Asian Hornet

[jenkinsbrynmair]

About 2 miles to Portsmouth as the Bee flies !

Less if it takes the Harbour ferry !

But who would want to go there?

 

[Worldsend]

Turk Town or Pompey?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Turk Town or Pompey?

either really, spent plenty of time in both - stuck on the gunwharf when it was a gunwharf in HMS Nelson (or Fort Fumble as we used to call our HQ in building 58) or later on the hammerhead at Haslar marina.

 

[Worldsend]

Yes we used to crew boats from JSSC when we were on earlies and teastops at Haslar and Dolphin as well

 

[North End Bees]

It is obvious to a half blind,half deaf old codger like me that IF Asian Hornet takes hold in the UK, the NBU do not have the resources to deal with the workload that entails.

I hope someone is planning how beekeepers are going to step in.. Drones and sophisticated tagging are of course illegal...

Beekeepers are already part of the solution, they don't need to 'step in'.
But organisation needs to be led from the top.
It all comes down to hard cash, i.e provision of NBU manpower on the ground, as well as all the other resources needed to coordinate and carry out tracking and eradication.
How long will the govt commit to paying for the service? Bearing in mind Defra has to spread resources across all agricultural/environmental demands.
Recent experience of govt management of C-19 has shown us that the level of service provided and laws governing it are a poor compromise between the scientific and the economic advisers.

 

[steve1958]

How goes the saying "Fail to plan, then you are planning to fail".

Something that does concern me is that any Beekeepers that feel the powers that be are not doing anything, or moving too slowly, will try and take matters into their own hands.
Evidence of this can be seen overseas where out of desperation Beekeepers have been catching Hornets, painting them with a slow release poison, then releasing them in the hope the hornet will take this back to the nest thus poisoning the Hornet colony.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

So the Gosport nest was 'high up' in an apple tree and only eight inches in diameter, another one very much the same as the ones found before, seem to indicate that velutina, even when left alone are struggling to build viable colonies here.

 

[Erichalfbee]

So the Gosport nest was 'high up' in an apple tree and only eight inches in diameter, another one very much the same as the ones found before, seem to indicate that velutina, even when left alone are struggling to build viable colonies here.

Yes they have all been small. A good sign. I’m sure I read Karol here saying that the species would struggle.

 

[The Poot in Somerset]

So the Gosport nest was 'high up' in an apple tree and only eight inches in diameter, another one very much the same as the ones found before, seem to indicate that velutina, even when left alone are struggling to build viable colonies here.

Good news!

 

[North End Bees]

seem to indicate that velutina, even when left alone are struggling to build viable colonies here.

Have so far not built large colonies but left alone their viability would increase.
DNA analysis of previously discovered nests has shown that Queens mated with very few drones (one report was just 1).
Having a large number of genes within the colony has been shown (in bees as well as in hornets) to increase viability of the colony.
Controlling incursions limits the availability of drones but 'left alone' this would increase exponentially.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Have so far not built large colonies but left alone their viability would increase.

I think a colony which has not reached maturity by this stage of the season is doomed, thus far it seems that the founder queens are ones that have hitched a ride from the continent rather than mated from established colonies over here.
I know that some seem to be exited at the thought of velutina establishing themselves over here, but I think we should at least look at the facts and offer just a little optimism.

 

[North End Bees]

offer just a little optimism.

Point taken

 

[Pembroke]

I think a colony which has not reached maturity by this stage of the season is doomed, thus far it seems that the founder queens are ones that have hitched a ride from the continent rather than mated from established colonies over here.
I know that some seem to be exited at the thought of velutina establishing themselves over here, but I think we should at least look at the facts and offer just a little optimism.

Well there must be a limit to it's range at some stage. Perhaps Gloucester (the farthest North it's got by natural means I believe) could well be it. Of course that doesn't help us to the West although with the damper climate that might help as well. I wonder if anyone has look at it's temperature / climate range in it's place of origin?

The other thing we don't seem to hear much about these days, perhaps our French colleagues on here can help is how did the experiments in Lyon with the pitcher plants in the Botanic gardens go. There was great hopes for them at one time. Pitcher plant in France eats bee-killing Asian hornets

 

[North End Bees]

I wonder if anyone has look at it's temperature / climate range in it's place of origin?

This map from APHA shows the potential distribution for us is at least as likely as in France, Spain, Portugal where AH has colonised beyond hope of eradication.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Well there must be a limit to it's range at some stage. Perhaps Gloucester (the farthest North it's got by natural means I believe) could well be it.

well there used to be an ICD in that area so plenty of sealed containerised freight being shipped straight to Gloucestershire from the continent.
another thing to look at is the fact that all the velutina in the near continent are descended from the one queen - the gene pool is extremely narrow which myust have some effect on the viability of future generations.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

well there used to be an ICD in that area so plenty of sealed containerised freight being shipped straight to Gloucestershire from the continent.
another thing to look at is the fact that all the velutina in the near continent are descended from the one queen - the gene pool is extremely narrow which myust have some effect on the viability of future generations.

I've got timber importers scattered along the humber via small wharf operators. I'm keeping my fingers crossed no AH hitch a lift in packs of timber from oriental parts. Fortunately most seems to be from Northern climes.

 

[charentejohn]

Just noticed this as I and others in France have had these for a while. Basically they pin the bees in the hive which is the worst part, predation accounts for the rest. If the bees are pinned down the queen stops laying (like a dearth) and if they take a lot of bees then the hive has to work hard to make up the losses.
They are alrady in the UK, just, and will advance Vespa Velutina Most likely source would be bales of stuff especially right now as the queens will have just gone into hibernation so may have gone into timber etc outside. When this is moved elsewhere if it is used before spring they will probably die when exposed, if left they will emerge.
They reckon up to (as a max) 500 queens / nest but only 10% make it to establish, they fight amongst themselves for territory and are predated. No stopping them really, they are starting on colder countries and are adapting. They predate 30% bees in the countryside 60% in cities, idea is other prey in the countryside.

I did a group with loads of info on them, please don't join unless you have actual experience of them as we are only looking for practical experience if you have found something that works for you. asianhornet-beehiveprotection groups.io Group
Post general ideas on this forum.
Muzzles, mesh, wire, tube etc stop them being pinned down, which is very important, and reduce predation but can't stop it. They will be there but will take a while to spread, spoiler alert they like built up areas.
Some video of how they behave at muzzles, these need some refinement, and you can see the bees are not bothered by them, till caught. I had just 2-3 AH/hr so not a problem, a friend had lots and lost 4 of 7 hives. AH muzzles

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

They are alrady in the UK,

Do tell us more.......

 

[charentejohn]

No more to tell other than all the info in the group posts, I assume the question was jocular, just be aware of measures for the future. As they say, fore warned is fore armed, ignoring them won't make them go away. Being aware of solutions before the event is just sensible, as

See the map, red bits are known sightings, or this from a few years ago National Bee Unit confirm another sighting of the Vespa velutina Asian hornet in Woolacombe in Devon BBKA already on the case I believe.
The UK doesent have a real problem as yet, then neither did France in 2004, took 16 years to cover all of france and into spain (2010), portugal, belgium (2011). But then they let it get a hold, Uk seems to be trying to slow it but if they are there they will spread.
I have had them at my hives this year, leaves are falling from the trees and despite checking can't see a nest. Like I said I had 2-3/hr in summer and saw them because I put a camera on the hives otherwise I wouldn't have known unless by accident.

For those in the south of the UK worth just noting the measures to protect individual hives, like muzzles, so if they turn up you will remember this. Governments can't get rid of them all once established, just slow them down, all you can do is keep them away from the entrance so they don't pin them inside. Think it is technically called foraging paralysis.

 

[North End Bees]

As they say, fore warned is fore armed, ignoring them won't make them go away.

The UK doesent have a real problem as yet, then neither did France in 2004, took 16 years to cover all of france and into spain (2010), portugal, belgium (2011).

So far, the UK has been able to deal with the incursions of the last 4 years.
We have the benefit of mainland Europe's experiences so we are not in the same place as France was in 2004.

No stopping them really, they are starting on colder countries and are adapting.

There's no evidence that AH is adapting to colder climates.
That said, if the temperatures we've had in 2020 in southern England is the beginning of a trend, our climate will be very suitable for them.