Attempted Hive Thefts

[Sutty]

It would be relatively easy to build a decent tracker and a fairly long-life battery into a deep roof eg in a hollowed out recess in a block of kingspan, with a hidden charge point, or even "through the case" type inductive charging.
I wonder if there would be a market?

 

[Blunt Spike]

I 've popped back to suggest that for new frames, perhaps a cheap CNC type laser cutter/burner could quickly and repetitively 'burn in' ownership details on the un-assembled wooden parts.

We could take it a stage further and place the assembly/ installation date for our own purposes.

We need to look at SOLUTIONS, people.! NOT obstacles.
At the very least we need DETERRENTS! - increasing the costs and nuisance to the bee rustlers.

Positive Vibes, please!

Malcolm B.

Good idea until the beek wants to sell a nuc or hive thats been branded. Once others have kit with your logo you provide a defence to a criminal to say that they bought second hand kit at a car boot. Not negative vibes just reality of how easy it is to come up with a defence.

 

[Sutty]

Good idea until the beek wants to sell a nuc or hive thats been branded. Once others have kit with your logo you provide a defence to a criminal to say that they bought second hand kit at a car boot. Not negative vibes just reality of how easy it is to come up with a defence.

If you're a hobbyist then just keep some hives & nucs unbranded. Or only have a few branded frames in each hive so you can swap out before sale.
If you can honestly say you have never disposed of branded kit you are in a strong position. Just burn any frames that are irredeemable rather than putting in the refuse bin.

 

[Malcolm B.]

Good idea until the beek wants to sell a nuc or hive thats been branded. Once others have kit with your logo you provide a defence to a criminal to say that they bought second hand kit at a car boot. Not negative vibes just reality of how easy it is to come up with a defence.

Fine! But I'm still looking at potential solutions though!

How do cyclists who have their bicycles engraved with their details, deal with selling them later?

Are beekeepers likely to sell ALL their hives and frames. every year?
Possibly not, so keep a few for sale unbranded - and keep them away from the main apiary.
Branding/engraving is a very simple low tech solution deterrent.

We are ALL possibly affected by theft of bees so as many ideas as possible need to be tested in practice! Then, the actual (not the perceived) flaws will become apparent.

Malcolm B.

 

[pargyle]

I've said it before - every year when someone gets hives stolen (and every year there are hive thefts !). The only thing you can do is find out apiaries that are on 'safe' land, out of sight as much as possible but not too remote, then provide some sort of deterrent .. be that a heavy chain and a robust ground anchor, hive floors that are fastened securely to the hive stands (perhaps screw in eyes that a chain can be threaded through and a hefty padlock) or a hasp and staple that padlocks the brood box to the hive stand.

The reality is that all you can do is make it too difficult for thieves to get in and out quickly - according to my Police colleagues in the average theft of any sort - even major burglaries - thieves like to be in and out in under 15 minutes. Anything you can do to confound the ease of stealing things will drive anyone but the most determined (or bloody stupid) thief on to someone else's property.

Hive thefts are not impulse thefts - they have been checked out beforehand and if the potential thief sees obstacles that are going to take time to overcome they will move on to something less secure, hopefully, not yours.

There is a value in bees and it's becoming an attractive proposition to a few professional hive thieves, it's not hobby beekeepers who do the stealing - but it is probably hobby beekeepers who are the ones buying the stolen colonies. I would urge anyone buying bees to be sure of their provenance and even if they are cheap - if you can't be sure - walk away. The trade in stolen hives needs a market to survive - reduce the market - reduce the thefts.

 

[Blunt Spike]

Fine! But I'm still looking at potential solutions though!

How do cyclists who have their bicycles engraved with their details, deal with selling them later?

Are beekeepers likely to sell ALL their hives and frames. every year?
Possibly not, so keep a few for sale unbranded - and keep them away from the main apiary.
Branding/engraving is a very simple low tech solution deterrent.

We are ALL possibly affected by theft of bees so as many ideas as possible need to be tested in practice! Then, the actual (not the perceived) flaws will become apparent.

Malcolm B.

Malcolm, as I said, not being negative. I think statistics have previously shown that a visual deterrent works. Burglar alarms push burglars to pick houses without an alarm. Maybe your idea could help, all I was doing was showing the limitations if someone chose to ignore the warnings.

Rural locations leave property even more vulnerable. Add in the fact that beeks may only visit once per week, they are easy pickings. For me the i-tags are the best idea If the tag could send an immediate notification if it is moved. I dont think it would be too difficult for someone to programme one to do that. The limitation will be battery life or if they are easily spotted, removed and left in situ.

 

[ericbeaumont]

look at SOLUTIONS, people.! NOT obstacles.

More productive to think like a thief and reject the weak solutions. So far, the movement tag seems to me to give the best window of opportunity to track & locate the thieves. Once they reach base, the game is over.

 

[Anduril]

Fine! But I'm still looking at potential solutions though!

How do cyclists who have their bicycles engraved with their details, deal with selling them later?

Are beekeepers likely to sell ALL their hives and frames. every year?
Possibly not, so keep a few for sale unbranded - and keep them away from the main apiary.
Branding/engraving is a very simple low tech solution deterrent.

We are ALL possibly affected by theft of bees so as many ideas as possible need to be tested in practice! Then, the actual (not the perceived) flaws will become apparent.

Malcolm B.

OK so hives and frames are branded. What does the criminal mind think, firstly they would do a shook swarm onto frames of foundation or comb already drawn, the latter would use less sugar syrup. Then burn the hives and frames, to make them unidentifiable and render the wax.
If there are tags in the hives, the quickest method would be to take nuc boxes and remove 5 to 6 frames from the brood area of each hive. The best method is to make the process as slow as possible. Murray has stated on this forum of hive thefts and the person wasn't a beekeeper. Disclaimer this is not a 'how to steal hives'. This is the brutal truth of what takes place. They are always one step ahead of your thought process.

 

[Sutty]

If I was going down this line I'd embed a tracker into a roof, brand the side bars (not top bars) so a quick look doesn't reveal them, and have no signage. So aimed at recovery.
Prevention would be screwed-down floors. My wooden ones would be easy, poly more of a problem.
I suspect like most of us I won't do anything unless I've already been hit. Though I could add a video camera easily enough...

 

[Richard]

Branding Irons are readily available for woodworkers to 'Burn in' their sales details to the various objects they produce. Our son-in-law produces various items and each one has his name and contact details burnt into the wood somewhere out of plain sight.

If both Brood and Super frames had the Beekeepers name and address burnt into them - say, a couple along the top and one or two on each side bars - giving , perhaps four locations identifying the ownership of the frame, this might be a deterrent to the Bee Rustlers.

This might be particularly effective if there were external signs stating "Warning - All Hive Frames here have been permanently engraved for identification purposes"

The thieves would have to somehow transfer the comb onto new frames. A tedious and time consuming process. They would also know that they would have in their possession (for a while, anyway) clearly incriminating evidence.

Our son-in-law's branding iron is electric. It's not very much different to a powerful soldering iron. I would guess it would take probably an extra minute to 'Brand' each new frame -and when compared to having to replace even just five hives and their contents, the time factor pales into insignificance.

Keepers with just a few hives could probably quite successfully burn/brand their frames by hand. Even at an 'Out Apiary', a gas powered soldering iron could be used.

I wonder if this might help you sleep to better at night.

Kind regards,

Malcolm B.

I've got a laser engraver that would do a lovely job of this. Line the pieces up before being built, I could do 20 in one go probably maybe more.

I don't have any hives currently but if anyone local to me wants to experiment with some frames I'm happy to give it a go.

 

[Malcolm B.]

I've got a laser engraver that would do a lovely job of this. Line the pieces up before being built, I could do 20 in one go probably maybe more.

I don't have any hives currently but if anyone local to me wants to experiment with some frames I'm happy to give it a go.

Thank you Richard. It will cost very little to try out and you are very generous with your offer.

I'm simply trying to be positive amongst the doom and gloom of the stolen hives. I cannot begin to imagine how the owners must feel and I can see it must be extremely disheartening to see all the hard work of building up a good productive apiary being stolen from you.

I do have the greatest respect for all the forum members here, but sometimes we must make an attempt at what seems at first to be impossible.

Thieves break into houses despite there being burglar alarms installed. Does that mean we should not even bother to fit burglar alarms? - or any other 'protective device' simply on the premise that "they'll get in anyway, so why bother!"

Every little helps! Be it heavy chains, concrete anchors, security fencing, electronic telemetry, covert video surveillance, permanent identification, etc, etc. In the absence of a "Eureka" moment and obvious solution, perhaps we should commence with the cheapest suggestions to begin with and then work up. We may well find that a combination of two or three ideas is a sufficient deterrent.

(Did I mention leaving a decoy hive full of angry wasps trapped inside?)

Malcolm B.

 

[Blunt Spike]

You would get the same result if you just put a notice on the hive saying This hive and its contents are security marked. If they ignore the notice they won't worry about laser engraving or branding.

The biggest threat to our bees originates in Asia and has reared its head on UK soil again.

 

[Newbeeneil]

How about this down the frame side bar or top

Makes it more difficult to sell on

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/28220684...wkMFEpupgCAhh7FySGBwP2MqnN2h|tkp:BFBMuI_Q0bhi

I tried it and these are difficult to get hot enough to brand wood. I’m sure they work well on steaks

 

[Ian123]

Malcolm, as I said, not being negative. I think statistics have previously shown that a visual deterrent works. Burglar alarms push burglars to pick houses without an alarm. Maybe your idea could help, all I was doing was showing the limitations if someone chose to ignore the warnings.

Rural locations leave property even more vulnerable. Add in the fact that beeks may only visit once per week, they are easy pickings. For me the i-tags are the best idea If the tag could send an immediate notification if it is moved. I dont think it would be too difficult for someone to programme one to do that. The limitation will be battery life or if they are easily spotted, removed and left in situ.

The tag I post will notify you as soon as hive is moved from safe area…… it already exists, you would be aware seconds after the hive has left the apiary and it’s up dated constantly with Sat photos.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Branding Irons are readily available for woodworkers to 'Burn in' their sales details to the various objects they produce

but they're not cheapIf both Brood and Super frames had the Beekeepers name and address burnt into them - say, a couple along the top and one or two on each side bars
pointless waste of time - in the past the MO has been to shook swarm the lot and burn both the frames and the boxes.

The thieves would have to somehow transfer the comb onto new frames. A tedious and time consuming process. They would also know that they would have in their possession (for a while, anyway) clearly incriminating evidence.

Only if you had gone to the effort of branding each individual bee

 

[Blunt Spike]

The tag I post will notify you as soon as hive is moved from safe area…… it already exists, you would be aware seconds after the hive has left the apiary and it’s up dated constantly with Sat photos.

Having that info would potentially be the difference between getting a thanks for the report here's your crime ref and someone taking an interest into what info do we now have. I suspect these thefts are stolen to order and/ or committed by people who will move the hives some distance.
In rural areas everyone knows each other and if Sid the burglar suddenly put 15 hives on some land it would be noticed. A farmer near me had some parts stolen off a tractor. It was known about within a couple of hours through FB and other SM.
If they're moving them some distance and there movements are tracked there's a good chance they'll pass an anpr camera. The GPS notes time and date so its pretty easy to id the vehicle.
I noted someone's comment re photos of the apiary. Some camera phones photo info includes GPS location. You are effectively giving them the address.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

We need to look at SOLUTIONS, people.!

but as has been pointed out to you - it's not a solution

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

It would be relatively easy to build a decent tracker and a fairly long-life battery into a deep roof eg in a hollowed out recess in a block of kingspan, with a hidden charge point, or even "through the case" type inductive charging.

But bee thieves are interested in stealing the livestock not the containers. Roofs would be the first thing to be discarded.
My work for the occasional opportunist hoping to make some beer money by stealing a complete hive but....

 

[Anduril]

but as has been pointed out to you - it's not a solution

If we had solutions we wouldn't have crime.

 

[Anduril]

As I stated earlier, there have been cases of only the frames with bees being taken. You turn up at the apiary and from first visual inspection of the apiary there is nothing untoward. It is only upon opening the hives that you find either a space or wild comb where the frames once were. You would have to add a device to every frame, probably at exorbitant cost depending on how many hives you have. A hobby or business that gets filled with paranoia.