Thinking ahead

[Bakerbee]

Hi all, justing thinking ahead for next year. Ive been doing fome reading and studying. So far i havent read how you would move a happy healthy family of bees from a very old, worn, tired hive (wood begining to rot)which needs replacing, in a new one. Ive read of splitting hives and chequer boarding but how do you actually move an entire hive over to a new one. And what time of year, with regard to brood frames that need replacing too. All ideas welcome. It will get through this winter but does need future planning.

 

[Bakerbee]

Apologies for sp mistakes. Thumbs n phone keyboards!!!

 

[Wingy]

The way I would go about it is get them through winter or if your hive is particularly poor you need a very good day.
Once out flying in spring move the hive to one side, get your new hive set up in the position where the old hive was. Put all frames in the same order from old hive into new one. Get rid of old hive. All foraging bees will return to new hive in old hives position. Try to keep similar colours but it shouldn't matter too much. You can then change frames / foundation as required
Wingy

 

[Millet]

Hi all, justing thinking ahead for next year. Ive been doing fome reading and studying. So far i havent read how you would move a happy healthy family of bees from a very old, worn, tired hive (wood begining to rot)which needs replacing, in a new one. Ive read of splitting hives and chequer boarding but how do you actually move an entire hive over to a new one. And what time of year, with regard to brood frames that need replacing too. All ideas welcome. It will get through this winter but does need future planning.

It's easy and quick, i have done it several times for one reason or another.
Move the original hive to one side place your new floor and brood box on the original spot , then simply remove the frames from the old rotten box into the new box, DO make sure though to put the frames in the new box the exact same order they came out of the old box, and so on with each box and then close them up and let them get on with sticking everything together again.
If i was doing it again i would be waiting till after spring now, as the temperature is dropping now and the bees will have a lot of work to do to fix what you have undone which will not be so bad when the weather as warmed up and the spring flow is on.

 

[madasafish]

It helps and speeds things up - a lot to have two doing it - same format as described by Millett above, but one removing frame and passing to the other who places them in the new hive. IF you want to do it now - as above - do choose a warm not windy day and know exactly what you are doing.

I did it working with a new beekeeper in September - the actual frame transfer on a double brood took about 7 minutes and within 10 minutes of starting the actual transfer , everything had been completed .

If doing it this year I would also feed fondant through an eke in the new hive so they get over the shock with something to occupy them..

If the old hive looks as if it may fall apart when you start working on it, you have a choice of waiting til spring and hope the hive does not collapse. (which is what I would do... but only you know how bad the old hive is).



(I am helping a new beekeeper with three hives acquired two weeks ago. Two hives need a comb reorganisation but it would be very messy so all the unused comb will be removed and replaced with insulation rather than a major comb swapping exercise - especially when local forecasts are for wet and cold conditions - in the day! Basically a case of least worst options..)

 

[Millet]

If the old hive looks as if it may fall apart when you start working on it, you have a choice of waiting til spring and hope the hive does not collapse. (which is what I would do... but only you know how bad the old hive is).

Under that scenario i think a nice tight cosy would fit the bill.

 

[Bakerbee]

Thank you everyone. Its going to need to be done, but not this year, i am just seeking advice for planning when, and how for next years calendar. Few weeks back i was putting in varroa strips and when i went to move a frame out to manouvre the others, the propolis was attached so tight the rotton frame broke on the lug. Fortunatly it was a fully capped frame of honey and no brood. I have replaced that one with new and frozen the frame for bees to have early spring before the first flow.( if i can make shift it to sit in hive. The whole hive is old and tired so it will be a job to do next year. Im confident it will make it through winter. Although my bees are very active with the ivy atm i dont want to disturb them before winter .

 

[For want of a better word]

It's easy and quick, i have done it several times for one reason or another.
Move the original hive to one side place your new floor and brood box on the original spot , then simply remove the frames from the old rotten box into the new box, DO make sure though to put the frames in the new box the exact same order they came out of the old box, and so on with each box and then close them up and let them get on with sticking everything together again.
If i was doing it again i would be waiting till after spring now, as the temperature is dropping now and the bees will have a lot of work to do to fix what you have undone which will not be so bad when the weather as warmed up and the spring flow is on.

BUT.....
Millette is very passionate about his "girls"... me not so much....
Just chuck them into a new hive with new foundation and give ' em a good feed!



Nos da

 

[Millet]

Thank you everyone. Its going to need to be done, but not this year, i am just seeking advice for planning when, and how for next years calendar. Few weeks back i was putting in varroa strips and when i went to move a frame out to manouvre the others, the propolis was attached so tight the rotton frame broke on the lug. Fortunatly it was a fully capped frame of honey and no brood. I have replaced that one with new and frozen the frame for bees to have early spring before the first flow.( if i can make shift it to sit in hive. The whole hive is old and tired so it will be a job to do next year. Im confident it will make it through winter. Although my bees are very active with the ivy atm i dont want to disturb them before winter .

Look up cosies / cozy / insulation bonnet to make and put over the hive till after winter, that way they will be waterproof draft and hopefully robber free.
If you can't find anything in the search facility i will stick you some pictures up.

 

[Millet]

BUT.....
Millette is very passionate about his "girls"... me not so much....
Just chuck them into a new hive with new foundation and give ' em a good feed!



Nos da

Do you not think that is bad advice for a newbie, the **** could hit the fan and the good fellow in Question could loose his hive within days if he is unsure what to do, if you where nearer i would put you over my knee and give your arse a good owld smack..

 

[madasafish]

Do you not think that is bad advice for a newbie, the **** could hit the fan and the good fellow in Question could loose his hive within days if he is unsure what to do, if you where nearer i would put you over my knee and give your arse a good owld smack..

It's a question of location: Northumberland is fairly far North and cold at this time of year..unlike the balmy tropical Tamar valley

 

[Millet]

Northumberland / Durham and north Yorkshire are the little areas i play within, the weather in between is mad.
It can be lashing down here but 60 mile north or south is a heat wave or a freeze out.

 

[Stedic]

Interesting reading this post as I've been considering switching a wooden hive to Poly for the winter as my apiary is likely to be pretty cold.

Do you think I've missed the window this year? The wood hive is in decent condition although the floor isn't brilliant but will do. So it isn't urgent, I just thought it might be a lot warmer.

 

[Bakerbee]

Thsnks millet. They have a moisture quilt on already, and just to note im pretty precious about my girls too. Im slightly perplexed at post to just chuck em in approach n feed as how would you swithch over frames with brood for new frames anyway. Its the entire hive that needs replacing frames too.

 

[Bakerbee]

Icanhopit, I am pretty precious about my girls too but perplexed as to how chuck em in approach would transfer actual frames of brood for new anyway. And thanks millet ive got a moisture quilt on them already.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Thsnks millet. They have a moisture quilt on already,

You need one of these like Millet said

 

[madasafish]

Interesting reading this post as I've been considering switching a wooden hive to Poly for the winter as my apiary is likely to be pretty cold.

Do you think I've missed the window this year? The wood hive is in decent condition although the floor isn't brilliant but will do. So it isn't urgent, I just thought it might be a lot warmer.

WE did that to 4 hives in our Association Apiary three weeks ago. Too cold here now but Leceister may be warmer.

My advice - free so of little value - is that unless you are ready to go now - this week- leave till next spring.

 

[MartinL]

Do you think I've missed the window this year? .

What time of year would you want to be introducing a new girlfriend to camping??
Same applies here so, Probably "missed the window" for this year!

Its the entire hive that needs replacing frames too.

I'd be looking for root cause before doing any remidies.

Was the wood (Frames & Boxes) in good condition when you started out?
Are you paying the price of cutting corners & costs when you started up?

I use 200mm hollow concrete blocks to sit the hives on so they are better protected from damp ingress & associated weakening of the timber.

If you buy frame seconds the idea is to inspect & reject the worst parts.
Same goes for the boxes.
I don't bother with anything but cedar, if I get some at a knock down price (due to knots) then the notty bits all go into one super, they're assembled with the better surface to the outside & painted, then I make sure they don't suffer exposure to the winter weather.

I'd batten down now & wait untill after the winter.
Then bang them into a new box rejecting the dodgy frames at that point with new frames/foundation to the outside & a good feed.

 

[Millet]

Interesting reading this post as I've been considering switching a wooden hive to Poly for the winter as my apiary is likely to be pretty cold.

Do you think I've missed the window this year? The wood hive is in decent condition although the floor isn't brilliant but will do. So it isn't urgent, I just thought it might be a lot warmer.

I switched two hives over to poly over a month ago and both are doing well but i have one in a wooden hive on brood + half, i do not have any poly supers so rather than order any i just stuck the cosy back on for another season, i will hopefully have them all in poly by spring time next year.

 

[kevrhcfag]

Your on commercial, do you want to stay on commercial or move to national same footprint so if getting new box will make no odds to the bees wood or poly.

Stay on Commercial , 14 x 12 or Standard?

Then you have 3 choices how to do comb / frames.

AD-hoc
Bailey
Shook Swarm

All have pro's and cons.

If choose 3rd one put a QE under brood box as they might want to try a different home.