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Back to the original post...

I try to be pleasant and positive but even with this premise, have snapped back a sharp retort a few days ago. (You know who you are..sorry again.)

I apologise and will try harder. Can we all try harder?
Cazza
 
Actually I think the atmosphere has improved greatly since the pesticides & environment section went incognito and a few agitators were banned.

For too long that section was used as a soapbox by those wanting to broadcast their views. The danger that I perceived was that a superficial Google search was likely to turn up lots of this biased, unrepresentative material. It felt like a vocal minority were using repetition to attempt to give themselves credibility as spokespersons for beekeeping, bees, and beekeepers.

I for one felt it very important to try to return balance and to dispel the notion that these zealots were speaking for us. Others felt it better to ignore and hope they would go away. My driving concern was the scenario of a novice beekeeper reading the dubious material and, seeing no dissent, assuming that it must be correct.

What poured petrol on the flames was the tone of certain of the prominent antis: either agree with us, or be shouted down as corrupt. Democracy? Debate? More like dictation. Apparently there was no leeway for individuals to make up their own minds, or to inhabit a broad grey area of 'concerned but not convinced'; instead we apparently had to choose black or white, and if we chose white, we would be shouted down. I felt the best way to expose such unpleasantness was to engage and draw out the motivations of this minority. In doing so, my view of them went from "amusing cranks" to "deeply offensive individuals" as I saw that they felt any and all actions were justified by the "higher morals" of their cause, aided no doubt by the anonymity of a keyboard warrior.

Have I contributed to the unpleasant tone of this place? Yes, most definitely. But ask yourself if you'd have been happy with the zealots continuing to style themselves as the voice of beekeepers, whilst bullying and shouting down all dissenters...?
 
Well put and thanks Dan........ I have put you on the "Roll of Great British Beekeepers"

Now as you put it...... can we get back to the "Grey" areas of beekeeping.. where controversy rages, and pleasant banter prevails!
 
That's how this forum works, like it or lump it, that's what one of them members said to me today !!!!!!

There is the option that you could always go and start your own forum and whinge on there about this one...

Just what do you want?

So you started a thread about a problem you had... You had your say.. You were given advice, but you had to keep on about it....

Admin closed the thread so you started another one.........which was a bit pointless because if you had given it a bit of thought you would have known that Admin would also close that one.......and the next one.

Do you want everybody to start a campaign against Admin and take him to the Court of Human Rights?

Its his forum........Very laid back, but there has to be a point at which a line is drawn regarding what you write about somebody and their alleged trading activities, and about your dealings with them. Admin is the person responsible for allowing anything you say to be entered into the public domain, therefore he is the newspaper editor...
 
Back to the original post...

I try to be pleasant and positive but even with this premise, have snapped back a sharp retort a few days ago. (You know who you are..sorry again.)

I apologise and will try harder. Can we all try harder?
Cazza

That's all right cazza I forgive you
:icon_204-2::icon_204-2::icon_204-2:
( that was meant as a joke I hope it wasn't me!!!!!!!):hairpull:
 
Actually I think the atmosphere has improved greatly since the pesticides & environment section went incognito and a few agitators were banned.

For too long that section was used as a soapbox by those wanting to broadcast their views. The danger that I perceived was that a superficial Google search was likely to turn up lots of this biased, unrepresentative material. It felt like a vocal minority were using repetition to attempt to give themselves credibility as spokespersons for beekeeping, bees, and beekeepers.

I for one felt it very important to try to return balance and to dispel the notion that these zealots were speaking for us. Others felt it better to ignore and hope they would go away. My driving concern was the scenario of a novice beekeeper reading the dubious material and, seeing no dissent, assuming that it must be correct.

What poured petrol on the flames was the tone of certain of the prominent antis: either agree with us, or be shouted down as corrupt. Democracy? Debate? More like dictation. Apparently there was no leeway for individuals to make up their own minds, or to inhabit a broad grey area of 'concerned but not convinced'; instead we apparently had to choose black or white, and if we chose white, we would be shouted down. I felt the best way to expose such unpleasantness was to engage and draw out the motivations of this minority. In doing so, my view of them went from "amusing cranks" to "deeply offensive individuals" as I saw that they felt any and all actions were justified by the "higher morals" of their cause, aided no doubt by the anonymity of a keyboard warrior.

Have I contributed to the unpleasant tone of this place? Yes, most definitely. But ask yourself if you'd have been happy with the zealots continuing to style themselves as the voice of beekeepers, whilst bullying and shouting down all dissenters...?


I try not to engage in the 'pharma' debate, simply because I'm not scientific enough to hold a detailed opinion either way, so :iagree:
 
Have I contributed to the unpleasant tone of this place? Yes, most definitely. But ask yourself if you'd have been happy with the zealots continuing to style themselves as the voice of beekeepers, whilst bullying and shouting down all dissenters...?

Hmmm ... having been the recipient of some of your more direct rebuttals one may think kettles and saucepans ?
 
Actually I think the atmosphere has improved greatly since the pesticides & environment section went incognito and a few agitators were banned.

For too long that section was used as a soapbox by those wanting to broadcast their views. The danger that I perceived was that a superficial Google search was likely to turn up lots of this biased, unrepresentative material. It felt like a vocal minority were using repetition to attempt to give themselves credibility as spokespersons for beekeeping, bees, and beekeepers.

I for one felt it very important to try to return balance and to dispel the notion that these zealots were speaking for us. Others felt it better to ignore and hope they would go away. My driving concern was the scenario of a novice beekeeper reading the dubious material and, seeing no dissent, assuming that it must be correct.

What poured petrol on the flames was the tone of certain of the prominent antis: either agree with us, or be shouted down as corrupt. Democracy? Debate? More like dictation. Apparently there was no leeway for individuals to make up their own minds, or to inhabit a broad grey area of 'concerned but not convinced'; instead we apparently had to choose black or white, and if we chose white, we would be shouted down. I felt the best way to expose such unpleasantness was to engage and draw out the motivations of this minority. In doing so, my view of them went from "amusing cranks" to "deeply offensive individuals" as I saw that they felt any and all actions were justified by the "higher morals" of their cause, aided no doubt by the anonymity of a keyboard warrior.

Have I contributed to the unpleasant tone of this place? Yes, most definitely. But ask yourself if you'd have been happy with the zealots continuing to style themselves as the voice of beekeepers, whilst bullying and shouting down all dissenters...?


Summary: Valid adverse opinion frustrates so seeking solace in politics?
 
Has he got a split personality?:)
Should aways read the rest of the posts first!
 
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You are right, two morals I live by, Speak to others as you wish to be spoken to, and If you don't have anything good to say keep quiet

:iagree: Put another way "Closed mouth gathers no feet"
 
Putting comments in print often comes across completely different that they would chatting to your mates over a pint in the pub. you cant see the cheeky grin on the posters face when he calls you a plonker.

I try not to take too much notice of comments which on the face of it could be taken the wong way. As long as no one insults me i try not to rise to the odd mickey take or sarcy comment. i am sure people are not as bitter as they sometimes seem.

On the other hand most hobbies (of which i have 2 or 3) often have a couple of folks who relish the opportunity to make people look silly. Again I just dont answer them or contibute to the vitriol.

But for the experiences beeks i realise that it can get frustrating when people ask the same silly questions. Bit like being stuck behind a learner driver saying "Hurry up out the way you prat"

I am afraid you will have to bear with us as we ask for the best of reasons


Phill
 

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