Beginners effort (comments please)

[Kenson]

So, as Winter approaches, my handful of bees have grown to occupy 3 frames (and some bits) and as Mrs. G. (the Bee hating Mrs. G.) volunteered to take some photos, I hauled her down the garden with her camera.

I did light the smoker, but didn't get round to using it because, well, they didn't need it.

Anyway, as she took some photos, I thought I'd post them and just invite comments. You guys are great advisors and I would like to take on opinions.
My bees seem "normal" to me, but can you see any problems, any suggestions....

If anyone can spot the Queen, I'll be well chuffed.

2 Frames on this post, I will immediately post the other frame on the next post

 

[Kenson]

The other frame:

 

[Poly Hive]

The state of the combs is obvious so not commenting.

Have to ask though why you subjected a weak colony to this kind of treatment at this time of year?

Bit horrified really.

PH

 

[SWEET]

Maybe not a great idea dripping honey everywhere with so little bees to defend their stores :-/

 

[Kenson]

Hi Poly,

Point taken. Are you saying it would have been best left until spring?


Hi Daboss, agreed.

I am keen to let them build their own comb, but they do seem to "wander from the path" a little, now I think I would start them on foundation and move them to "Self drawn" between already drawn frames.

K

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Polyhive's comment was not useful to you but I think he meant to suggest that opening up a weak colony in cold weather is not to be recommended but I see from Dunstable's weather history that you have had some warm weather there recently so maybe no harm done.

I'm not much better than a beginner myself (bees for 4 years) but I think those bees will need help to get through the winter - there are not enough of them to form a decent cluster, if they're in a thin wooden hive. In a polynuc they might do better but there is brood there and depending how much of that they manage to bring to emergence, they might stand a chance. They will need to be in a sheltered position with as much insulation as you can find to put in or around the hive - is it a hive or a nuc?

Don't open them up again unless it's warm and you are replacing outer frames with insulation, so that they have less volume to keep warm. Put extra insulation above the box (heat rises).

In summary, they have two chances - little chance and no chance. They are simply too small.

CVB

 

[enrico]

You have very few bees there, no sign of the queen although there is brood. You need to splash out on a poly nuc and put these frames in it over winter. If it has a side feeder such as those you can by from paines then jam the feeder full of fondant before you put the frames in. Keep it sheltered and don't open it again until spring. All you can do is hope for the best. In anything other than a polynuc the bees will find it hard to cluster enough to keep warm.
You have done well to get them this far so luck may be on your side.
Let us know what has happened in the spring.
If there is any sign of robbing, which may be started by the smell of honey where you have broken the cells, then you will be in real trouble as they will have no hope of defending themselves.
Best of luck
E

 

[B+.]

They are simply too small.

All good advice.
At this time of year, the bees need to lay down the stores that will see them through the winter.
I know there is always a temptation to see what is going on in there (most of us have plagued a colony to death at some point in our beekeeping career), but, now you have to leave them alone or you won't have them in the spring.
There is only one thing you need to do now (so long as they are queen-right) and that is feed them. It takes 21 days for an egg she lays today to emerge as an adult worker capable of taking on its duties in the hive. That takes you to mid-October. So, it's not what the weather is like now. It's all about what it will be like in three weeks time (usually damp and chilly). To generate enough heat to keep the queen, and a small patch of brood she may still have, warm, the colony need lots of bees. The older ones will continue to die off but, if you prepare properly, the colony will go into winter with lots of young workers. They will not only keep the colony warm, but, forage and feed the first brood next spring. They have a lot to do.

 

[Kenson]

They are in a maisemore polynuc, with a "Miller" feeder.

When they go hunting they seem to bring almost exclusively pollen (unless they bring pollen and nectar).

I am not (and was not) planning to open the hive until at least March, and that would be if March is warm. It's why I left them alone for the last 2 months

I get it, warm and fed now

 

[masterBK]

Queen is on 2nd frame (= third photo from left in 1st set of pics on initial posting). She is relatively small for a queen , unmarked and about two inches from the left side bar halve way up the comb on sealed brood (clue to spotting her is to look for her black relatively hairless thorax). Hope you manage it but may be difficult to get them through winter even in a poly. Many might consider it not worth it.

 

[kevrhcfag]

even in a nuc I would have a tendency to just leave them 3 frames, dummy rest down insulation and bit fondant, pollen as need more bees really. Close it up, hope for a very mild winter (as has been the case the last few years) and pray.

You might be lucky and they come through, but I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you.

As an aside as its the beginners section some might be interested.

The queen is small, however in reality this is meaningless. There were so few bees she can only lay what the bees can look after, so in cases like this build up is painfully slow and can't really tell if any good or no good.

The thing to do would of been to give her some more bees if in a position to do so, if you can emerging bees. That gives them a chance to build up quicker if she is up to it. If not possible to give bees limit space to 2 or 3 frames. This would be a prime candidate to be wiped out by wasps or robbing.

 

[Kenson]

Thanks masterBK

Wrap 'em up, keep 'em warm and feed them internally, with the entrance reduced

 

[madasafish]

Thanks masterBK

Wrap 'em up, keep 'em warm and feed them internally, with the entrance reduced

A thought :
Add another layer of 50mm insulation to the roof and overlap the sides by 50mm so the rain will not splash onto the walls.(or better still make an all covering box.of insulation. A small weak colony needs every help it can get to survive..Heat loss means they will struggle...

 

[nightshade]

I'll put my neck on the line as a very new newbie....both my polynuc and swarm nuc opened last week due to the fact that they were extremely active and weather was good...

The nuc came late in season first week in August and I caught a swarm late August. .

My mentor of 60 years experience is aware we are on the cusp and end of season but needed to check what room was left as they had been pulling down stores rapidly....a new frame not drawn out was added which they drew out in a week.

The plan is to move them to full hive next week...eight frames full and still taking in pollen by the bucket load..

The swarm may transfer from a 5 frame to 8 frame polynuc with insulation also....

It's all a learning curve!

 

[Swarm]

No problem in your case Nightshade, weather is mild and your colonies sound fit and bouncing, this little lot have been nursed for some time.

 

[nightshade]

I think it's the problem with new beekeeping Steve ...do I don't I? ?.

I was convinced that they were about to burst and swarm three weeks into getting them...

It was only through opening them myself that I realised they still had a frame and a half to draw out so I was then happy to leave them for another month....

At least kenson has some advice to work on by opening and taking photos..

Worse than bringing home a new baby!!

 

[Kenson]

Yes, it's all about learning. Thanks everyone, all of those comments are useful