Free sugar

[REDWOOD]

looks like Cornwall and Devon beekeepers will be getting free sugar for their bees
https://www.farminguk.com/Newscategory/Bees-and-Beekeeping

 

[For want of a better word]

looks like Cornwall and Devon beekeepers will be getting free sugar for their bees
https://www.farminguk.com/Newscategory/Bees-and-Beekeeping

Before everyone makes a beeline to their local Tesco store ... this is a special arrangement that has been negotiated for the BIPCo bee breeding group in Cornwall, as a local initiative to help the threatened local native Cornish black honeybee and save it from possible extinction due to introgression and gene dilution from fashionable imported varieties of honeybee.
This may possibly be rolled out by Tesco stores nationally to other BIBBA local native honeybee beebreeding groups.

May be worth approaching Waitrose and see if they have a few split bags to spare?

Yeghes da

 

[Hivemaker.]

as a local initiative to help the threatened local native Cornish black honeybee and save it from possible extinction

Great idea, hopefully it will keep them alive long enough for them to become better adapted at collecting honey/nectar.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Before everyone makes a beeline to their local Tesco store ... this is a special arrangement that has been negotiated for the BIPCo bee breeding group in Cornwall, as a local initiative to help the threatened local native Cornish black honeybee and save it from possible extinction due to introgression and gene dilution from fashionable imported varieties of honeybee.
This may possibly be rolled out by Tesco stores nationally to other BIBBA local native honeybee beebreeding groups.

May be worth approaching Waitrose and see if they have a few split bags to spare?

Yeghes da

Not read the bit in the other current thread about genetic mixing in the whole of the UK?

 

[yeogi75]

maybe I can get some for my middle shires old English black bees

 

[Little John]

Before a local initiative to help the threatened local native Cornish black honeybee and save it from possible extinction due to introgression and gene dilution from fashionable imported varieties of honeybee.

How exactly is Tesco's sugar going to prevent introgression and gene dilution - does it possess some magical properties ?

Just more bailing-out of a leaky boat.
LJ

 

[For want of a better word]

Usual expected sarcy claptrap from the great unwashed as soon as native bees are mentioned!

Nos da

 

[yeogi75]

mine are native breed to my area how can anyone say other wise without proof and isolation breeding , don't you have other breeds, open breeding are mongrels no matter what you say

 

[Little John]

Usual expected sarcy claptrap from the great unwashed as soon as native bees are mentioned!

Sarcastic ? Not at all. Free sugar is an economic stimulant - but bees don't do economics. Therefore free sugar, or any other such artificial aid won't change the eventual genetic outcome.

If a bee needs such financial support to survive, it really doesn't say a great deal for it. If the bee was attractive to beekeepers, then it would be flourishing without such support being needed.

There is a quote in the christian bible, along the lines of "Render unto Caeser that which is Caeser's, and unto god, that which is god's." - or words to that effect.

Financial support is the stuff of Caeser; genetic isolation is the stuff of god's - well, Nature's anyway.

It's not free sugar you guys need, it's a protected zone. But you don't have one - and without one the outcome is predictable - hence my reference to a 'leaky boat' (which is destined to sink).

LJ

 

[PBee]

...... genetic isolation is the stuff of god's - well, Nature's anyway......
LJ

Northern Poland is inhabited by native Apis mellifera mellifera (AMM) and the non-native A. m. carnica (AMC) which was introduced by beekeepers. However, hybrids between the two subspecies of honey bee are relatively rare. The lower than expected proportion of hybrids is hypothesised to be related to reproductive isolation between AMM and AMC. To verify this hypothesis, we allowed the AMM and AMC queens to be naturally inseminated in an area inhabited by both AMM and AMC drones. Genotype of the queens and their sexual partners were derived based on random samples of their worker offspring. Assignment of parental genotypes to the two subspecies was performed with a Bayesian clustering method. In colonies headed by AMM queens, workers were fathered mainly by AMM drones. On the other hand, in colonies headed by AMC queens workers were fathered by drones of both subspecies. The partial reproductive isolation reported here between AMM and AMC may facilitate conservation of the declining population of AMM.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13592-013-0212-y

 

[Barbarian]

Months ago, I tackled my local Farmfoods store about split sugar bags. No joy. The policy is to bin.
.

 

[Beefriendly]

this is a special arrangement that has been negotiated for the BIPCo bee breeding group in Cornwall, as a local initiative to help the threatened local native Cornish black honeybee and save it from possible extinction

I suppose it dispels the myth they are thrifty with their stores....unless it goeing to be used at BIPCo tea breaks.

 

[For want of a better word]

I suppose it dispels the myth they are thrifty with their stores....unless it goeing to be used at BIPCo tea breaks.

Amm are Thrifty on their stores YES...... but......

Breeding bees uses a lot of sugar... feed for the large queen rearing colonies... for the mating apidea... for the Paynes polly nucs.... most certainly not just the Autumnal top up for Winter of the light Spring stimulating feed!!

We are not talking the 2 tins of invert bee feed the average 2 hiver uses!
... our native bee breeding program got through over 1/2 ton of the stuff last season.
Ongoing DNA surveys of the breeding colonies is providing undisputed factual provenance for the purity of the Cornish native honeybee, giving us a tool to use in the selection of our breeder queens ( and drones)

About time the TROLLS who seem to infest the bridge under the beekeepers forum, packed their bags....

BIPCo members BTW do not take sugar in tea... far too bitter to sweeten!

Myttin da

 

[For want of a better word]

Months ago, I tackled my local Farmfoods store about split sugar bags. No joy. The policy is to bin.
.

Go back and ask again.... your plea must be that you will be using it for your local beebreeding group to raise LOCAL queens to stem the despicable flow of imported stock......

NOT to feed your bees because you stole their Winter stores!

( My own small Beefarming business got through an IBC FULL of invert plus 850kg of granulated sugar.... which came from Waitrose and Aldi* as it was the cheapest per kg I could find at the time!

* other supermarkets, wholesalers and suppliers also sell sugar

Myttin da

 

[yeogi75]

bibba says on there web site, as near native that's not pure, if it could be found a pure race then I would love that and welcome it but no one has produced without doubt a true race, the Irish had had two tested and failed and are now going to Switzerland to get a result.

 

[yeogi75]

does any one know of a supplier who breeds certified queens with paper work in the uk

 

[birdsandbees]

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13592-013-0212-y

maybe AMM's fly quicker!

 

[Little John]

does any one know of a supplier who breeds certified queens with paper work in the uk

Well - I know of a breeder who alleges they're certified - and yes, you'll get some paper-work - but in practice they're crap (a few years back I bought two, but discovered later they'd been open-mated right next to a town with heaven-know's-what being kept there. He believes in Apiary Vicinity mating. I believe I was ripped-off.

Those turned out to be worse than the barstewards I already had. Never again. It appears that the search for 'genuine' AMM is attracting crooks, charlatans, and the self-deluded.

Perhaps the genuine breeders ought to take some note of this - for as it stands, anyone with Black Bees can advertise and sell them as genuine AMM, and get away with it.
LJ

 

[Little John]

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13592-013-0212-y

So what ? That paper compared AMM with Carnica. There's a lot more sub-groups hovering around on t'other side of the Tamar than Carnica.

We know Italians mate with AMM - that's how the Buckfast strain came into existence. And then there are countless varieties of mongrel floating around the UK - many of those being AMM-related mongrels, which are almost sure to mate freely with the Cornish bees, given half a chance.

And what if you did succeed in developing a pure - or fairly pure AMM, after decades of hard work ? All it would take is some character to arrive in your locale with a couple of boxes of Italians (which he would be perfectly entitled to do, in law) and all that work would be undone in a couple of seasons.

Considering the formation of a protected isolated area will pay far more dividends than quoting from an irrelevant paper.
LJ

 

[Quis Custodiet]

bibba says on there web site, as near native that's not pure, if it could be found a pure race then I would love that and welcome it but no one has produced without doubt a true race, the Irish had had two tested and failed and are now going to Switzerland to get a result.

My understanding is that hundreds of bees have been tested over the past four years or so and found "wanting". The testing of several bees was then conducted in Switzerland, but the results were no different. Those problems were resolved by keeping the results private and reverting back to the use of morphometry.....much more vague and safer and so problem solved!

The Irish equivalent of the Nuremberg rallies is being staged in Athlone this weekend, by the Irish Native honey bee society. I am sure they will condemn the burning of hives, the violence and intimidation conducted by their zealot supporters. Just think and reflect on all the trouble that could be avoided if one native Irish honey bee could be produced for inspection. My sister has some friends who intend to go there, so one will hear what has been done.
All the evidence to date indicates the the AMM in Ireland is descended from AMM imported from the continent in the aftermath of the Isle of Wight disease. If anyone can show this is not the case, then please do so.