Mildew/mould

[GoldenHive]

Hello!

I'm a 1st year beekeeper going into the winter after a fairly successful season. I have 1 hive.

Today upon opening the hive I noticed mildew/mould growing on the top bars of the brood frames. It is also growing on the underside of the roof and had covered the crown board completely. There is also moisture in the hive.

I would guess this is because, in my attempt to keep the hive temperature adequate, I have caused inadequate ventilation (my bad). I attempted to clean off as much as possible but the bees were extremely aggressive and it was near impossible to work with them. I added a super and fed some syrup, removed crown board and QE.

Has anyone else had this issue, or can offer any advice on how to 'dry' out the hive please?

 

[Wilco]

Mould forms where it's damp.

It gets damp when there's condensation.

Condensation occurs when the warm moist air from the bees meets cold surfaces.

Get rid of the cold surfaces and there won't be condensation.

Solution: put some form of insulation above the crown board to retain heat rising from the bees.

Giving more ventilation, as some in organsations such as BBKA advocate, may be another way to get rid of the damp but also means the bees are more exposed to outside conditions. This may adversely affect their success in overwintering.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Hello!

I'm a 1st year beekeeper going into the winter after a fairly successful season. I have 1 hive.

Today upon opening the hive I noticed mildew/mould growing on the top bars of the brood frames. It is also growing on the underside of the roof and had covered the crown board completely. There is also moisture in the hive.

I would guess this is because, in my attempt to keep the hive temperature adequate, I have caused inadequate ventilation (my bad). I attempted to clean off as much as possible but the bees were extremely aggressive and it was near impossible to work with them. I added a super and fed some syrup, removed crown board and QE.

Has anyone else had this issue, or can offer any advice on how to 'dry' out the hive please?

Insulate the crown board so it's not a cold surface to cause condensation.
If condensation still forms on the sides it will drain off harmlessly and can even be a useful source of water during winter when it's too cold outside to fly. However I rarely see damp in my Abelo polyhives. Definitely don't fall for the siren voices espousing creating gaps in the top of the hive to let out the warmth within whether by open holes or (spit) matchsticks.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Hello!

I'm a 1st year beekeeper going into the winter after a fairly successful season. I have 1 hive.

Today upon opening the hive I noticed mildew/mould growing on the top bars of the brood frames. It is also growing on the underside of the roof and had covered the crown board completely. There is also moisture in the hive.

I would guess this is because, in my attempt to keep the hive temperature adequate, I have caused inadequate ventilation (my bad). I attempted to clean off as much as possible but the bees were extremely aggressive and it was near impossible to work with them. I added a super and fed some syrup, removed crown board and QE.

Has anyone else had this issue, or can offer any advice on how to 'dry' out the hive please

I'll add a welcome to the forum. It's a great place to be so don't hesitate to ask any questions. The one you've asked might well save your bees.
The other guys are right.
When you say super...is this to house the feeder and have you simply swapped the crown board for a dry one?
Or have you given them a super full of frames?
If you have this needs to come off, the crown board needs to be replaced with a dry one and you need to add a 50mm layer of PIR insulation on top of it, then the roof.
Now that the top is warmer than the sides any condensation will run down the walls. I have some of my colonies on solid floors with an 8mm slit of an underfloor entrance and they cope ventilating themselves.

 

[Blunt Spike]

I have some of my colonies on solid floors with an 8mm slit of an underfloor entrance and they cope ventilating themselves.

Im glad you said that. This year I have put my colonies onto UFE's with solid floors and the idea of too much condensation was worrying me. We did have a guest speaker a few years ago at the local BK association who was advocating reduced ventilation as it allowed the bees to keep the colony warmer easier and to manage airflow better, with any condensation providing an over winter water source for them, but it it doesn't stop the jitters in the first year of changes.

 

[GoldenHive]

Mould forms where it's damp.

It gets damp when there's condensation.

Condensation occurs when the warm moist air from the bees meets cold surfaces.

Get rid of the cold surfaces and there won't be condensation.

Solution: put some form of insulation above the crown board to retain heat rising from the bees.

Giving more ventilation, as some in organsations such as BBKA advocate, may be another way to get rid of the damp but also means the bees are more exposed to outside conditions. This may adversely affect their success in overwintering.

Thank you !

 

[GoldenHive]

Thanks to everyone who replied

 

[GoldenHive]

I'll add a welcome to the forum. It's a great place to be so don't hesitate to ask any questions. The one you've asked might well save your bees.
The other guys are right.
When you say super...is this to house the feeder and have you simply swapped the crown board for a dry one?
Or have you given them a super full of frames?
If you have this needs to come off, the crown board needs to be replaced with a dry one and you need to add a 50mm layer of PIR insulation on top of it, then the roof.
Now that the top is warmer than the sides any condensation will run down the walls. I have some of my colonies on solid floors with an 8mm slit of an underfloor entrance and they cope ventilating themselves.

The super is just to house the feeder.
I will definitely take the advice from everyone and invest in some insulation - am I right in thinking that a hole would need to be cut in the insulation to allow for feeding of fondant over winter?

 

[Erichalfbee]

The super is just to house the feeder.
I will definitely take the advice from everyone and invest in some insulation - am I right in thinking that a hole would need to be cut in the insulation to allow for feeding of fondant over winter?

If they need fondant you can do this

 

[Murox]

The super is just to house the feeder.
I will definitely take the advice from everyone and invest in some insulation - am I right in thinking that a hole would need to be cut in the insulation to allow for feeding of fondant over winter?

Yes, use foil faced insulation board, and cover all cut edges with self adhesive aluminium foil tape; cut the hole carefully the exact size needed to take the bag of fondant. There are some pictures showing that on the forum somewhere in a similar thread.

In the time its taken me to write that I see its already been posted for you by @Erichalfbee .

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

get a piece of 50mm PIR (celotex, Kingspan whatever) and cut it to fit snugly inside the hive roof - then glue it permanently in place (those silly little vents in the roof are unnecessary anyway).
Cut another piece of 50mm PIR 460mm square and cut a hole out of the middle (as per Dani's photo) to enable feeding of fondant (if needed) in the winter.
Close up any holes in your crownboard with a piece of thin plywood/plastic/piece of slate - the holes should only be open when feeding or clearing bees down from supers.
No matchsticks under crownboards

With that much mould in your hive I'd be concerned about its location. Where is it sited?

 

[W0otz]

Sheet of insulation in the roof, sheet of insulation in an eke with a takeaway tub-sized cutout in the centre. Takeaway tub lids cover any holes in the crownboard.
If they need a topup over winter simply remove the cutout and tub lid and place a tub of fondant over the hole.

I remove the insulated eke over the summer, but leave the insulation in the roof year round. It's just a good at helping them deal with the sun beating down on the metal roof as it is at keeping them warm in winter.


Treated Rough sawn Whitewood Timber (L)1.8m (W)50mm (T)22mm | DIY at B&Q cut into 4x 438mm lengths and screw/nail/glue into a square

Recticel Instafit Polyurethane Insulation board (L)1.2m (W)0.45m (T)50mm of 1 | DIY at B&Q cut to size will fit a roof+eke

GTSE Wide Adhesive Aluminium Foil Tape Silver 75mm (3") x 50m | DIY at B&Q Alu tape for the exposed edges - the bees shouldn't have access to them, but if the bees can get to them then the tape prevents them from chewing it.

I've cut all mine to be a very snug fit, so nothing more than friction needed to hold the insulation in place, but you can glue it.

 

[Bodiam Bees]

Sheet of insulation in the roof, sheet of insulation in an eke with a takeaway tub-sized cutout in the centre. Takeaway tub lids cover any holes in the crownboard.
If they need a topup over winter simply remove the cutout and tub lid and place a tub of fondant over the hole.

I remove the insulated eke over the summer, but leave the insulation in the roof year round. It's just a good at helping them deal with the sun beating down on the metal roof as it is at keeping them warm in winter.
View attachment 34089

Treated Rough sawn Whitewood Timber (L)1.8m (W)50mm (T)22mm | DIY at B&Q cut into 4x 438mm lengths and screw/nail/glue into a square

Recticel Instafit Polyurethane Insulation board (L)1.2m (W)0.45m (T)50mm of 1 | DIY at B&Q cut to size will fit a roof+eke

GTSE Wide Adhesive Aluminium Foil Tape Silver 75mm (3") x 50m | DIY at B&Q Alu tape for the exposed edges - the bees shouldn't have access to them, but if the bees can get to them then the tape prevents them from chewing it.

I've cut all mine to be a very snug fit, so nothing more than friction needed to hold the insulation in place, but you can glue it.

A great set up and very neatly executed W0otz. I do similar, albeit a little more Heath Robinson, with either PIR or a slab of rockwool above as I fear the creation of a cold spot above my fondant pot (and ensuing risk of condensation dripping in amongst the middle frames)

 

[E&MBees]

Don’t forget to skip dive! You can often pick up pieces of PIR just the right size. Saves quite a lot of money.

 

[user 20297]

Last week I was asked to dump two, polyester-filled pillows in the bin. They didn't get there. I had a couple of feeders under deep and insulated hive roofs that needed the extra insulation as shown on @Erichalfbee's image. Ripping open the pillows and stuffing in the lightweight padding seems to have made quite a difference to the heat retention within the remaining liquid feed. Longer term, a PIR insert is the way to go, but it's good to do a bit of repurposing that costs nothing and temporarily reduces landfill.

 

[JamezF]

Last week I was asked to dump two, polyester-filled pillows in the bin. They didn't get there. I had a couple of feeders under deep and insulated hive roofs that needed the extra insulation as shown on @Erichalfbee's image. Ripping open the pillows and stuffing in the lightweight padding seems to have made quite a difference to the heat retention within the remaining liquid feed. Longer term, a PIR insert is the way to go, but it's good to do a bit of repurposing that costs nothing and temporarily reduces landfill.

That's pretty much what people used to do as I understand it. Only before easy availability of man-made materials it might be a sack of straw, hay, wood shavings, wool or anything similar that was easy to get hold of.

James

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

That's pretty much what people used to do as I understand it. Only before easy availability of man-made materials it might be a sack of straw, hay, wood shavings, wool or anything similar that was easy to get hold of.

James

Which may explain why sometimes the word used to describe a crownboard is 'Quilt'

 

[JamezF]

Which may explain why sometimes the word used to describe a crownboard is 'Quilt'

Indeed so. And I almost used exactly that word before realising that I didn't know how its meaning might have evolved over time and couldn't be bothered to look it up

James

 

[user 20297]

That's pretty much what people used to do as I understand it. Only before easy availability of man-made materials it might be a sack of straw, hay, wood shavings, wool or anything similar that was easy to get hold of.

James

I've seen some videos of Warre hives with pitiful handfuls of leaves and moss sprinkled in for the same purpose. There's "Irishbee", the You Tuber, who uses nifty, custom-made, loose, Tyvek cushions to insulate his feeders. Once my feeders are removed it's back to normal, with the ekes taken away and the 100mm PIR, deep winter roofs hard against the insulated crownboards.

 

[Ash1962]

Insulate the crown board so it's not a cold surface to cause condensation.
If condensation still forms on the sides it will drain off harmlessly and can even be a useful source of water during winter when it's too cold outside to fly. However I rarely see damp in my Abelo polyhives. Definitely don't fall for the siren voices espousing creating gaps in the top of the hive to let out the warmth within whether by open holes or (spit) matchsticks.

Hi Do you go into the Winter with your Abelo hives on OMF ? Thanks Ash.