LANTRA qualification

[Easy Beesy]

Posted this on 'courses' section but I thought I'd try it here too.

What do members think of the latest BBKA Education push - the level 1 award in beekeeping awarded by LANTRA?

Eb

 

[HelenX]

It very much depends on who has designed it and why. If it has been written by beekeepers for beginners, and it is just another name for a beginners course, but with a qualification, then it sounds like a good idea.

On the other hand - if it is really Level 1 in the National Qulifications sense, and if it has been designed mainly to attract government funding as a recognised qualification, there is a danger that it won't be worth the paper it is written on for 'real' beekeepers (IMHO).

From memory, Level 1 vocational courses are designed for people who need skills, but will always be supervised at work. Level 2 is the course that most 16 year-olds would start with after GCSE. It should equip them to work without supervision, and at Level 3 they should be able to take decisions and supervise others once they have the experience. If beekeeping were a paid job, and I were the boss, I would not want someone trained to Level 1 anywhere near my bees!

It follows that I would not feel the need to gain a Level 1 qual, even though I am happy to describe myself as a beginner. If there was a Level 2 course, folowed by a Level 3, it would sound more useful

I hate to be cynical, but I have a horrible feeling that it will pay Lantra nicely to run it, whether it is useful or not.

No doubt others will disagree!
Helen

 

[MuswellMetro]

Posted this on 'courses' section but I thought I'd try it here too.

What do members think of the latest BBKA Education push - the level 1 award in beekeeping awarded by LANTRA?

Eb

NVQ level 1 ,sorry but i am a bit dismissive of such vocational qualifiactions aimed at intended for prospective workers in the beekeeping industry , it is below the BBKA basic qualification and most workers in a commercial setting would pick up more information than is taught in the course by following a beekeeper

http://www.lantra-awards.co.uk/training/beekeeping.aspx

and as per attached pdf


how many commercial beekeeping assistants will be trained every year....will we all need to have it to sell honey to retialer like the NVQ level2 Food manufacturer and processing hygiene certificate that some councils are saying beekeepers should have before the process honey for retail sale

 

[dpearce4]

This qualification is an excellent route for learners who wish to formally accredit their knowledge and skills within a work related environment.

Who is the Qualification for?
Those who are entering the industry or seeking to formalise existing experience will find the Level 1 Award in Introduction to Beekeeping Qualification beneficial. The Qualification gives learners the skills and knowledge they need to make the craft of beekeeping a sustainable activity and improve the quality of beekeeping.

The Qualification offers:

•An outline of the biology, lifecycle and behaviour of the honey bee, including interaction with plants and crops
•An introduction to the appearance of a healthy hive, the basic indications of serious pests and diseases, and how to manage infestations
•An introduction to the hygiene of a honey bee colony, techniques to prevent the transmission of disease and the management of equipment
•Practical beekeeping skills, including the set-up and use of equipment and the interpretation of the colony, and seasonal skills such as winter preparation, spring growth, swarm management and honey production
•Skills for dealing with the removal of honey from beehives and the extraction and preparation of honey for sale
•General health and safety advice for the hive, equipment use, how to deal with beestings and skills for record keeping and customer service



this is the quote from the lantra website and i have attached the course outline as a PDF.

maybe someone can look at it and see what they think.

 

[dpearce4]

MM

you were quicker than me lol lol lol

 

[MuswellMetro]

MM

you were quicker than me lol lol lol

only because I discussed it last night and knew were the pdf was

i think it is just jumping on a band wagon, perhaps Weald Place Farm bees should have had an NVQ level 3 before he starter selling bees though

 

[dpearce4]

you know thier website is still there.

 

[HelenX]

NVQ level 1 ,sorry but i am a bit dismissive of such vocational qualifiactions aimed at intended for prospective workers in the beekeeping industry , it is below the BBKA basic qualification and most workers in a commercial setting would pick up more information than is taught in the course by following a beekeeper



how many commercial beekeeping assistants will be trained every year....

- Are there many in the country anyway?

will we all need to have it to sell honey to retialer like the NVQ level2 Food manufacturer and processing hygiene certificate that some councils are saying beekeepers should have before the process honey for retail sale

- Lantra and their colleagues in the training industry are all too keen to lobby for their qualifications to become compulsory. It looks as though almost a third of this one is either Health and Safety or Food Safety! Just the sort of thing that could be pushed through

I note:

The introduction (This qualification is an excellent route for learners who wish to formally accredit their knowledge and skills within a work related environment) is standard NVQ speak and can be found in the intro to all of them

The "what are the benefits" bit in the leaflet is also typical of these things - it suggests that this course is all you need to start a beekeeping business - not true of a level 1 course in anything! (I don't think hairdressers get to cut hair until they are doing Level 2!)


Unit 1 - A summary of the relationship - "Bees need nectar and they pollinate plants"
Unit 2 - An outline of the lifecycle - "egg, larva, pupa, adult" and colony structure - "workers, drones, and queen"
Unit 3 - The only unit which is assessed hands-on
Unit 4 - "practical guidance" not "practical instruction"
Unit 5 - mind you don't cut yourself with the hivetool - don't site the hives too close to a footpath - if you get to collect a swarm keep people out of the way
Unit 6 - "awareness" of food safety


I am convinced that I learned much more than this on my beginners course, and that this course is just a way for the training industry to make money. They have sold their service to the BBKA, just as any other commercial organisation sells to potential customers.

Sorry to go on - this will be so oversimplified that it will be worthless. If it were to become compulsory it will cost £100 and make a fortune for those delivering it.

 

[MuswellMetro]

you know thier website is still there.

And so i expect is the EFB, i can see WPF (phoenix) ltd or ALLDIS Bees Ltd starting up in May 2012 he must be able to get the £400 new capital from someone to start a new company

 

[dpearce4]

And so i expect is the EFB, i can see WPF (phoenix) ltd or ALLDIS Bees Ltd starting up in May 2012 he must be able to get the £400 new capital from someone to start a new company

God i hope not.

I was one of the lucky ones i looked at their site when i was looking to start up, luckily i ended up buying all my equip second hand from a forum member on here, who was based in yorkshire and retiring.

 

[Chris B]

Well here's the oddest thing of all. Surely NVQ's are all about skills needed for the workplace? Yet this whole thing has been devised in conjunction with the BBKA not the Bee Farmers Association who are the relevant professional body.
When I get to the point I need to employ somebody, that said person will not be doing artificial swarms, collecting swarms, siting hives/apiaries, disease inspections, record keeping. They might do a limited amount of brood inspection during swarm season, destroying any queen cells found. They will certainly be doing hard physical work, extracting, and kit maintenance. Not a huge amount of skillset overlap with the LANTRA course.

 

[dpearce4]

i am wondering if its more aimed at the school setting?

the 14-16 programs run by colleges for pupils that are interested in land based studies? who wont be taking more academic subjects. i know we send pupils on these courses and maybe it could be used in that setting and is not actually aimed at people like us?

that maybe why it has the credits, they can link into btec and AQA units.

 

[beebreeder]

When I get to the point I need to employ somebody, that said person will not be doing artificial swarms, collecting swarms, siting hives/apiaries, disease inspections, record keeping. They might do a limited amount of brood inspection during swarm season, destroying any queen cells found. They will certainly be doing hard physical work, extracting, and kit maintenance. Not a huge amount of skillset overlap with the LANTRA course.
__________________

No doubt if the BFA had been involved it would be totally differently structured, apprentiships in beekeeping would be the way forward, with students learning on the job and as Chris says "a lot of hard physical labour" if they can stick that in mid June-August in a hot sticky beesuit then they may be made of the right stuff, oh and getting stung regularly as well and not that well paid, its a lifestyle not a 9-5 job
Kev

 

[jezd]

They will certainly be doing hard physical work, extracting, and kit maintenance. Not a huge amount of skillset overlap with the LANTRA course.

Ditto, doing this here and you are 100% right as the first thing you do is let them get on with the easy tasks you can assign with little risk involved.

99% of ppl have no idea of the volume of hard graft involved.

 

[Poly Hive]

Yes but how many here have humped 60 hives at 2am whilst in a cloud of midges, walking over heather with the hives?

Driven all night moving hives, extracted until three am to ensure enough supers.. sorry makes me laugh.

PH

 

[tonybloke]

has anyone on here actually taken a LANTRA course of any description?
I have, (chainsaw) and it was very thorough!

as to the point of this course.............................???????

 

[ebee]

Will this reduce my BBKA module exams to junk status?

 

[HelenX]

has anyone on here actually taken a LANTRA course of any description?
I have, (chainsaw) and it was very thorough!

as to the point of this course.............................???????

Yes - in the distant past when it was still the Agricultural Training Board. Most of their courses are good - it is the "Level 1" label and NVQ style format that puts me off this one - I still think it has been written to suit the lavel, not to suit real beekeeping.
H

 

[HelenX]

Will this reduce my BBKA module exams to junk status?

From what I have hard so far about the BBKA exams, they are in a different league altogether to this course. We need to make sure that this does not take over (I don't know how though!)
H

 

[Easy Beesy]

I was hoping this might be the 1st in a list of courses that would progress into ones that would be useful for commercial breeders or honey farmers delivered by said breeders or farmers so it would be targeted towards the skills needed for the industry but it sounds like everyone is pretty sceptical about being of use to anyone.