Why sell ten 10 frames with a box that can fit 11?

[Boston Bees]

Agree - in fact the "spare space" can fit a 12th frame although it get a little crowded in there.

Never a good idea, IMHO.

 

[Swarm]

A lot of mine no longer have a dummy board.

 

[Jules59]

My WBC boxes can take 11 Hoffman frames but I use 10 plus a dummy board.
Simon the Beekeeper sells his frames and foundation in packs of 11 which is perfect for a National box with a dummy board.

 

[blackcloud]

11 frames swollen with humidity and canked up with wax and propolis,soon begin to encroach into the dummy board territory.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I run my Swienty and Abelo with 10 frames.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

In my case I bought a complete hive kit. To be fair they clearly stated that it comes with 10 brood frames, but clearly I need to buy some extras to “complete” the kit

and if you buy a nuc of bees to go in it, they will come with their own frames so you will end up with five or six spares

 

[user 20297]

I was wondering …
if it’s good practise to put 11 frames with a dummy board, why do sellers include 10 frames as standard? Why not 11?

Back to your original point; I see where you're coming from; if you buy a complete hive-kit, it should be complete. When I bought my first hive from a company who wil not B.E. named, there weren't sufficient nails either for the hive boxes or the frames, and one of the pairs of the metal runners was a simple, right angled section and did not provide any bee space.

 

[Boston Bees]

Back to your original point; I see where you're coming from; if you buy a complete hive-kit, it should be complete. When I bought my first hive from a company who wil not B.E. named, there weren't sufficient nails either for the hive boxes or the frames, and one of the pairs of the metal runners was a simple, right angled section and did not provide any bee space.

Buying from BE is a very hit and miss experience. You roll the dice every time in terms of the product being what it says it is, or being the right size/shape. It's just their business model.

 

[user 20297]

Buying from BE is a very hit and miss experience. You roll the dice every time in terms of the product being what it says it is, or being the right size/shape. It's just their business model.

....so I have realised...but they are not alone in that!

 

[blackcloud]

I agree with the business model thing- it can be hit and miss but that is the same as any other part of retail.
You are slightly more likely to get consistency from the long established outlets-albeit the price premium you were trying to evade.
That said as a beekeeper ,at some point you will face an unexpected situation and have to be resourceful and think on your feet.
So perhaps BE,stbk etc are actually doing you a favour with a bit of training

 

[frankenstine]

was going to say frames are sold in packs of 50 and 100

 

[BBC]

What is a "complete" kit?-you will eventually need additional components.
Plus another hives-worth as spares.

But as Boston Bees rightly alluded to, Bigginers kits should be complete. As a beginner you’re usually on a budget. Finding out the hard way that you now need more frames and foundation is misleading and unacceptable. Not to mention disappointing.
Yes you guessed it. The same thing happened to me…
Beginners kits should be complete at point of sale.

 

[TonyLack]

I use 10 frames in my 14*12 Nationals along with 2 Dummy boards. That way they have a bit of extra insulation at both ends and when I inspect I can start at the end with the sun behind me. Plus there is now no need to put that first frame on a hanger or on the floor.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Finding out the hard way that you now need more frames and foundation is misleading and unacceptable

especially as you then get hammered on postage for bits and pieces which you could have just added to the larger order at little or no extra cost

 

[blackcloud]

But as Boston Bees rightly alluded to, Bigginers kits should be complete. As a beginner you’re usually on a budget. Finding out the hard way that you now need more frames and foundation is misleading and unacceptable. Not to mention disappointing.
Yes you guessed it. The same thing happened to me…
Beginners kits should be complete at point of sale.

Yes eleven frames is insufficient-that kit was marketed by a non beekeeper-a case of Caveat emptor-dont expect bespoke quality from Poundstretchers bargain bin.

But my point is -what is complete?
How long do you think you will go before needing more parts?
You have harvest ,mite checks,winter prep and swarm management all coming up in the next 12 months -you might be buying some kit along the way.....
Define complete

 

[RogerIvy]

Define complete

My definition would that a "Complete Hive Kit" is everything that is needed to make up a hive with all it's parts at the time of purchase. It wouldn't include parts inclined to require replacement in future.
If you buy a car it would not be considered complete if you only had three wheels. .... even if later you could buy more/different wheels and replace the worn tires.

 

[Boston Bees]

Yes eleven frames is insufficient-that kit was marketed by a non beekeeper-a case of Caveat emptor-dont expect bespoke quality from Poundstretchers bargain bin.

But my point is -what is complete?
How long do you think you will go before needing more parts?
You have harvest ,mite checks,winter prep and swarm management all coming up in the next 12 months -you might be buying some kit along the way.....
Define complete

No, eleven brood frames is fine, that's the point of this thread

"Complete" means that you have enough frames to fill the boxes that the frames are provided with. Anything less is misleading marketing. So 10 brood frames doesn't qualify as complete, and Bee Equipment shouldn't be using the term when describing their offering.

Simples

No need to get metaphysical about the true meaning of the word.

The downside here is greater than some extra postage being required. The downside is that a beginner thinks that 10 brood frames must be right, and spaces them out in the brood box accordingly, with consequences that we can all imagine.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

If you buy a car it would not be considered complete if you only had three wheels

Reliant Robin?

 

[Murox]

Reliant Robin?

but a car is commonly accepted as a four-wheeled road vehicle - plastic pigs are in a class of their own.

 

[blackcloud]

That's considered wheel-ist in this progressive world.
Shame on you