Omlet Beehaus

[Somerford]

fair point

I have been following this thread (and a similar one on Omlet's forum) with interest. I have bees and chickens. I have an eglu (which I think is great), but am considering a more 'traditional' coop when I expand my flock. Therefore, I think I am reasonably unbiased in this debate.

I think Omlet are getting some undeserved criticism, and from my reading of their comments and interviews, I think they are doing it mostly right. The designers are beekeepers themselves and members of beekeeping associations from whom they have sought advice. They researched existing hives and brought Robin Dartington onto their design team when they decided they liked his design the best. In all the interviews I have seen, they have stressed the importance of education and getting good support from a local association. Yes, they are a commercial company, but I think they are one of the more friendly and considerate ones.

I actually quite like some of the features of the hive: The wide brood box which should give more options for swarm management; the smaller, lighter supers; the integrated travelling/roof strap; and the 14x12 frames. On the negative side, I think it looks a bit nickable, and I'm not sure how you add a new tier of supers. Yes, there are issues with sterilsation and the Foul Broods, but that's true of any plastic or polystyrene hive too and as most people (including me) use wooden hives, of course the most widely communicated advice concerns them. Defra's own advice is that while comb cannot be chemically sterilised, brood boxes and hives can be, though I suspect with wood it's much harder to remove all the chemical residue than with plastic hence the preference for burning.

As for cost, put in perspective, it's probably in competition with a full assembled hive from a big supplier. Thornes have a National with all frames and 2 supers for about £285. Since the Beehaus is effectively two hives, it compares quite well at £465. No-one who would build their own bee or chicken accommodation would consider an Omlet product, but they aren't after that market.

Don't get me wrong, though - I am not an apologist for Omlet and I don't think for a second that the right thing is for people to jump into beekeeping on a whim, but I do think much of the blame for that emphasis is the media, not Omlet. There are clear risks with beekeeping in an urban environment, but like any risk you can manage them and need to weigh them up against the benefits. Personally, I am nervous about bees in my garden, but have a site that I think mitigates the risks (and some backup out-apiary sites in reserve). But I still want bees nearby because there are so few honey bees in my garden normally. I think the Omlet blurb emphasises the positives a little too much, but then so would any supplier.

In conclusion, I agree with David P elsewhere that we will see a fair number of new beeks drop out next year, and hopefully that will result in some good value hives on eBay - if some of those are Beehaus, I could well be bidding.

fair arguement here

 

[oliver90owner]

there's nothing to stop us making mini supers out of wood for our authentic hives is there ?

Apart from the weight issue, there are few advantages (see my post re the two Dartingtons I have?).

The main issue is fitting them without the bees running up the sides which need to butt together.

Other issue is wasp tightness - they have to be close together with no gaps - something else to check! Minor issue - you need to get them straight to get the roof over easily - it is worse on a Dartington as there are four mini-supers on each tier, and a bigger roof (although I have made mine in two halves, I have screwed them together).

They have to be made more accurately - for the above reasons.

My advice - forget mini supers. I often use National supers on my Dartingtons, anyway.

By the way , what is authentic in relation to bee enclosures? I would have thought the log hive would fit that description much more aptly than anything devised in only the last 150 years!

Regards, RAB

 

[JCBrum]

Who needs authentic ? I use a washing machine not rocks on the river-bank.

 

[victor meldrew]

I have the Missus do mine

John Wilkinson

 

[blackpuddinonnabike]

Blimey, I registered in order to read the whole of this thread, and by eck there's a lot of food for thought.

I'm another who already has an Eglu (though it's now housed inside a run I built off the side of our shed - http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackpuddinonnabike/3266329898/in/set-72157605789262891/). I mention this only because it means I've got first hand knowledge of using an Omlet product, and certainly when it comes to the chickens it's spot-on. Lots of little features that make it easier to clean and maintain. The look obviously isn't to everyone's taste, but if we all liked the same thing it would be a very boring world.

And that's really why I was interested by the Beehaus. I've looked at keeping bees before, done a lot of reading, and considered some courses. Considering a Beehaus rather than a 'normal' hive hasn't really changed that thought process for me, and as has been pointed out, the Beehaus is probably an expensive option so warrants thinking about it seriously.

More money than sense? Perhaps; though pride forces me to suggest that since the hive 'works' (and it should shouldn't it?) then the question is are you willing to pay that little bit more for something you find aesthetically pleasing, given it's going to be placed in your garden? (although I like the look of 'normal' hives as well and would be tempted to try and build one...)

Of course after reading this thread I'm having second thoughts again. The garden is reasonably big, and there are areas where a hive could be placed, but we've got neighbours on either side. Naturally the best thing I can do is speak to someone who knows what they're talking about - my main concern is finding someone who is either anti-plastic hives, or anti-bees in gardens, to such an extent that no advice other than 'don't bother' is proffered.

I'll be wandering through the forum learning more anyway.

 

[BKF Admin]

Welcome to the forum Blackpudding.
A few of our members are now trialing the new Beehouse and should be given us their thoughts soon.

p.s I own a Cube and an Eglu so you are in good company.

My advice is read up as much as you can and dont be swayed by the marketing blurb,if a Beehouse is for you then go for it..

 

[Stevedore]

does anyone one know where to get a proper wooden Dartington long hive now? The official website link appears to be "broken". I note omlet say Robin Dartington has been part of thier design team. Is this a coincidence?

I understand that the reproduced, spiral-bound version of Dartington's book contains the detailed plans for several variants. See:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/New-Beekeep...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252347627&sr=8-1

I also found a carpenter near High Wycombe, Buckinghamshire who builds Dartington hives:

http://www.dartingtonhives.co.uk/

Here's the last version of Dartington's own web site cached by the Wayback Machine:

http://web.archive.org/web/20080110195325/http://www.dartingtonhive.co.uk/

 

[Haughton Honey]

I think you'll find that the reason that the Dartington site is down is that Mr.D will have done a deal with Omlet and he will not be enabled to compete against them (doubtless in return for a per unit sale royalty).

 

[m100]

Probably true as Stamfordham no longer sell kits or made up Dartington Hives

 

[Stevedore]

Probably true as Stamfordham no longer sell kits or made up Dartington Hives

I noticed that from their latest PDF catalog. I'm surprised the carpenter in Buckinghamshire has not received any crap about his domain name.

 

[oliver90owner]

Mr.D will have done a deal with Omlet

As far as I am led to believe, and it is 'directly from the horse's mouth' so as to speak, Robin Dartington is far more interested in his hive design being accepted more universally than has been the case in the past few years, rather than selling out his copyright. He has been delighted, I am sure, to have the plastic beehaus constructed to conform with his copyright criteria.

This would appear to mean that plans for home construction of the Dartington long deep hive (and it's variants) will still be available from him along with his useful manual of 'new beekeeping'. Both these presentations are based around his design (obviously the plans are very specific!).

Once one hive is made - there are a lot of individual pieces to cut, some accurately square and to close dimensions - any further are just a doddle to construct.

Robin did pass to me the details of the constructor (in High Wycombe) who is currently manufacturing hives to his copyright specifications.

Hope this might clear up any misconceptions re the copyrights for the Dartington designed hives and any domain names.

Regards, RAB

 

[Haughton Honey]

Then I am corrected. Apologies.

Are the designs available o90o, as I'd quite like to operate a Dartington.

Is the High Wycombe supplier the same person in the link posted earlier on in this thread?

 

[mikethebee]

LAST YEARS Australian imported queens!! first inspection 1st week of April far advanced than all the others.

 

[TBRNoTB]

Hi
I was under the impression that to burn the hive is the only thing to do if you have American/ European Foul Brood?
Roadster

 

[RoofTops]

Roadster, The foulbrood guide has been re-issued by Fera and on page 30 it clearly states "Brood boxes, supers, queen excluders and other bee-keeping equipment, which have been thoroughly cleaned, of all wax and propolis can be effectively sterilised* by using commercial disinfectants (e.g. bleach, Virkon S and others)."

It does not cover how the wax and propolis are to be removed but hot washing soda removes propolis, although it takes time. The most effective I have found is a solution of caustic soda. A 5% solution was used on poly hives in the recent outbreak in Scotland.

The guide does contradict itself in places as elsewhere it talks about hives needing to be given the blow torch treatment, but I take the context to be wooden hives only as the section about chemical sterilisation is very clear in my view. In the same section it mentions AFB so it is not referring to EFB only.

*my italics

 

[RoofTops]

See below for details. The section referred to above is halfway down the right hand column.

 

[BKF Admin]

I can see why those using Plastic/Poly hives would be more than happy to sterilize after an outbreak as per guidlines but personaly I would burn everything to be on the safe side.

The Defra guide is just that,a guide.

 

[RoofTops]

Yes, although burning them in the open remains a problem. However, the beefarmer in Scotland said he would still stick with poly hives if they had to be burned as the extra honey he gets from them would pay for the cost of replacement. I wouldn't go so far as to say poly hives should be considered disposable in the event of AFB but given the few cases there are of AFB these days (about a 100 I think this year in England) compared to an estimated 30,000 colonies* lost every winter from other causes the risks are low.

*From Forum discussion at Buckfast Bee Day yesterday. The estimate was half of these are down to poor varroa control.

 

[BKF Admin]

*From Forum discussion at Buckfast Bee Day yesterday. The estimate was half of these are down to poor varroa control.

Thats interesting,makes you think if varroa control could be a catalist for CCD?

 

[RoofTops]

I think this very much a possibility even though early conclusions ruled varroa out. A common thread amongst CCD hives was the bees had at least 4 viruses. How did these viruses get there? Varroa is certainly a strong suspect in my view. Even though the beekeepers may have subsequently controlled the varroa the viruses would have remained and they can be transmitted from Drone to Queen to Egg. (Another BBD snippet from Dr Max Watkins of Vita (Europe) Ltd.)