Newly aggressive bees

[elainemary]

The bees have gone from 'very quiet' to 'quite agressive' after the move. WHY? What is it about the new site that is riling them?

I think it’s down to a young queen in a previous hive with mellow bees, her own bees were nurse bees and so less aggressive initially. As the new queen now has all her own bees this is now a good indication what she’s like - aggressive / tetchy.
I have exactly the same problem in one hive of mine. New queen in a Nuc seemed nice and quiet. I united her to a queenless hive which had previously been ok. As time went on they started to ping my veil and follow. I will be pinching the queen.

I have a hive on the stand next to it, which is strong. I have been wondering whether to pinch the aggressive queen and unite it to the hive next door - would result in double brood with c12 frames brood if done as soon as weather warms up again. However is this likely to result in v early swarm preparations… OPTION 1

Or
Move the tetchy hive to one side, allow the flying bees to return to the nicer strong hive thus boosting it for the spring flow. Take away the tetchy hive, pinch the queen and use it as a queenless cell raiser once mature drones are flying. However is there any risk that the tetchy flying bees kill the nicer queen next door? OPTION 2

If you’re reading this thread and have the experience, which option would you go for and why?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

taking away the tetchy hive, pinching the queen and using it as a queenless cell raiser

Thus creating an absolutely vicious queenless colony

 

[enrico]

I think it’s down to a young queen in a previous hive with mellow bees, her own bees were nurse bees and so less aggressive initially. As the new queen now has all her own bees this is now a good indication what she’s like - aggressive / tetchy.
I have exactly the same problem in one hive of mine. New queen in a Nuc seemed nice and quiet. I united her to a queenless hive which had previously been ok. As time went on they started to ping my veil and follow. I will be pinching the queen.

I have a hive on the stand next to it, which is strong. I have been wondering whether to pinch the aggressive queen and unite it to the hive next door - would result in double brood with c12 frames brood if done as soon as weather warms up again. However is this likely to result in v early swarm preparations… OPTION 1

Or
Move the tetchy hive to one side, allow the flying bees to return to the nicer strong hive thus boosting it for the spring flow. Take away the tetchy hive, pinch the queen and use it as a queenless cell raiser once mature drones are flying. However is there any risk that the tetchy flying bees kill the nicer queen next door? OPTION 2

If you’re reading this thread and have the experience, which option would you go for and why?

Yes to option 1
No to option 2

 

[Erichalfbee]

Move the tetchy hive to one side, allow the flying bees to return to the nicer strong hive thus boosting it for the spring flow. Take away the tetchy hive, pinch the queen and use it as a queenless cell raiser once mature drones are flying. However is there any risk that the tetchy flying bees kill the nicer queen next door? OPTION 2

Aren’t you supposed to have a strong hive with lots of nurse bees as a cell raiser?
And won’t they be mighty angry?

 

[Clivewoodford]

It could be that the Queen was mated by an aggressive drone and has now started using his sperm. I had a colony that did this 3 years ago they went from a colony that I could inspect without a suit or gloves to one that would start bumping me 50m away, fortunately it was mid summer so requeening was not a problem.

 

[thorn]

Have you any oil seed **** in the area?

 

[drex]

How were they when you looked in?

It could be that the Queen was mated by an aggressive drone and has now started using his sperm. I had a colony that did this 3 years ago they went from a colony that I could inspect without a suit or gloves to one that would start bumping me 50m away, fortunately it was mid summer so requeening was not a problem.

It doesn't work that way. The sperm is mixed up in the spermatheca, not used sequentially. Hence the workers are all a mix of patrilines, which improves diversity and hence colony well-being

 

[Finman]

It is not rare that one day you get an angry hive to your apiary. Buy a new mated queen...
.

 

[JamezF]

It doesn't work that way. The sperm is mixed up in the spermatheca, not used sequentially. Hence the workers are all a mix of patrilines, which improves diversity and hence colony well-being

It takes time for that to happen though, so I've read. So it may presumably be possible to get "batches" of workers with the same patriline from a recently mated queen, though the longer it is since she was mated the less likely it is to occur.

James

 

[elainemary]

Yes to option 1
No to option 2

Agree, cell raiser bad idea, they don’t sting (at the moment), just bounce off veil, so on the Richter scale of aggression probably not as bad as some I’ve read about on here. So won’t be difficult to dispatch the queen and I’m not at all phased by that

As another option I have a couple of spare over wintered double Nucs in another apiary, that are sister queens to the one in question, same age, similar in size but nice and calm.

Would you cage the queen you’re uniting to the queenless portion, or in your experience do they unite quite smoothly? Never had to deal with a tetchy hive before, so any other tips / advice appreciated please ….

 

[enrico]

Agree, cell raiser bad idea, they don’t sting (at the moment), just bounce off veil, so on the Richter scale of aggression probably not as bad as some I’ve read about on here. So won’t be difficult to dispatch the queen and I’m not at all phased by that

As another option I have a couple of spare over wintered double Nucs in another apiary, that are sister queens to the one in question, same age, similar in size but nice and calm.

Would you cage the queen you’re uniting to the queenless portion, or in your experience do they unite quite smoothly? Never had to deal with a tetchy hive before, so any other tips / advice appreciated please ….

I would put my nuc in a brood box and simply combine over newspaper after dispatching the queen.

 

[elainemary]

I would put my nuc in a brood box and simply combine over newspaper after dispatching the queen.

Ok thanks

 

[elainemary]

Aren’t you supposed to have a strong hive with lots of nurse bees as a cell raiser?
And won’t they be mighty angry?

Yes usually re nurse bees, though it depends how many cells you are raising. I was considering a way of requeening without uniting to another colony and risks associated with this.
It has 5-6 frames brood now so by the time it warms up and drone cells are appearing it would work as a queenless cell raiser for a small number of cells. Take everyone’s point though about making it more tetchy, though I thought I could handle that, tucked away in a corner of my large garden. Only takes 4 days from grafting v young larva, when cells can be removed to an incubator and a queen cell left behind to requeen the tetchy colony.
Like to explore all options before deciding best course of action