Planning a new strategy next year…

[Do224]

I’m a couple of years into my beekeeping and am still working out the management strategy that suits me.

Year one I used national bb, qx then supers and they inevitably were keen to swarm.

This year I ditched the queen excluder which seemed to help.

Next year I’m intending to go double brood. But I’m unsure what to do going into next winter. I have insulated covers that fit neatly over a single brood box and super (super is just for feed). I’d like to continue overwintering on this configuration if possible. Is it pretty straightforward condensing a double brood hive down to one bb for winter?

 

[drex]

I only bother to condense down from double to single if colony is weaker than I would like. Take most through winter on double BB. Don't have to worry about stores. It is easy enough to condense down if you want, just remove empty or redundant frames. My roofs are insulated, wooden boxes. Not seen isolation starvation yet.

 

[Murox]

There isn't really a recipe that you can use, whether or not you overwinter on single or double brood is determined by how big the colony is. A single national brood box is big enough to overwinter most colonies without the need for a super to hold stores, they only need around 20kg to winter on.

 

[elainemary]

I’m a couple of years into my beekeeping and am still working out the management strategy that suits me.

Year one I used national bb, qx then supers and they inevitably were keen to swarm.

This year I ditched the queen excluder which seemed to help.

Next year I’m intending to go double brood. But I’m unsure what to do going into next winter. I have insulated covers that fit neatly over a single brood box and super (super is just for feed). I’d like to continue overwintering on this configuration if possible. Is it pretty straightforward condensing a double brood hive down to one bb for winter?

I agree with @drex . Try over wintering one colony on double brood. Loads of their own stores = a flying start in the spring

 

[Mabee]

This is my first year using double brood. I’ve dummied them down to 8/8 for weight. Most i’ve reduced now to single but I still have one i’ll overwinter on double brood, it really depends on the strength of the colony when preparing for winter. I use poly hives but my dummies are also insulation boards, you could insulate that way.

 

[user 819]

Here it is usually mild in winter and I don't bother reducing to one BB, I leave them on double and also only saves early spring disturbance of the colony. They really do get off to flier ,fiddling to early or to late in the season isn't needed.

 

[Erichalfbee]

How does everybody cope with inspecting double broods weekly in the season? Bottom box first but taking that top box off destroyed so much brood when I tried it so gave up. All the frames were aligned and bee space was right but the bees would always bridge the gap with brood.

 

[Swarm]

Inspect the top one. As they build up, swap the boxes around and continue top box inspection until/unless charged cells are found, then thoroughly check both to remedy.
Scrape away any ladder comb.

 

[drex]

Just what I do. Only inspect bottom box occasionally, especially if I see QC's. I also reverse boxes, perhaps twice in a season. Bees were very strong this year, and in this very swarmy year, they showed no intention. It really does help with swarm control.

 

[Redcap]

How does everybody cope with inspecting double broods weekly in the season? Bottom box first but taking that top box off destroyed so much brood when I tried it so gave up. All the frames were aligned and bee space was right but the bees would always bridge the gap with brood.

I found the same...which is why I went down the 14x12 route...but tbh, I still ponder on the merits of the decision. I still find it a bit of a pain running nationals and 14x12, perhaps I should just stick with one type...I'd save myself a lot of angst and frustration...

 

[Do224]

Just what I do. Only inspect bottom box occasionally, especially if I see QC's. I also reverse boxes, perhaps twice in a season. Bees were very strong this year, and in this very swarmy year, they showed no intention. It really does help with swarm control.

What’s the thinking behind reversing the boxes?

 

[user 819]

I don't see much in the way of any brace comb and certainly no brood in between. If I see no QC's in the top box or braced between the pair then top box often only is inspected.

 

[drex]

What’s the thinking behind reversing the boxes?

As said, it is a swarm control measure and encourages the brood nest to expand

 

[BernardBlack]

What puts me off about double brood is the weight.

They’re a nightmare to lift off when inspecting. Supers are bad enough!

 

[Do224]

As said, it is a swarm control measure and encourages the brood nest to expand

How do you know when to reverse…when bottom box is laid up?

 

[elainemary]

How does everybody cope with inspecting double broods weekly in the season? Bottom box first but taking that top box off destroyed so much brood when I tried it so gave up. All the frames were aligned and bee space was right but the bees would always bridge the gap with brood.

Not had a problem with that Dani. I have had the ‘problem’ of the bottom box having extended brood in but not between the 2 brood boxes.

I like double brood. I don’t do full double though I dummy down to 7+7 or 8+8 as I don’t see the point of giving more space than needed. Usually my bees build around 12 frames of brood so 14-16 total in the season is enough.
However for winter if it’s a big colony I will give more frames so there’s enough of their own stores to jot worry or have to fiddle with fondant

In May and June I do a full weekly inspection and check both boxes as that’s when my bees are most likely to make swarm preps.I now tilt between the 2 boxes after mid June to look for queen cells and if there aren’t any I leave them to it. Works well for me and saves time.

Re full inspections I start with the bottom box. I’d say 75% of the time she’s in the top box.

I like using double brood for winter for all
the reasons that’s been said already.

I find it a flexible easy way to manage the bees and much better than brood and a half. 14x12 frames would be too heavy for me to lift and too complicated when using Nucs.

P.S, I don’t reverse boxes but after reading a few posts think I’m going to try this

 

[Erichalfbee]

14x12 is getting problematic for me.
Thanks everybody. It’s food for thought.

 

[JamezF]

As said, it is a swarm control measure and encourages the brood nest to expand

That doesn't explain what's actually going on though and why.

I'd guess that as bees naturally tend to "work downwards", if you move a box full of emerging brood under one that is uncapped, it fits in with that process because as the (new) top box is capped the box below is becoming empty. I could be completely wrong though.

James

 

[Swarm]

How do you know when to reverse…when bottom box is laid up?

When the nest is expanding. It will have brood in both boxes, a spherical shape with stores arranged in the usual way, above and behind the brood. When you swap the boxes around, you create more of an hour glass shape. The bees will rearrange their nest and in doing so, provide more space for the queen. It also counteracts the downward pressure and swarm triggers caused by a honey arc by keeping brood above the nurse bees. Repeating the process through the season keeps their little minds occupied with housekeeping
Don't bee afraid to put supers on early.
If you tip the top box like a hinge, you can assess the nest and see how many frames contain brood, that's a sort of quick early inspection. You've checked their stores by tipping the top box and now you have an idea what size their nest is and when you need to check again.

 

[drex]

How do you know when to reverse…when bottom box is laid up?

Simply when judged to be strong enough. Think of it as what Ted Hooper calls "spreading the brood"- just a bit more dramatic .