poultry forum wanted

[Erichalfbee]

NOt being a poultry keeper I am not sure I am understanding this.

Surely the point of BSE was a prion (think 'the right term) crossing from one species (sheep) to another (cattle). Scrapie (virtually the same disease had existed in sheep for a couple of centuries. Then with feeding sheep remains as protein to cattle a similar disease appeared (1985/86) in cattle.

Feeding egg shells to poultry (assuming we are talking about hens eggs to hens) isn't likely to do the same thing.

Don't blame me I never brought it up.
My chooks are all pets,all have names,I'm happy for any that stop laying to freeload and none have a prion......that I know of.

 

[yeogi75]

you can buy crushed egg shell for hens, what is the shells from ? we used to buy ground powder egg shell for our budgies (sorry budgerigars ) when we used to breed budgies.

 

[Erichalfbee]

you can buy crushed egg shell for hens, what is the shells from ?

Ostrich?

 

[The Cumbrian]

Even more thinking to do, so I will be ready for the next dissenter.

RAB

Not dissenting merely trying to get my head round the situation - and BSE was specifically mentioned.

"Cooking" the shells to make them easier to grind was mentioned, would this be enough biosecurity?

 

[Luminos]

Our hens eat crushed oyster shell

 

[Erichalfbee]

Mine won't touch it. I have a 25kg bag that will end up dug into the veg patch.
They free range all day so get all they need I suppose.The only reason they get the shells is that I hate to throw them away and it's a way to put back what they've laid.

 

[onriver]

How old are your hens? my advice on your problems:

1. Thin shells are caused by 3 things disease, lack of calcium or old hens. I am going to assume that they are in good health and under a year old. To boost calcium give plenty of grit and make sure that there is limestone flour in it. Limestone flour is mixed with our layers mash and we make sure the troughs are emptied once a day to force calcium intake, the hens don't eat it out of preferance.

Check the calcium content of your feed, and see if you can get one with more in it. As birds get older they need more in their diet.

If you are using pellets mix with veg oil and limestone flour to make it stick to the pellets. You can also put a product called shell max in the water which is supposed to improve shell quality.

Old hens produce a lesser quality egg. At 100 weeks old you can only hope to get 40% usable eggs. If it is disease then give a poultry tonic to aid recovery and shell quality should come back.

2. Hens have to be trained to use nest boxes. At peak laying time move the hens from where they lay their eggs to where you want them laid. Hard to do when they have the habit already.

A darkened secluded nest area is where hens should want to lay. If you do not want them in the nest box at night, then close it off or make a more attractive area for them to roost.

Ours close and open automatically which is not a viable option for 4 hens, but the principle is the same. Train them to roost somewhere else. move them from the box at night to the perches, it may take a while tho.

Make sure there is nothing detering them from perching, i.e red mite. It may be that the nest is where there isn't any. To check for mite use a white business sized bit of card and push it into any cracks where it will fit. When you pull it out it should still be white. If it is smeared with red or brown, depending when they last fed, you have red mite and should treat it.

Thanks - food for thought! The hens are young enough - 3 around 18 months old, the other a year older, but now coming out of moult, look healthy, I think. I'd assumed that monthly spraying with Jeyes Fluid took care of anything nasty - I'll check though for mite, as that's a good reason why at least one is reluctant to perch and hadn't thought of card as a way of checking.
They've oyster shell in a separate feeder as I'd naively assumed they'd eat it when they needed it and the access to open ground would mean sufficient mineral intake - obviously not enough.
I feed organic layers pellets, with kitchen scraps and the odd forage over veg beds - very happy to take your advice and add limestone flour as well! I haven't had this problem before though and I'm wondering if its because I've switched to commercial layers - 3 are goldstar hybrid layers - wonderful hens when they started to lay, just this problem of thin shells
thanks - onriver

 

[porterswoods]

18 months old for a commercial layer is too old and will lay lesser quality eggs. You should never feed scraps until the have had a good intake of pellets. Scraps fill the crop and gizzard and don't have enough goodness for the formation of an egg.

Always feed mixed corn and scraps, mid afternoon, supplementry to layers pellets ad lib.

Jeyes fluid will kill mites, however it is limited because it accually has to hit the mite to kill it. This is the same for any detergent based treatment, e.g poultry sheild. Once it has dried it has no effect, the mites come out of their hiding places and carry on as normal.

I have used Elanco Elector and Ficam W with very good results and it leaves a residue and keeps working for over 12 weeks. The draw back is they are expensive, but ficam is available 10g packets. I also use hemexsan powder, mix it up and paint it over everything. Very messy but work surprisingly well. Having said that anything with cypermetherin in it will do the trick.

If you want to keep hens for eggs then a hybrid strain is good, primarily because you get more egg out with the same amount of feed in.

 

[theeggman]

As an ex freerange egg producer, yes there are lots of us around and more every week given the state of the industry, I would totally agree with Porterswood re. the shell quality/ bird age situation.
We used to supply shell ad-lib in hoppers (oyster/marine/cockle which ever was cheaper and available) from about 60 weeks of age to maintain the shell quality.

If you're feeding pellets the limestone flour will remain in the pellet and be eaten but there probably isn't enough for your hen's age/needs.
Between flocks we used creosote (yes the 'real' stuff is still available) on all woodwork. Against various rules but if use ensure that it is dry before the birds come into contact with it and any smell has gone before the eggs appear, (the smell taints the egg) there should be no problem.

For redmite we used Ficam W and Oxyfly, both expensive but are residual and actually work.

Tim

 

[Hivemaker.]

For redmite we used Ficam W and Oxyfly, both expensive but are residual and actually work.

I can imagine Oxyfly(lambda-cyhalothrin) would be very effective,it certainly kills bees, dead on the spot.

 

[Luminos]

Quote:
Mine won't touch it. I have a 25kg bag that will end up dug into the veg patch.

...will they grow into oysters??

 

[theeggman]

HM. I fully agree, but as it's only to be used inside the chicken house it shouldn't affect any bees, well no more than the hens would, there should be no problem.

If people want to get some commercial 'end of lay' birds and ex batts. aren't available you could try to find a freerange producer. We used to sell our hens for £1 rather than put them on the lorry, ideally see them caught on the range as some birds never go out , through choice, and also check that they are laying.

Tim

 

[Hivemaker.]

HM. I fully agree, but as it's only to be used inside the chicken house it shouldn't affect any bees, well no more than the hens would, there should be no problem.

Yes i know what you mean,regards only used inside the chicken houses,and i know lambda-cyhalothrin,is very effective,even more so if tank mixed with triazole,it gets sprayed on OSR for pollen beetle,and i have first hand experiance as to how effective it is in this situation.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Quote:
Mine won't touch it. I have a 25kg bag that will end up dug into the veg patch.

...will they grow into oysters??

Now that would be great.
I did once have an asparagus bed that grew three hens in it overnight.
Mr fox buried them there...............