Candipolline Gold

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Karsal

Field Bee
Joined
Jul 16, 2013
Messages
545
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28
Location
Lancashire
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
3 Pay*es Poly Hives 7 Poly Nucs
My bees never took much syrup when I fed them at the end of the season last year. I put fondant on as well for insurance. They have been eating it and I bought some Candipolline Gold last week.
Decided to top up the fondant on one hive and added about half a pound on top of the fondant that was left. To my surprise the bees ignored the old fondant and clambered across it and began to eat the Candipolline Gold. It will be interesting to see what's consumed first.
 
My bees never took much syrup when I fed them at the end of the season last year. I put fondant on as well for insurance. They have been eating it and I bought some Candipolline Gold last week.
Decided to top up the fondant on one hive and added about half a pound on top of the fondant that was left. To my surprise the bees ignored the old fondant and clambered across it and began to eat the Candipolline Gold. It will be interesting to see what's consumed first.

This is my first second year so to speak , on this forum i used Candipollen gold, the bees have went through around 3/4 kg of the stuff since last October and they seem to be doing ok, one member on here says its a rip off price wise because fondant is cheaper, my bee's love it all the same so i will keep using it.
 
My bees never took much syrup when I fed them at the end of the season last year. I put fondant on as well for insurance. They have been eating it and I bought some Candipolline Gold last week.
Decided to top up the fondant on one hive and added about half a pound on top of the fondant that was left. To my surprise the bees ignored the old fondant and clambered across it and began to eat the Candipolline Gold. It will be interesting to see what's consumed first.

My understanding is that Candipolline is primarily a pollen replacement for protein-feeding. Bees need protein in the spring when brooding starts in earnest so feeding them with Candipolline over winter is a bit of a waste of money. The dear-departed Finman uses a protein-rich feed just in advance of start of the season. His reason is to get the bees brooding early so that they are already expanded when the first flow comes along. There is quite a lot of carbohydrate (sugars, etc) in the Candipolline mix so maybe the bees prefer the sticky mix of sugars and protein rather than the bland fondant.

CVB
 
Candipoline is DEFINATELY NOT a pollen replacement and anyone selling it as such has no idea about the nutrition requirements of honeybees or the nutrient analysis of that product.

Don't rely on that to boost brood production, it wont have any significant effect.

The best of a bad bunch of pollen supplements available is Mann Lake Ultra Bee.
 
It's sold as a pollen supplement although the actual pollen % wont be high (I don't think it is in any of the fondant pollen mixes unless you make your own)

The bees do take it down as the pollen acts as an appetite stimulant

An expensive way to feed if you have more than a few hives but it has its place
eg if you get a long cold spring with little pollen around & you haven't kept pollen from last year, you might use it to promote brood rearing.
 
I am always VERY wary of giving bees anything that is not plain simple sugars in winter or late autumn.

Anything else accumulates in the gut of the wintering bees most of the time and accelerates the need for defecation. In a long cold winter period of confinement that is dangerous.

Different matter in spring, but as a winter feed I would not use it.

Then there is the price................four times the cost of fondant, which is clean and reliable. However....there is only 1.5% pollen anyway......not a huge amount for so large a price difference.

Have experimented with most of these things over the years (not this one...so will try some this spring) but have yet to find one that is worth the investment and effort.
 
Mix fondant with smooth peanut butter.... smells just as bad!!!

Yeghes da

I am always interested in getting protein into my winter bees. Have you tried this yourself?

UK artificial pollen recipes bang on about "defatted soya flour" and yet the Americans are happily feeding "grease patties".

So why not add a bit of vegetable protein and oil?

I take ITLD's point about not feeding any solids early on, but could it work as an early spring treat?

My lot were busy working the snowdrops this morning - even in Yorkshire - but I am sure that extra protein could help the spring build up.
 
UK artificial pollen recipes bang on about "defatted soya flour" and yet the Americans are happily feeding "grease patties".

So why not add a bit of vegetable protein and oil?

I take ITLD's point about not feeding any solids early on, but could it work as an early spring treat?

Grease patties are not for food, they are for medication. The bees don't like them and remove them, hence distributing merely the grease or the active ingredient (ie Thymol) that may have been mixed into them. The sugar ingredient in many recipes is to make them more appealing and workable for the bees.

Its not solid feeding I shy away from, after all bees do very well on fondant, its the addition of more difficult to digest solids. Feeding bees of all ages the food that contains an ingredient best handle by bees adapted to a task that uses it (such as working pollen into brood food)

If the price of this product is reflecting the value of the added pollen then pollen is £90 a kilo....ouch......even in little packs irradiated pollen is only about £11 a kilo.

Pollen dearths are actually very rare in much of the UK.....I hear about them (especially on sites like this) far more than I have ever seen them. I think we have needed to supplement the incoming pollen only twice in the last 20 years, and even then not on all our apiaries.
 
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If the price of this product is reflecting the value of the added pollen then pollen is £90 a kilo....ouch......even in little packs irradiated pollen is only about £11 a kilo.

Pollen dearths are actually very rare in much of the UK.....I hear about them (especially on sites like this) far more than I have ever seen them. I think we have needed to supplement the incoming pollen only twice in the last 20 years, and even then not on all our apiaries.

From what little I know of commercial beekeeping, I would tend to agree with you as far as the UK is concerned. Beekeepers in parts of Australia have regular heavy flow from trees and native plants that don't produce pollen so the commercial boys feed a pollen supplement. The Australian Government produced a really interesting but long book called Fat Bees Skinny Bees - a manual on honey bee nutrition for beekeepers. The recipes in there suggest ingredients as follows:
A recipe may thus look like this:
Pollen 10–25%
Soy flour 20–100%
Yeast 20–25%
Sugar/honey/water 20–50%


Lots of protein and the rest carbohydrate (sugars).

I spent a while trying to find a source of irradiated pollen in the UK but could not find any. Where is it available for £11 a kilo?

CVB
 
Yes, we have made patties like that ourselves in the past, a lot of messy work, but in the end the ones given it and the ones not given it were indistinguishable. Similar performance, similar harvest.
The Australians have a special difficulty as they are sometimes working crops that did not evolve in a symbiotic relationship with honeybees. They DO produce pollen (how else would their seeds be produced) but its just not nutritious enough for the honeybee which is non native. I have seen pictures of the problem and had the odd Aussie or two here seasonally, and the name they have for the problem is 'the muck'. Looks like foulbrood at times but its a nutrition issue.

The thread was started about feeding candipolline in winter, and as you will already have sussed, I don't consider it a wise investment at all. The added proteins are only minor, and they will put waste in the bees gut, so I see it........as a mid winter feed......to be overly costly and adds another risk factor. Outwith the winter period it will, at the very worst, do little harm.

The irradiated pollen I can find is not from the UK. Its Spanish. NEVER use Spanish pollen in patties unless its irradiated. There is a very high risk of AFB contamination with it so don't be tempted by the much lower price. The last offer I got was for dried (not irradiated) Spanish pollen at just below £5 per kg (but was in tonne lots in drums).

Importing pollen from outside the EU is a problematical activity. I know of one case where a guy in England had a couple of tonnes of patties refused entry from the USA due to the lack of a certificate for the pollen ingredient. Have bought from Mann Lake myself in the past (two of their pollen free versions) , and the bees took it well........or so it seemed as you could see some of the product in the pollen arc. (Apart from one spring we used it mainly when installing packages or shook swarms in dearth periods.)

However..... one time we used the patties in an apiary we placed in a disused silage pit, so all nice bare concrete. The pollen patties were going down well, but actually most of it was in tiny bits and was all over the base of the silage pit. Most of the apparently consumed patties were actually being removed by the bees and dumped outside.

It was an interesting spot, as it also showed up very clearly how many corpses the bees drag out and drop in the grass. It looked like there had been spray damage, but actually all was normal and the bees prospered there.
 
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Using pollen and or substitutes in Apidea... I have noticed that the pollen/protein/soy/peanut powder gets left in the bottom of the feeder once the bees have cleaned it out.

Before the Forum clever cloggs jump all over.... I keep spare already filled feeders as easier to change.... sometimes the bees empty them very quickly!

Yeghes da
 
Kitchen sink recipes for protein supplements will never work, and at worst may kill your colony.

Sub optimal performance caused by sub standard products may be hard to detect initially, but will surface eventually. The symptoms and outcomes often blamed on other factors than the feed.

To produce a product that will be effective and safe for your bees takes a lot of science, skill and technology.

Consider the following

Can they physically consume it - particle size, sub **0 microns.
Acceptability - will they eat it rather than dispose of it.
Digestibility - can they utilise it.
Is it safe for them - limit anti-nutritional factors & mitigate antagonists
Is it nutritionally balanced - Protein, Carbohydrates, Fats & oils, Sugars, Minerals, Vitamins, Trace elements.
Are limiting factors met - The AA's, Tryptophan & Isoleucine, is the PH within range.

These are just a few of the things that need to be right, before we even get down to the nitty gritty of manufacture which is extremely energy intensive & expensive.
 
Round here, we have huge pollen surpluses in summer and combs become pollen clogged...
 
Round here, we have huge pollen surpluses in summer and combs become pollen clogged...

Here too. Unless going for matings in sub optimal periods....like April...we NEVER have a pollen shortage for mating nucs.


file:///C:/Users/Murray/Pictures/2015-08-30/004.jpg

A more common problem than a dearth.

However.......there were times in the poor weather last year that the pollen stores in our mating yard only were running a bit thin, so this year, rather than get involved with supplements, we have taken another resource rich location and are dividing the mating unit into two halves.

As for using the wrong grade of ingredients or particle size? This was, apart from long before when I did not correctly cost the labour, always a professionally produced product with a large body of positive reviews. Was very smooth, never grainy, and the little lumps the bees were chucking out were tiny balls and irregular fragments of the smooth product. They squeezed perfectly flat when trying to pick them up. They just wanted rid of it to a fair extent, though I am sure some was being used. A covered over tray with a few kilos of correct grade soya flour brought more attention. They went nuts on it all day but only in early spring. After that they ignored it.
 
Oops...got problems attaching picture......tried again...failed again
 
Think I'll stick with fondant

Since foragers can switch between collecting nectar and pollen, it sounds like the sensible course of action is to feed them 'ad lib' fondant and let them choose their own pollen.

I have got lots of gorse, hazel, crocuses and snowdrops in flower at the moment, so "leave well alone" strikes me as the best course of action.

As someone else pointed out, one can get a dose of 'cabin fever' and want to help even when it is not needed:)

Once again ITLD, many thanks for your sound advice.
 

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