Your bees swarm: embarrassing? or a case of que sera sera?

[Dusty Rhodes]

In the last week, 2 of the 10 hives I'm responsible for, swarmed.

One swarm I collected. The other made off to a place where it couldn't be recovered.

Whilst I felt quite heroic about the first, I feel rather embarrassed - perhaps a little ashamed - at not being able to prevent, or at least recover, the second.

I don't hear my local colleagues saying they lose swarms - perhaps they don't!
I suspect, however, that they don't want to admit to it - because, I fancy, there is a view that it's a sign of incompetence.

Can members of the Forum help me reset my moral compass in this matter?

Dusty

 

[jonnybeegood]

I started with two packages of bees last year, in May, both hived, one swarmed in july, which i caught, i now have 5 hives & 3 nucs, one of them swarmed today & i caught it, i havent lost any yet but i know one day i will, & i also know i will be gutted, not just at losing them but that they will most likely die through no fault of their own. I guess i will have to live with that as thats beekeeping these days. As a beginner i guess i have been lucky. I dont hear any experienced beeks on here mentioning losing swarms, maybe they just arent there to see them having so many hives. Surely everyone loses them sometimes, & the more you have, the more you will lose?

 

[pargyle]

I lost one last year ... don't know where it went... can't even be sure when it went ... sometime around 1st May ... and I KNEW they were going to swarm and put off the AS for a day or so as it was a bit difficult at the time - BIG MISTAKE.

Got it right this year (so far ?) but I picked up a swarm with a red marked queen (I don't mark) so someone in the area got it wrong ... I think some people are not prepared to own up as they see it as a failing whereas the reality is that preventing swarms is not always an exact science ...

I thought you were pretty brave in the middle of Manchester up a ladder propped against a cross collecting your swarm ... I would have probably stated that they weren't mine and passed by on the other side of the road !! All credit to you Dusty ...

 

[dexter's shed]

my bees have swarmed a few times this year, normally when I'm quite a few miles away from home, some I've managed to re capture, others have been lost, but as swarm coordinator for our club I've been called to collect more, I would never beat myself up about it, it's nature, it happens

 

[Eyeman]

I don't hear my local colleagues saying they lose swarms - perhaps they don't!
I suspect, however, that they don't want to admit to it - because, I fancy, there is a view that it's a sign of incompetence.

Remember reading a couple of reviews of last years apiary meetings in our Local BBKA rag. Both apiaries were run by 'senior' and well respected club members. Both apiaries had swarms waiting to greet the Beeks attending the demonstration.
I manage my bees within the hustle and bustle of everyday day life so I'm going to lose a swarm or 10! Even if you do an A/S they still decide to fly off.

 

[idg]

Can members of the Forum help me reset my moral compass in this matter?

Dusty

I wouldn't beat myself up too much about a lost swarm. It's case of "I lost lost the battle of wits against the bees this time, but I'll get it right next time"

At least we are trying to get it right. I have an aquaintance let's say who doesn't visit his hives enough to even know if he has lost a swarm. On the odd occasion that he does visit, if he sees queen cells he repeatedly breaks them down (all of them!). He has 4 hives and gets through queens like there's no tomorrow. Because he is on the OSR he gets a few jars of honey and seems happy with that.

We don't always get it right but at least we are trying to do the right thing by out bees and our neighbours. Trying to learn and become better beekeepers.

 

[B+.]

Can members of the Forum help me reset my moral compass in this matter?

I think a lot depends on the age of the queen. They rarely swarm in the year after their mating but the risk of them swarming increases with each passing season.
I have lost none this year but I did lose some last year. Perhaps I was negligent too for not getting around the apiaries quickly enough. A risk-based approach seems to be the way things are done nowadays so, knowing the age of the queen, perhaps we should be concentrating our swarming checks on the colonies with oldest queens. Swarming is a natural impulse just as reproduction is for any living thing. Even selective breeding can only reduce swarming to an extent. Ultimately, they must reproduce. The only way to stop this is to remove frames of bees and brood so that as the pheremone levels decline in old age, they supercede the queen instead of swarming.

 

[Stiffy]

Missed a couple of checks at an out-apiary due to family bereavement. When I got there last weekend one had obviously swarmed and ignored my bait haves. I do my best for my bees but they do what they do and have to accept it. On a plus side hopefully someone has now got some very nice bees and look after them better than I have
Scissors at ready for next inspections!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Jonathan]

I have kept bees since 1977 and swarming is just a part of the hobby. Nothing to be ashamed of at all. Some years I do well and some years I have to admit I don't. This is one of those years I am afraid. Sometimes they swarm despite your best efforts and sometimes inspections are missed but hey I'm not a robot.
A previous comment regarding "they rarely swarm the year after their mating" is simply not true At least in my experience. I agree they are less likely to swarm but "rarely" is a massive overstatement with so many other things influencing the urge to swarm.

 

[mbc]

, it's nature, it happens

This.
Any beekeepers who say they've never lost a swarm have also caught much bigger fish than you

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

This.
Any beekeepers who say they've never lost a swarm have also caught much bigger fish than you

It happens - it's what bees do, however hard you try you will always miss a swarm.
I feel frustrated more than embarassed when I lose a swarm.
As Thomas Crapper said 'say lavvie'

 

[masterBK]

That said responsible beekeepers should still try to reduce the number of swarms by effective management. We owe it to the public who don't always appreciate swarms turning up in the garden or having to pay out money to get them out fo their chimneys and soffits etc . Some of it is down to impetence like not shaking the bees off combs to look for those small hidden queen cells, like leaving two cells after prime swarm has gone, like not reducing cells in the queenless part of the AS and not checking the queenright part for cells , breeding from swarmy stocks etc etc

 

[enrico]

This.
Any beekeepers who say they've never lost a swarm have also caught much bigger fish than you

Swarm....what's that.....never seen one....

 

[Fraise]

Swarm....what's that.....never seen one....

I have! .... They keep arriving from out of the blue into my bait hives.

 

[psafloyd]

You can't win 'em all. I had a similar conversation recently with someone complaining about certain beekeepers who then said if you are doing AS properly, they shouldn't swarm.

In theory. I asked them does that mean they never have a colony swarm, then. Of course the answer began, "Well, no...".

If you haven't made an effort to practice proper swarm control, then you can be ashamed, but not for them deciding to swarm –-it's perfectly natural.

 

[Nige.Coll]

We were talking about swarms last night. Some are finding that the usual 7 day inspections are missing swarms and then finding emergency cells left behind. It seems the bees want to go now while the weather is good. Doesn't help us out but they don't care about what we want lol.

 

[B+.]

A previous comment regarding "they rarely swarm the year after their mating" is simply not true At least in my experience. I agree they are less likely to swarm but "rarely" is a massive overstatement with so many other things influencing the urge to swarm.

Yes. I agree other things come into the equation...overcrowding, queens age, weather etc...but, it has been my experience that they don't usually swarm in their first year. I once saw some statistics that said something like 1/3 swarm in their first year and 2/3 swarm in their second (this is from memory so fractions are probably wrong). Perhaps you have been unlucky.

 

[domino]

If they swarm they swarm, I do my best to stop it but tend to the approach if it happens I'm not going to beat myself up on it.

If I cared that much I'd clip the queens.

 

[peteinwilts]

All of my queens are clipped (except for the virgins).

I try and keep my hives as low key as possible, and the last thing I want to do is annoy the landowners by donating swarms to their chimneys.

They understand that I try my best with swarm prevention, and after a couple of lectures from me, understand that swarm prevention is not swarm elimination. It can still happen.

One of my friendly landowners said he once had another beekeeper on his land, and swarms ended up in all sorts of places, including annoying his neighbours, and entrenched the local village. The beekeeper had to go.

Swarms ending up the wrong place is bad press for us all.

 

[rayt]

I often wonder how many of the swarms lured into bait hives actually belong to the very same beekeeper despite the claims of 'catching someone elses bees' and 'swarms are attracted to my apiary because it smells of bees'. Coincidence my ar*e.