Which hive???

[APIFAN]

Choices choices..... Being totally new to this beekeeping lark i was wondering which hive is best for a beginner,is there a hive which is an absolute must for beginners or is it simply a matter of personal preference.

 

[For want of a better word]

one with bees in is useful

I would go for a standard National with an open mesh floor..........
or if you have shed loads of disposable income some of the new ones in fantastic plastic with EVERYTHING you need would get my vote!

 

[herefordshirehoney]

Personal preference you'll get told the national is the one to go for id say, use your own gut feeling after doing a lot of reading. If you search the forum once you've decided you'll almost certainly find a thread on the advantages and disadvantages.

For me it will be a Jumbo Langstroth from MB, I did start off thinking 14x12 nationals would be the way forward. Now bear in mind the lugs are smaller in langstroth's so national poly might better however the rest of Europe copes with them!

Personally for me it will be poly's. Don't get me wrong i will probably try wood at some stage however when you look at the benefits for the bee's in my opinion it looks like to outweigh it (weight, insulation performance, etc.). Bear in mind your local association will almost tell you it's the wrong decision as a lot of them have only used poly's for breeding (well in my local association anyway). Don't be afraid to do whats others are not!

 

[Brosville]

Kenyan top bar hive (or possibly a Warré)....
If you're all out for honey production, probably a "conventional" hive, but if you're going to be a hobbyist beekeeper the TBH hives have a lot to offer

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

You'll find a lot of personal preferences here, and probably wont be any the clearer after it!

My own are 14x12 , same dimensions for supers as nationals/wbcs, plenty of expansion room so lessening chances of swarming, plenty of storage room for winter. A standard national is a safe bet for a beginner though as the frames are easier to inspect, so either of those for me.

It may be worth canvassing your local association though, if you are likely to get your bees from someone there its worth checking what they are likely to arrive on

 

[Poly Hive]

As you are discovering there is more than a few choices to make.

Lets go back to basics for a minute.

Strength? If you are fit and able then the larger hives will not be an issue for you to move, as although at the moment you are probably considering a static set up, most beekeepers at one time or another move their hives for verious reasons, another crop possibly or just basic manipulations.

When we are discussing boxes at 100lb+ this becomes a factor to consider seriously.

The Smaller hives, Smith and National are often run on "double brood box" systems to half the weight aspect most of the time but if you are hive humphing double broods then there is again a considerable weight to consider.

Given the above the first decision nowadays is what material to have the hive in. As my nick suggests I made that decision, and in fact made it many years ago as poly is just now beginning to be come more common, over the last two years really, although it has in fact been available in the UK from 1987.

The other issue is frame lug length. The National is 1.5", an length I personally find clumsy and the rest of the world manages fine with 3/4".

Anyway there is no rush so take your time as it is a very important decision.

PH

 

[drstitson]

I use both poly and wood.

National, Langstroth and LS Jumbo (dadant) - i have my reasons.

Next year am trying 14x12 with the national stocks.

Short lugs on full jumbo frames can be fun to handle at times! a pincer frame gripper can help prise stuck frames.

Love the MB polys - despite some minor niggles.

If dead set on large format polys here's an idea - i might suggest getting a Jumbo Nuc PLUS a standard body and frame converters in addition to your full hive set up.
that way if you can source a 4-5 frame 14x12 nuc you're fine - bung them in the poly nuc to settle in with 1-2 frames foundation. Then move to main hive and expand as normal with dummy board.
OR
if you can only source standard national nuc - place in the lang nuc with frame converters and 1-2 frames foundation and then once ready add the jumbo box with frames and foundation above/below. the jumbo frames with queen then go into full hive and rest treated as a nuc and given a QC. and so on.

 

[milkermel]

looking at some associations they have a good range of hives at their out aparies, might be worth you going along to them and having some hands on experience - even if they only have nationals then some of the other members may have others they would be willing to let you look at.

I personally use nationals but that is probably only because it was what my teacher showed us.

WBCs are pretty but having used one for the last couple of years I wouldnt want one of my own, there also is not enough room in them imo for the bees I have - the last two years I have used double brood which isnt fun!

 

[RoofTops]

There are a lot of advantages to having all the boxes the same size. A number of commercial beekeepers use full size Langstroth throughout but these are very heavy when full of honey and the frames need a large extractor if you want to extract tangentially. However, the fewer boxes and frames there are for the same amount of honey makes for efficiency, but at an amateur level making things easier is probably the best strategy.

My bees are all now on Dadant Shallow frames, a method known is some parts of Europe as the Farrar system. These frames are each about the same area as a National brood frame but the boxes only take 10.

The hives shown below are all now over-wintering on three boxes each although most of my others only have two. The picture shows two boxes and a feeder, which was used after they were artifically swarmed at the start of the year. I have not had to winter feed them - which saves a lot of effort as the bees have gathered more than enough stores themselves to see them through the winter. The hives illustrated are currently extremely heavy - but I accept that over-wintering in the equivalent of 3 National brood boxes is not common practice here in the UK. I have taken 3 honey crops from these hives this year and the total from each was well over 100 pounds.

 

[Alabamaeee]

I'd like to change from my commercial cedar hives to commercial or 14X12 poly but have as yet to find a suitable supplier of either.

I know one supplier does does a 14 X 12 poly by using an Eke but I would prefer a single box for the BB.

After trialling poly supers this year I am convinced that poly is the way to go, both for weight advantage and warmth.

Not to mention costs as well

 

[drstitson]

how costs? cedar seconds or DIY using reclaimed timber or ply must still be cheaper than poly.

 

[alanf]

When you start always find out what's being used in your neighbourhood, then use the same design and material; two lines of reasoning:

First the usual arguments. It is always said that if you adopt the same type as those around you it helps if you need to borrow or lend kit. You can also sound out more experienced hands about using them, treatments are likely to be at the same time, you can get your bees as nucleus colonies on the same size frames and so on.

Second, and less often mentioned is for when you start on the same type as your neighbours and then decide there a different format that suits you much better (or even if you give up). It's easier to sell on the kit you no longer need, hence reduced net costs and risk.

 

[the naked beekeeper]

I'd like to change from my commercial cedar hives to commercial or 14X12 poly but have as yet to find a suitable supplier of either.

I know one supplier does does a 14 X 12 poly by using an Eke but I would prefer a single box for the BB.

After trialling poly supers this year I am convinced that poly is the way to go, both for weight advantage and warmth.

Not to mention costs as well

If you type 'bee hive supplies' into google, you may find another firm who do sell single unit 14 x12's.

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

If you type 'bee hive supplies' into google, you may find another firm who do sell single unit 14 x12's.

Yet to hear reports good or bad on these - anyone?

 

[oliver90owner]

I would think as good as any other except for the cheaper corner jointing? Oh, and the larger footprint (which having said that, I find I need 520 x 500 stands for the MB poly Nat). Life is a compromise when it gets down to the finer details...

RAB

 

[itma]

... and the larger footprint (which having said that, I find I need 520 x 500 stands for the MB poly Nat). Life is a compromise when it gets down to the finer details...

I am particularly interested in learning some more about the 'real soon now' poly nats & 14x12's from Pains that promise interoperability with wooden British Standard components.

 

[oliver90owner]

Only Pains will know. Ask them? Then let everyone else know?

Doubt they will be totally interchangable with my timber Nats without some extra bits.

RAB

 

[Nic Rhodes]

Another person looking for a tall stand for MB poly nationals. I like the look of the Fragile P one, so I emailed them re sizes and they ignored me. I only wanted 12 Currently looking at tanilised timber for a DIY on a similar style but for poly MB Nationals. Need to check timber prices. Any thoughts anyone?

I have nucs of Langstroth Jumbo, standard and medium (MD super) and 'frame converters' for trials next year. I intend to use 5 or so hives on all medium boxes like rooftops photo (still to be purchased, xmas looms ). The nucs are to convert BS deep and 14 x 12 to Langstroth mediums and shook swarms direct. I keep looking at hives with all the same size and think there is significant merit here. The Langstroth mediums will be MB.

 

[Surreybeekeeper]

Apifan,

Not sure if this helps your original question but when I started I trialed a 14*12 and a Beehaus. By the end of the year both had their positives and negatives but I will be expanding my wooden hives rather than the Beehaus' out of personal preference.

On another note I have to say I would like to trial a Poly hive this next year as have heard some good reports (did anyone read the review in the latest Beecraft magazine?)

James

 

[Luminos]

Welcome to the forum, Surreybeekeeper the article was written by PolyHive