it?) but I am sure that some would be useful. Have no fear he is working on it.
LET ME EXPLAIN as you obviously been listening to others that don?t have a clue what & how we do nucs.
We take 5 new frames to make the nuc, brood- eggs- larvae- bees- Queen- food- pollen from the nest of a over wintered 16 frame b/box
(200 specially made for breeding bees)
to make our nucs for the beeks that want there bees in APRIL/MAY not June/July.
These newN over winterd mated queens have not had a full laying season as they are introduced late in the year.
We then refill the nest with5 new frames and foundation adding a supplement feed The same day return 3 hour?s after and replace the box with a new caged mated queenin all the boxs, 10 days after we repeat the process, but this time take the older capped brood frames. The bees will have pulled out the foundation and the queen will have completely laid new eggs in the new combs.
With our queen feeding and bee breeding methods it pays us to introduce a new queen every time.if you dont understand what how just ask and i will answer.

Read the BBKA ADM Proposition for 2009 big brother wants your details,
Please read and don?t contradict and confute, nor believe and take for granted, nor to find discourse; but to weigh and consider!
All the best mike
 

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It would be great if the forum members could get our own "defininition of a Nuc" drafted.

Would an introduced queen be exceptable? I am just thinking that if the queen should have to of laid ALL the eggs and brood in the nuc it could be mid summer before nucs become available for sale?
 

Hebeegeebee 

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How do you over winter all these queens Mike?
 

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Is 16 frames a special?
 

Bcrazy 

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With regards to Mike's debate with Roger P, there is enough being said on the BBKA forum and I would not like it to spread onto our forum.
Just a thought.

Regards;
 

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Understood Bcrazy.
I have not had any time to visit the dark side for a few days so was not aware of any problems.
 

Frisbee 

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for Roger's peace of mind,

What has ROGERs peace of mind got to do with a beekeeper

Q;Roger, if you published a draft standard here,

All the best mike


Mikethebee seems to have a bee in his bonnet!

But it's nothing to do with us

Mike - stop throwing all your toys out of the pram please We are interested in what you are doing and why, but we're not interested in your arguments which are spilling over from the other forum.

I thought we'd said that before. . . . . . . .

:grouphug:
 

mikethebee 

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Hi Ya Bcrazy Whassss you on about ? All the Q/Answers are on yer.

What is a beekeepers nucleus? "Nothing in the dictionary?" Have you read the BBKA definition of a nucleus? "Ant none yet"
Have you ever seen an up to date one printed?
Have your "or any" Associations got a printed copy? "Nope"
As a newbee where would you look for the definition ?ezb of corse"
Did you know what a nucleus consisted of when you started? "nope"

Bcrazy me old butt please read this true story.

Bee Auction at the Hartpury Collage last year 25 odd nucs for sale, ?NONE MINE? 5/6 estimated good the others just passable 2 a complete waste, others no queens swarms little brood no eggs.
A assortment of beehive parts frames floor and roof was sold to a young lad ?newbee? about 20/5? yo age ?55 no queen no brood or eggs just a handful of bees occupied the dirty black frames in a box that was tied together with string it was falling apart,All had a bee inspectors report on each, and stated by the inspection report to be a nucleus?
On helping a friends pick his winning bids up, equipment and bees at the end of the day.
I got into conversation with the lads father he told us his son was just starting out and was advised by his Association members to buy every thing from the auction, including a nucleus of bees.
Now why the GBKAssociation powers to be, should have permitted such rubbish to be called a nucleus and be sold in the auction is beyond me.

Especially to a newbee.

I suggested they go back to the office and ask for the money back he decided against this advice, but said he would complain to his association members back home and ask them to do it for him?
That?s why newbees need to know the definition of a nucleus instead of getting fobbed off with unwanted crap.

this info is not directed at you me ol butt,
its to read and don?t contradict and confute, nor believe and take for granted, nor to find discourse; but to weigh and consider!

All the best mike
 

Bcrazy 

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Hi Mike,
I whole heartedly agree with you that beginners must have a safe guard when buying Nuc?s.

Just a couple of points;

no queen no brood or eggs just a handful of bees occupied the dirty black frames in a box that was tied together with string it was falling apart
Then why did nobody question the items being sold?

All had a bee inspectors report on each, and stated by the inspection report to be a nucleus?
If it contained a Bee Inspectors report then why wasn?t the B I called to account?

If you felt so strongly about the conditions of the Nuc?s on sale, why did you not raise your concerns with the management of the auction?

If the newbee in question was given wrong information by his association then why hasn?t a letter been sent to that association?

Mike I get the impression that your not backwards in coming forward. So why didn?t you do or say something regarding the quality of equipment for auction?

You and Roger P have had your comments on the BBKA forum regarding the wording of what definition to have for the Nuc. This is between you and the BBKA so please keep it on the BBKA forum.
When and if this ever gets resolved then by all means let us all know, but until then please not on this forum.

This is just a personal observation me ol butt.

Regards;
 

Hivemaker. 

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Sweetums, you've not changed a bit,and i know just how you feel.
 

Poly Hive 

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If and when the BBKA produces a standard, it applies to what?

Think about this carefully. It applies to what?

Customer compaling to vendor.. it does not comply with the BBKA standard. Vendor to customer. And?

The BBKA can make decisions all it likes. They have no more weight really than ten of us on here or any other gathering and saying xyz is how it will be.

The majority of bee-keepers are not members and care less.

Thought for the day.
 

Hebeegeebee 

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mikethebee

Your complaint about the poor quality colonies for sale at the auction is justified. Are you not therefore agreeing that a definitin of a nuc need putting together. New beeks will naturally go to the BBKA, so it makes sense for them to have a definitition. My guess is that there's only a fag papers difference between your own view of a good nuc and any other respectable beekeeper.
My question asking about overwintering queens has gone into an argument about something else ???
 

Poly Hive 

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Hebeegee,

I think that an over wintered nuc is one way to go.

As for whether all the brood in the colony should belong to the resident Q I really don't see what odds that makes. Provided that is that the Q is settled and accepted that is.

As for beginners automatically heading for the BBKA that is more debatable though in these internet days more likely.

I do wish though that the BBKA would change it's name to reflect it's actual status of English Beekeepers Association. They do not nor ever have spoken for the UK.
 

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mikethebee has good points in his nuc selling. What then after selling?

I may read in these forums stupid advices how beginner can split a small hive into 3-frame nucs. It is difficult even to experineced beekeeper to make normal hive from this dwarf, what about beginners. - How to limit stupid things? Hardly not.

It woud be wise to buy 2 nucs and join them to normal hive. Who tells that to beginner?
 

Bcrazy 

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Who ever supplied that frame in a Nuc needs to be publicly named.
That is disgusting,

Regards;
 

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Doorman thats bad!

What if a new beekeeper had purchased that as a first hive.
 
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