Natural beekeeping varroa treatment

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I am bemused Chris. totally. I am not aware of any barrage of comments about any particular beekeeping style.

Good luck to you and possibly a tad less sensitivity is a good thing?

PH
 
I find such provocative input quite unhelpful and counterproductive.

Only if it's wrong... but in Chris's case, he says it isnt...
 
From Science of Bee culture, a peer reviewed scientific journal.

Apis mellifera / supersedure / Varroa destructor
Introduction
The varroa mite (Varroa destructor) is an external parasite
of the honey bee (Apis mellifera) that feeds on the hemolymph of
immature and adult bees (Harbo and Harris, 2001). This specialized
blood-feeding mite species reproduces within sealed brood,
showing a strong preference for drone brood over worker brood
(Martin, 2001). Parasitism causes weight loss, wing deformities
and sometimes loss of appendages of the emerging bee (De Jong et
al., 1982b). High infestation of V. destructor, in colonies that lack
innate mite suppression characteristics, ultimately leads to the death
of that colony (Harbo and Harris, 2001). Mites from a collapsed
colony can be dispersed to other colonies on adult bees through
behaviors such as robbing, drifting and absconding (Martin, 2001).

That took two minutes to find and if I could speak German no doubt there are many more on there.

PH
 
I heard that mustard powder was as good.... or finely ground pepper!

Or was that for invading paratroopers?

May have misheard my Grandad!
 
Every time I pop in here it's the same old people telling the same old tales - wives tales that is. So, once again, my bees do not die, do not abscond or exhibit any other weird forms of behaviour and they do not "get treated" apart from some icing sugar twice in early autumn. Whether this has much effect I don't know and don't much care as long as my bees are OK, which they seemed to be today when all the colonies were active enjoying a nice warm day.

Sweeping general statements that are clearly not true, perhaps it's just lazy use of language - but an untreated colony is not condemned to death, I know.

Chris

I think the most important thing to remember in all our discussions, is the influence of location.
There may be a number of axioms concerning bees and beekeeping, but there are also a large number of variables.
I have great difficulty in growing carrots at my allotment, as carrot fly always gets in despite protection and companion planting (which reduced the incidence) and the fact I have very clay soil.
However, people within a stone's throw, no, even spitting distance, can produce wonderful carrots without any intervention or special treatment.
So, I would imagine, it is with bees.
 
Actually I'm disgustingly fit including my blood pressure and I'm more concerned about the one sided attitudes that tend to prevail here. In the short while that I've viewed this forum I've seen the barrage of snide comments that can befall a new poster that prefers a more natural, less intrusive method of bee keeping. Oooop's, there I go again, the fiddlers don't call that bee keeping do they? Although WTF it is if it isn't keeping bees I don't know - especially if said bees are healthy and doing just hunky dory. Of course some people may have a vested interest in making out the whole thing is "complicated" and that "bees are under threat" blah, blah...which I would postulate simply isn't true.

I suggest that you experienced keepers have a look at the causes of the historical decline in France - other than that pesky little mite. Hmmmmmm.

Chris

Chris, your own posts, in defending your position against the "barrage of snide comments" from 'orthodoxy', you come across as quite dogmatic.
The fact there is orthodoxy may not be because there are vested interests at play, but because this is the shared experience of those on a group that would appear to be concentrated in the UK.
 
.
Varroa has been researched very carefully by tens of people who get pay from it. There is not much strange in it.

I asked from our Finnish researcher, why he does not try to breed varroa a tolerant stock when he has such bees?

He said that it is dangerous to select bees strictly according only one feature.
Even if you find a such stock, you loose much more.

***********

As controlled varroa is not a problem.
 
Chris, your own posts, in defending your position against the "barrage of snide comments" from 'orthodoxy', you come across as quite dogmatic.
The fact there is orthodoxy may not be because there are vested interests at play, but because this is the shared experience of those on a group that would appear to be concentrated in the UK.

Well, you know the old Gandhi saying don't you?

Anyway, it isn't me that makes the sweeping statements about all colonies being condemned if untreated or of irresponsibly spreading disease, or of not being a proper "bee keeper" but being a "bee watcher", come on, please, arrogant or what?

Equally, I don't tell other people what to do, I simply say how it is for me, and to answer a previous point, I agree it must be very worrying if you only have one or two colonies. Personally I would recommend a minimum of three in case of problems.

Got to go and collect more walnuts now for the walnut oil production, very good for the health you know. Blood pressure 115 over 60.:)

Chris
 
I don't tell other people what to do,

Got to go and collect more walnuts now for the walnut oil production, very good for the health you know. Blood pressure 115 over 60.:)

Chris

Mad man. Do like medicine doctor says. Blood pressure issue is much more severe than varroa. Allways you may get new bees but no chance to get a new head.
'
60 is too low pressure. Blood escape from your brains too quickly.
 
I trained as a physicist. Evidence rules ok.

I am a newbie - started this year.
One of our training hives had BAD varroa and went from 2 full boxes of bees to 6 frames in around 2 months due to a really bad varroa infestation. When treated (drops of over 1,000 mites in week1) they stoppped shrinking and started growing again.

One of my own hives had lots of varroa: Deformed wings , etc. Treated it and the illnesses that were evident disappeared.

All that conforms to accepted practice. QED.

I say no more: I am convinced of the need to treat: although I try to keep "naturally"...
 
I am convinced of the need to treat: although I try to keep "naturally"...
Seems as if you are unsure as to if you are convinced.
 
is oxalic acid (4% in 5% sucrose solutuon) applied in midwinter when no brood is about a natural thing to do to your bees?


Our world has been dramatically changed by man.... it is called civilisation
(misquoting James Lovelock?)
 
I've come into this thread rather late, but must remark that I'm finding the usual "brick wall" of refusal to begin to understand how other approaches work more than a touch evident.
"Orthodoxy" as represented by the BBKA and it's followers tend to be of the view that "the only way" is to "treat" in some way or another - Chris has reported that he personally doesn't find it necessary - I'm at a loss as to why people should make him into some hate bogeyman figure for daring to "do it differently" - personally, I find his approach to be at the very least interesting, possibly revolutionary, and perhaps a path worth following for those of similar inclination.

The other thing that obviously isn't being grasped is "holism" - we are very used to things being broken into pieces, each part analysed to death, and then assuming "we know all about it", whereas the complex interreactions of things (particularly in nature) show that when added together, all those disparate parts behave very differently.......

Which is a long-winded way of saying that perhaps these (more) natural beekeeping nutters have a point, and that if you allow your bees to have as natural a life as possible (minimal interference, no brood/queen culling, no foundation, leaving them their own honey for the winter etc etc) that they are perfectly able to deal themselves with what are viewed as utter disasters by orthodoxy - there are strong forces at work (habit and tradition particularly) to dissuade credence being given to such approaches, but as Chris is demonstrating "it works for him", so we are foolish to ignore or decry it.......:coolgleamA:
 
I saw a greenfly spray in a shop the other day, advertised as not harmful to bees.

Has anybody ever bothered to find out if products of this type will kill varroa??

Head Lice sprays?

Spider repellant sprays?

Flea sprays?
 
It's that "t" word again "treating" - the problem with stuff made to kill things is that essentially bees and varroa mites are living things, and the odds of finding something that kills one without harming or affecting the other is remote in the extreme.(especially as "bee friendly" probably means when used as directed, and not applied directly onto bees as would be needed to kill varroa)
 

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