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we only have two species in Southern Africa
Cape Honey bee
Scutellata African Bee - This is the one found in my area
Scutellata (Adansoni) does have an unfair bad press to be honest due in part to the incorrect correlation of African/Africanised bees, in general they are no different to our bees just with a tendency to be more defensive when threatened (they send out a heck of a lot more guard bees than European bees) but you do get these pockets of right vicious little buggers, we had a report last year of an NGO beekeeping trainer being stung to death at one project (Not Bees Abroad or BfD) when he wandered away to look at a wild nest without wearing any PPE. I never came across any when I was out in the Maluti mountains (Drakensbergs basically) but heard the tales, and yes, they tended to be the darker ones from the highlands, although funnily enough I came across a colony at Ha Lazaro (over 2,300 metres elevation) who were living in the floor of a 30ft container and they were fine, you could get right up to them and watch them trooping to the nest, the entry hole to the container was at the extreme opposite end of the container to the nest entrance so there would be a long line of bees, like a troop of ants, moving to and from the nest.
 
Scutellata (Adansoni) does have an unfair bad press to be honest due in part to the incorrect correlation of African/Africanised bees, in general they are no different to our bees just with a tendency to be more defensive when threatened (they send out a heck of a lot more guard bees than European bees) but you do get these pockets of right vicious little buggers, we had a report last year of an NGO beekeeping trainer being stung to death at one project (Not Bees Abroad or BfD) when he wandered away to look at a wild nest without wearing any PPE. I never came across any when I was out in the Maluti mountains (Drakensbergs basically) but heard the tales, and yes, they tended to be the darker ones from the highlands, although funnily enough I came across a colony at Ha Lazaro (over 2,300 metres elevation) who were living in the floor of a 30ft container and they were fine, you could get right up to them and watch them trooping to the nest, the entry hole to the container was at the extreme opposite end of the container to the nest entrance so there would be a long line of bees, like a troop of ants, moving to and from the nest.

JBM - I am new to the topic of African bees (have been reading some materials, and aspire to go out to Africa in the (hopefully) not too distant future... watch this space), so defer to your knowledge and experience here, but my general understanding is that Apis melifera Adansonii is the "African" bee, and is a distinct strain from Apis melifera Scutellata (the "Africanised" bee - which is a hybrid of the African and the Western honeybee)

... and that Scutellata is generally more agressive than Adansonii (the latter being little different to our own bees, as you say).

Is this a fair statement, or not. Just interested, that's all. Cheers
 
Acasia nectar flow on here at the moment...... Nothing out of the ordinary though....?
Dog died in my arms... My son recently moved out and lives alone... his first dog - just over a year old Boerbul...
Eyes welling up again as I type this.... Very upsetting.....
Oh no Michael so upsetting.
Hope you and son are ok
 
I must admit, it was a close call.... We removed 3 during the day at lunch time..... sealed up boxes and dumped them next to the river...... I almost did not open up....
But then thought I would only be punishing the innocent ones that stayed behind to look after the queen and brood....
Thankfully my Son sees it as,,,,
DAD, they are only doing what they where designed to do, protect themselves from what they perceive to be a threat...
No one could have seen this coming.......
Spent the weekend collecting all colonies with black gene and moving them to one spot.... Death valley also has a north and south apiary so it looks like they are going to continue surviving for a bit longer....

Will be taking a serious look at breeding queens to ensure other apiaries stay clean....
Your son’s attitude is commendable, Michael. Good luck to you both - the least the little blighters can do now is give you a good harvest👍
 
JBM - I am new to the topic of African bees (have been reading some materials, and aspire to go out to Africa in the (hopefully) not too distant future... watch this space), so defer to your knowledge and experience here, but my general understanding is that Apis melifera Adansonii is the "African" bee, and is a distinct strain from Apis melifera Scutellata (the "Africanised" bee - which is a hybrid of the African and the Western honeybee)

... and that Scutellata is generally more agressive than Adansonii (the latter being little different to our own bees, as you say).

Is this a fair statement, or not. Just interested, that's all. Cheers

No - Adansoni and scutellata are one and the same. Was at one time exclusively named Adansoni but people started to use the term Scutellata with reference to it being identified by its distinctive dark band or scutella. The 'Africanised' honeybee refers to the hybrid originated in Brazil when they brought in Adansonii to gee up their rather unproductive 'lazy' local european honeybee population which accidentally escaped quarantine when some well meaning individual removed the queen excluders put over the entrances to stop the drones and queens leaving the hive. Hollywood then got hold of the story and triggered the genre of 'killer bees' and they've been getting their knickers wet over it ever since.
I've handled the bees in Lesotho and Tanzania, seldom wearing gloves and often observing hive entrances pretty closely without PPE and found them no different to our bees but you have to consider they can quickly change their mood (female of the species and all that :biggrinjester:) and get over defensive, even slightly agressive.
I did speak to a few beekeepers out in Lesotho and they all mentioned the slightly more agressive highland bee. And with Lesotho you also have to remember that it has no history of honey farming, even traditional bark/grass hives so the bees they have are all indigenous bees. The only history of honey gathering they have there is honey hunting, especially among the herd boys, it was pretty constant actually, almost a sport actually which meant that, unlike other African countries, wild honey bee colinies aren't quite as prolific there. The constant persecution may also explain their increased defensiveness
 
Neil was obviously a doctor in previous life.
Give the hive a knock like your knocking on someone's door but do it as if you resiting a song so rat a tat tat ow my lover for the first time in my life my mind is wide open.. John lennon ow my love.
which can also disturb a well settled winter cluster
 
Exactly the reason I bought the stethoscope. You can hear the gentle hum very easily without bending double!!!
Or knocking on the door .... no matter how musical the knocks are ... Not Not knocking on hivens door ?
 
I've just got back in from my oxalic acid trickling.
On a downside I found one of my nucs had died out, not 100% sure as to why, I think the wasps in late autumn caused quite a few problems with it and when I looked in it there were not a lot of bees at all. Interestingly this was a plywood nuc but a poly nuc nearby was thriving, probably shouldn't actually read too much into that. All hives still hefted well so I did not need to feed any, I bought fondant along to bee on the safe side.
 
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I would suggest you remove your post.. Illegal treatments are bad enough: advertising it on a forum is just plain...
 
I've just got back in from my oxalic acid trickling.
On a downside I found one of my nucs had died out, not 100% sure as to why, I think the wasps in late autumn caused quite a few problems with it and when I looked in it there were not a lot of bees at all. Interestingly this was a plywood nuc but a poly nuc nearby was thriving, probably shouldn't actually read too much into that. All hives still hefted well so I did not need to feed any, I bought fondant along to bee on the safe side.
With ultra overpriced VDMA approved Apibioxall of course... just in case the inspectorate have had their approved drones in the air above your apiary watching your every move... do not forget to fill in all the vetinary medicines records and keep the empty sachets and batch numbers in triplicate! :leaving:
 
No - Adansoni and scutellata are one and the same. Was at one time exclusively named Adansoni but people started to use the term Scutellata with reference to it being identified by its distinctive dark band or scutella. The 'Africanised' honeybee refers to the hybrid originated in Brazil when they brought in Adansonii to gee up their rather unproductive 'lazy' local european honeybee population which accidentally escaped quarantine when some well meaning individual removed the queen excluders put over the entrances to stop the drones and queens leaving the hive. Hollywood then got hold of the story and triggered the genre of 'killer bees' and they've been getting their knickers wet over it ever since.
I've handled the bees in Lesotho and Tanzania, seldom wearing gloves and often observing hive entrances pretty closely without PPE and found them no different to our bees but you have to consider they can quickly change their mood (female of the species and all that :biggrinjester:) and get over defensive, even slightly agressive.
I did speak to a few beekeepers out in Lesotho and they all mentioned the slightly more agressive highland bee. And with Lesotho you also have to remember that it has no history of honey farming, even traditional bark/grass hives so the bees they have are all indigenous bees. The only history of honey gathering they have there is honey hunting, especially among the herd boys, it was pretty constant actually, almost a sport actually which meant that, unlike other African countries, wild honey bee colinies aren't quite as prolific there. The constant persecution may also explain their increased defensiveness
In all fairness,,,,,, the % of aggressive colonies is far out weighed by the placid ones...
I have many calm colonies, I can even open a lid on top of some brood box's and have a look,,, as long as its slow and calculated moves you are just fine...
Dont blow on them, dont bump down your smoker and dont swat them away.... I usually move away after three or 4 warning "pings" to the face or head...
I usually get a few warning first.....

It's specifically the darker coloured strain that seem more prone to aggression or perhaps a better definition would be "very defensive"
The bigger concern is that they are unpredictable, that in my opinion makes them even more dangerous... I have dipped my arm into a wild "black Colony" and grabbed a drone... No suite and no problem, a week later 30m from the colony they decide to attach staff riding past on bicycles' Why ???

All said and done, I have to admire them, In my eyes, this "aggressive" behaviour makes them a survivor....
After all, this is a wild animal of sorts that we specifically raise to steal bounty from....
Can we blame them????
Pic of a black Drone below.... Beautiful I think.
cropped blk drone.jpg
 
Not common but also not unheard of..... One of our dairy managers had his two dogs stung to death a few years ago.... Wild colony in a chimney - also the darker varient...

We seem to be blessed here with this darker colonies.... At least once a month I have to remove a colony from somewhere on the farm...
This is so sad. Are the dogs leashed or confined - terrifying if they were persued. Is it worth destroying rather than quarantining the hives - assuming you have other stock. Or is that a British over reaction.
I’d understood the aggression in US Africanised bees was a hybridisation issue rather than inherent agression in African bees - guess not whole story though.
😕
 
I would suggest you remove your post.. Illegal treatments are bad enough: advertising it on a forum is just plain...
No if your trickling liquid it’s fine if your intention is to clean the wood.....the op does not say his intention was to kill varroa.
 
No if your trickling liquid it’s fine if your intention is to clean the wood.....the op does not say his intention was to kill varroa.
Though many might, beyond a reasonable doubt, be sure that wood cleaning wasn’t the intention - sophistry will get you only so far.
But perhaps rather than shut conversations down or suggest post edits, we could just assume chemical descriptions refer to licensed products were such exist.
BIAB
 
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