what does your Assocation swarm co ordinator charges for ex-Swarm

[MuswellMetro]

The BBKA third party insurance becomes invalid if you either charge for swarm collection or sell a swarm you have collected

So, 1) when does a swarm become a Nuc of Bees ?

and 2) how much does you swarm collectors charge for Nucs from collected swarms?

well why. because our swarm co-ordinator is charging £25 per frames of Bees for 14x8 and £35 per frame of Bees for 14x12 for 3 week nucs

He is selling them after three week from swarm collection and most appear by then to be on four frames of 14x8 brood or 3 of 14x12 by then, so that £100 to £110 for basically a swarm thrown into a box (£50 returnable deposit on box)

I also have other issues on the 3 week sale as i dont think you can check temper or disease at 3 weeks, its got tobe at least 6 weeks

 

[Chris B]

I've not heard of newly hived swarms being traded like that locally. Personally I wouldn't have a problem with it as long as nobody is deceived. What might be a problem is an official swarm co-ordinator doing it, depending on where the income goes. Using a voluntary position for personal gain is somewhat shady. If funds go into the association kitty for everyone's benefit then no problem.

(I don't think swarms are a good option for beginners though due to the unknown factors you mentioned).

 

[Sean.]

From memory the wording implies that the collector can’t charge for the service of removing the bees, but, could ask for a donation to cover their costs of travel. I think that’s both fair and reasonable.

Once they were collected there was no imposed limitations, or other restrictions in place. They are yours to do what you will with, hopefully something good. So it’s possible to get your costs covered by the means of a donation and then sell the bees. Both are permitted.

The area I would have a concern with as already said is that the swarm is an unknown entity; be that disease status, or temperament. I had a swarm arrive two years ago in a bait hive, first year they were a bit tetchy second year they were dangerous, and had to be re-queened.

The other aspect if that there might be a conflict of interest, if you ask to be a swarm collector also, and that person was able to block you from being on the list of prevent you from attending any possible collections. Given that they have a monetary and vested interest.

 

[itma]

I'd like to see swarm co-ordinators present a report at the AGM. How many calls, false alarms, etc, and account for where the bees went, let alone for the cash and expenses.

Does it actually happen anywhere?

 

[pargyle]

I'd like to see swarm co-ordinators present a report at the AGM. How many calls, false alarms, etc, and account for where the bees went, let alone for the cash and expenses.

Does it actually happen anywhere?

Yes ... our association swarm collector does that at the AGM ... all viable swarms went to either new beekeepers or to people who had lost all their bees over winter.

No fixed charges .. voulntary donation to the association and he doesn't charge expenses for collection so nothing else to report.

 

[newportbuzz]

Yes ... our association swarm collector does that at the AGM ... all viable swarms went to either new beekeepers or to people who had lost all their bees over winter.

No fixed charges .. voulntary donation to the association and he doesn't charge expenses for collection so nothing else to report.

wheres his petrol/diesel coming from? heart of gold on this person i tells ya.

 

[psafloyd]

The BBKA third party insurance becomes invalid if you either charge for swarm collection or sell a swarm you have collected

Not according to the FAQs on the BBKA website, MM. See below:

"4. I am called by a member of the public to collect bees that have swarmed – am I covered? What happens if I charge for my services?"

You are covered provided it is part of your normal beekeeping activities. If you charge reasonable expenses then this will not affect your cover.

If, however, you make a business out of swarm collection this would be viewed differently.

You would need normal Commercial Insurances for this business activity which is not covered by the BBKA policy."

So, provided you are not running a commercial (or semi-commercial) operation, you will be covered for selling on a swarm.

If you habitually sell on swarms, you would need to justify it and I wouldn't want to find myself uninsured.

I certainly wouldn't buy a swarm after three weeks, but the ethics of charging divisional members a commercial rate should be determined by the division.

I believe we are expected to pass on swarms to divisional members at a set price (or free –-must check that) and that might be a condition of being On the divisional swarm collector list which is submitted to BBKA.

 

[pargyle]

wheres his petrol/diesel coming from? heart of gold on this person i tells ya.

Totally ... I think that he limits his swarm collection to a reasonable area around his location but you are right .... most reasonable vehicles doing about 35mpg are costing at least 20p per mile just in fuel costs ... without the other consumables - soon adds up !

 

[wightbees]

That's not to bad, from what I heard our local charge £170.

 

[alanf]

...our swarm co-ordinator is charging £25 per frames of Bees for 14x8 and £35 per frame of Bees for 14x12 for 3 week nucs...

Is this an official local BKA position? Possibly a question of who's prepared or able to put the time in. It's mostly seen here as a public PR service, if we do keep bees we don't want them to be a neighbourhood nuisance in a suburban area. The routine is that several individuals volunteer to collect swarms, they would not be expected to keep them unless it was pretty clear that it was their apiary they came from. The area is roughly divided up, partly to reduce travelling. There is no charge for collection, but donations to BKA funds always welcome.

Collected swarms are made available to members starting or who lost all their bees over winter. Based mostly on a first come, first served list which is usually drawn up at the Spring course by the swarm co-ordinator. Some geographic discretion for swarms "just around the corner". No formal charge other than any frames or treatment used and a correx box if that's what they were collected in should be paid for.

Most years the numbers more or less match. Some years have seen a small cast swarm being all some are offered Some years there have been circulars along the lines of "anybody with spare kit to house a swarm please take these away".

 

[davnig]

We have a swarm list, usually beginners. We pass swarms onto next in list and ask for donation (£20) at end of season if they stayed.

 

[Barbarian]

When a collected swarm is passed on (with warnings) to a beginner, I think a charge should be made.

I work on the principle that if you have paid good money for something you are more likely to care and appreciate it compared to something you have been given free.

 

[BeeJayBee]

When a collected swarm is passed on (with warnings) [...], I think a charge should be made.

I work on the principle that if you have paid good money for something you are more likely to care and appreciate it compared to something you have been given free.

Something for nothing is too cheap. I think it's time we started making some (not all) beekeepers realise that bees are valuable livestock, instead of something almost disposable that can easily be replaced.

The swarm collector will have taken time to collect a swarm, will almost certainly have had to deliver it to the beekeeper, and will probably have had to take time helping put it into the hive. Their time and effort, and fuel used, should at least be reasonably covered by a decent voluntary donation from the beekeeper who gets the bees.

 

[MuswellMetro]

Is this an official local BKA position? Possibly a question of who's prepared or able to put the time in. It's mostly seen here as a public PR service, if we do keep bees we don't want them to be a neighbourhood nuisance in a suburban area. The routine is that several individuals volunteer to collect swarms, they would not be expected to keep them unless it was pretty clear that it was their apiary they came from. The area is roughly divided up, partly to reduce travelling. There is no charge for collection, but donations to BKA funds always welcome.

.

it is just what our swarm collector and swarm co ordinator decided amonst themselves to charge those figures, They calculated the fees after asking Paynes what they charge for Nucs

i have in the past only charged for a pack of 10 frames,wax and perhaps a fee for a new calmer queen, but this has elicited comments from the swarm team such as "selling to low" & under cutting us, "not fair, & "Not worth us doing this if you dont charge the sam as us "

 

[Worldsend]

Our swarm collectors do it for the love of bees and give them to the new Beeks or ones who have lost a hive

I did get offered a bottle of wine when I put some cement onto some holes a brick and flint house where the bees were getting very interested in

-declined as I dont drink !!

 

[oliver90owner]

A frame costs what? Around 50p?

A sheet of foundation costs what? Around a quid?

Selling on for £25? Even if you allow a fiver for time and other expenses, that is a mark up of 400%. Even more for 14 x12 materials and expenses. Should get 6 frames (or 4 @14 x 12) so that is selling them on at commercial rates for one set (with the queen); and with any new queen for the others. Not a bad income in a busy swarm season. Not even a proper nuc, if he is selling them without brood, either (an unproven queen); and the swarmed queen could well be superceded in the season, as well.

Clearly he is not doing this at cost, that is for sure and could be spreading disease far and wide at some point. I would call it a business plan;wouldn't you?

 

[thenovice]

A swarm coordinator should be just that, coordinating who will collect the swarms. If he consistently collects and sells on, he is in it for the money and by the looks of it he has not a lot of ethics selling them on before the 6 week evaluation period...