"Asian Hornet" seen in Cornwall

[Karol]

Hi Karol
Are you suggesting using the insecticide?custard method of killing nests?

I am indeed. Mazzamazda has greatly reduced (virtually wiped out) his VV problem having first treated last season before the sexual progeny were produced. I also understand from Mazzamazda that the method is reproducible from experience further a field.

 

[Karol]

I've just read a thought-provoking piece by Andrew Durham (Cambridge BKA) in BBKA News for September entitled "Asian Hornet - The Phoney War".

Andrew recommends selective spring trapping (until the end of May) but he makes it clear that the government has a role to play during this 'phoney war' period. He appears to be recommending legislation or regulation to ensure that responsibility of dealing with hornets is clear and unequivocal and there is an allocated budget to get these measures up and running.

For instance, what happens if hornets nests are found on private land - at present the landowner, if minded, can just ignore it and not incur the cost of destruction - there could be grants made available so that landowners have no financial incentive to ignore a nest. What happens if the nest is on public land - are budgets available to deal with it? Should local authorities be preparing lists of approved contractors to deal with these hornets on a 'schedule of rates' basis?

We have an ideal opportunity to get measures in place before the event so that we do not repeat the mistakes that the French authorities made - he who forgets mistakes of the past is doomed to repeat them.

One of my many worries about an invasion by Asian Hornets is that it might appear that beekeepers are banging the drum out of self-interest. While there may be an element of this, the threat from them is not just to honeybees - all flying insects are at risk so the food source of fish, birds, amphibians, bats, etc. could diminish. The loss of pollinators could eventually impact of our food supply as well as our wildlife.

Might I suggest that anybody who has contacts in French beekeeping tries to obtain samples of Asian Hornets for distribution around their locality. "Plenty of Honey" sent me about 40 dead AHs last year that I placed in cheap plastic containers and gave away to beekeeping groups (and SBIs) in Cornwall and west Devon - PoH has been so successful at tackling the threat in his part of Brittany that there are now no more free samples! We must try to teach beekeepers to recognise these insects instantly.

My own local group has set up an Asian Hornet Action Team to assist with the identification of suspect insects reported by local beekeepers and members of the public and I urge others local groups to do the same.

CVB

I come back to the Mazzamazda method. It requires no legislation to enter private land or force land owners to treat. Just catch treat and release and let the hornets find their own way back. Spring trapping doesn't work (if it did France would be free of VV which it isn't) because it doesn't stop the problem at source. Once the sexual progeny have left the genie is out of the bottle and the likelihood of trapping all the queens released during the prior fall is extremely remote.

 

[charlievictorbravo]

I come back to the Mazzamazda method. It requires no legislation to enter private land or force land owners to treat. Just catch treat and release and let the hornets find their own way back. Spring trapping doesn't work (if it did France would be free of VV which it isn't) because it doesn't stop the problem at source. Once the sexual progeny have left the genie is out of the bottle and the likelihood of trapping all the queens released during the prior fall is extremely remote.

If there were to be an uncontrolled incursion of Asian Hornets into my part of the UK, in the absence of anything better, I would probably use the Mazzamazda method. My ONLY concern about the method is the prospect of the dead nest of unknown location, laced with insecticide, being available in the environment for other insects and birds to feed on. It would be great if during the Phoney War, the durability of various active ingredients could be checked to make sure that after, say, 48 hours the insecticide used is no longer active enough to kill birds, insects or any other beneficial creature.

CVB

 

[Karol]

A little perspective may help.

The Mazzamazda method is quite specific. It's a custard laced with Fipronil. A hornet fed the freshly prepared concoction died. A hornet fed the same concoction 6 hours later did not die. I cannot comment on using any other pesticide as no work has been done with respect to half life. It is feasible that the concoction was poorly mixed during the test and the second hornet didn't get a toxic dose but it is unlikely.

Irrespective of the presumed half life of the formulation a miniscule amount of pesticide is used compared to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sV03lVJr94

And we have no problem dosing millions of dogs and cats with Fipronil and let them run around nor do we have any concerns about using Fipronil flea spray to spray carpets and furnishings where we pick up the pesticide on shoes and clothes and trample it outside.

I understand your concerns CVB but in reality I don't think they are grounded not compared to the ecological damage that has been done by humans introducing this invasive species into an ecological system that has not evolved to combat them.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

If there were to be an uncontrolled incursion of Asian Hornets into my part of the UK

Confirmed Velutina sighting in Fowey yesterday, NBU troops being mobilised.

 

[Karsal]

A little perspective may help.

The Mazzamazda method is quite specific. It's a custard laced with Fipronil. A hornet fed the freshly prepared concoction died. A hornet fed the same concoction 6 hours later did not die. I cannot comment on using any other pesticide as no work has been done with respect to half life. It is feasible that the concoction was poorly mixed during the test and the second hornet didn't get a toxic dose but it is unlikely.

Irrespective of the presumed half life of the formulation a miniscule amount of pesticide is used compared to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sV03lVJr94

And we have no problem dosing millions of dogs and cats with Fipronil and let them run around nor do we have any concerns about using Fipronil flea spray to spray carpets and furnishings where we pick up the pesticide on shoes and clothes and trample it outside.

I understand your concerns CVB but in reality I don't think they are grounded not compared to the ecological damage that has been done by humans introducing this invasive species into an ecological system that has not evolved to combat them.

I mentioned the use of Fiprinil to the SBI who attended one of our club meetings this year. OMG it did not have the reaction that I thought. He was absolutely scathing of it and dismissed it out of hand. He quoted that there had been reports of bees dying close to a vets in Yorkshire. On examination it had been found that bees had been drinking the urine of the dogs at the vets and taking it back to their hives. The dogs of course had been treated for fleas at the vets and the fiprinil was still present in their urine.
So it looks like it's up to the majority of beekeepers to sort out the Asian hornets ourselves.

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Confirmed Velutina sighting in Fowey yesterday, NBU troops being mobilised.

Thanks for the 'heads up'. I've left a message with the SBI (phone not available) offering the help of our Dad's Army but I suspect the NBU's protocols will not permit amateurs to get involved with the searching for a nest.

As Martin Hocking pointed out in his video, the Police can involve the public in searching for a missing child but the NBU don't want to use beekeepers' help in searching for Asian Hornets or their nest.

Don't panic Mr Mainwaring!

CVB

 

[madasafish]

Thanks for the 'heads up'. I've left a message with the SBI (phone not available) offering the help of our Dad's Army but I suspect the NBU's protocols will not permit amateurs to get involved with the searching for a nest.

As Martin Hocking pointed out in his video, the Police can involve the public in searching for a missing child but the NBU don't want to use beekeepers' help in searching for Asian Hornets or their nest.

Don't panic Mr Mainwaring!

CVB

When Asian Hornets become established, the NBU will be No B Use as they cannot cover the entire countryside.

To suggest they could deal with (say) ten simultaneous outbreaks at once with a wide geographical spread using current methods is risible. They do not have the resources.

My advice is to involve as many beekeepers now as they can so they have experienced help to call on when that occasion arises.

I cannot see ANY Government increasing spending on bees when there are so many urgent demands on resources.


Of course, IF their current method of working needs only deal with 2-3 limited outbreaks a year, it will be fine. Personally, I would plan for the worst and hope for the best...

 

[user 3509]

When Asian Hornets become established, the NBU will be No B Use as they cannot cover the entire countryside.

To suggest they could deal with (say) ten simultaneous outbreaks at once with a wide geographical spread using current methods is risible. They do not have the resources.

My advice is to involve as many beekeepers now as they can so they have experienced help to call on when that occasion arises.

I cannot see ANY Government increasing spending on bees when there are so many urgent demands on resources.


Of course, IF their current method of working needs only deal with 2-3 limited outbreaks a year, it will be fine. Personally, I would plan for the worst and hope for the best...

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

the NBU don't want to use beekeepers' help in searching for Asian Hornets or their nest.

CVB

A bit different than searching for a missing child - Bee inspectors have a statutory right to enter land and premises, volunteer beekeepers don't. It would be opening up the NBU to all kinds of litigation.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

maybe we should chip in and invest in a BFO extension lead, then send Beeno down there with her hoover to sort them out!!

 

[Ian123]

A bit different than searching for a missing child - Bee inspectors have a statutory right to enter land and premises, volunteer beekeepers don't. It would be opening up the NBU to all kinds of litigation.

In particular if Pike fell off his ladder and sued nbu for lack of training

 

[domino]

The Mazzamazda method is quite specific.

I'm waiting for some enterprising folks to create a trap that catches them live then gases them to sleep so we can paint them,

 

[madasafish]

In particular if Pike fell off his ladder and sued nbu for lack of training

The NBU could easily solve those kind of issues. No need for anyone to go up ladders until the nest is found..which is the difficult part.
And the access issue for private land is easily solved with a time limited pass issued to trained volunteers allowing the same rights of entry as a BI.




Sounds like thinking for reasons to not do it..i.e. approach of an apparatchik anxious to secure his job

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

the access issue for private land is easily solved with a time limited pass issued to trained volunteers allowing the same rights of entry as a BI.

If only things were as simplistic as that in the real world. Access to private property is (quite rightly) a pretty complex and exclusive legislation.
Bee inspector's right to access and inspect as part of their duties is rather proscriptive and covered by an act of parliament.
It's not just a matter of giving out tin deputy badges to all and sundry after a little 'training'.

 

[applejack33]

Asian hornets in Fowey

Is this genuine or a windup? Apart from on here , no word from anywhere else.

 

[user 3509]

Is this genuine or a windup? Apart from on here , no word from anywhere else.

I am afraid it is genuine. Look at the NBU site and there is also a Defra press release about it.

 

[applejack33]

Asian hornets

 

[madasafish]

If only things were as simplistic as that in the real world. Access to private property is (quite rightly) a pretty complex and exclusive legislation.
Bee inspector's right to access and inspect as part of their duties is rather proscriptive and covered by an act of parliament.
It's not just a matter of giving out tin deputy badges to all and sundry after a little 'training'.

Order in Council. Job done.

 

[Stiffy]

In particular if Pike fell off his ladder and sued nbu for lack of training

I could recommend a member of this forum to play the role of Pike when the Dads army brigade go a hunting the wee beastie
S