What hive type would you use?

[Nige.Coll]

I haven't found a problem with nationals but not used anything else.
Had a look in a beehaus and wow that was crap. Big clumsy frames and bad fitting parts with silly little supers.
I couldn't manage with larger frames so i'm happy with the nationals and they are like ford cars, there is one in pieces every 50 yards.

 

[pargyle]

Well - I don't really know - I quite like my 14 x 12 Paynes Polys, they are well made, the latest ones don't have any serious design flaws and they are good value but ... a lot depends upon the level of knowledge I would endow myself with at the point I started ... I learnt so much about bees from building and running my Long Deep Hive and the time it took to build and refine gave me a lot of time (and the necessity) to think about what I was doing - and I still really like my LDH and will have another.

So ... if I knew as much (little though it is) as I know now and was starting with no equipment and was just looking for a honey factory then it's a no brainer - Poly Hive of one sort or another - 14 x 12 or Langstroth.

If I was starting out from the point I originally started with little knowledge.... and I know the usual advice is to follow the style of hive in your locality ... but ... assuming I had the ability to build it - it would be another LDH.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I have poly 14 x 12s but it's been a bit of a journey trying to achieve top bee space. I would go for poly Langs if I was starting again.

 

[BeeJayBee]

I would go for poly Langs if I was starting again.

Same here. I'm glad I started with them, have no reason to change.

 

[Itchy]

Nationals covered with 50mm Cellotex bonnets

 

[jacobite]

I'm in Scotland, been keeping bees in Smiths last 3 yrs. Planning to get more hives and most here have Nationals. Once I started researching them I read that poly hives have many advantages. (I've lost bees every year with Smiths) then on researching Poly hives I find many positive comments on getting Langstroths. Nothing I'm totally confused!!
If you've had or used Langstroths why are they better?
Put it another way, if you were starting out what would you buy?

I've seen a few poly designs now and see whatever I buy I'll be stuck with buying products only from them

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Put it another way, if you were starting out what would you buy?

Why put it another way? - the original question was essentially 'if you were starting out - what would you use?'

 

[jacobite]

True... Think I will go for the poly hive, so much positive feedback. National hive would be less hassle when getting bees from others. The Swienty design looks good

 

[dpearce4]

message intothelionsden and ask him if you could spend a day with him as he uses swienty polys im sure he might let you.

 

[madasafish]

Well after moving form TBHs to Langs, my first winter shows Poly far superior to wood.. Far more bees survived.. and less stores consumed.

No more hive building for me...

 

[B+.]

Commercials - allows for bigger brood space, plus you can use the Nationals stuff you've got as dimensions are almost the same.

I have Langstroths but Commercials are a viable option too. They have roughly the same comb area.

It looks as though we've mentioned most of the designs out there now

 

[Pete D]

Mike T, if you are tempted there is a chap nearby selling 6 Langs, 5 of them with colonies, advert was in last association newsletter, he still has them and is open to offers as moving next month and can't keep them.

 

[hedgerow pete]

i really liked the idea of the discussion i started on a new hive size and shape untill it got trolled of

i only use nationals as i sell the framed nucs and the beginners i used to teach use them at home.
prefference for me is european brought poly dadants with zero money being spent in the uk

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

prefference for me is european brought poly dadants with zero money being spent in the uk

And you complain about trolling! I think someone needs to grow up here

 

[itma]

I'm in Scotland, been keeping bees in Smiths last 3 yrs. Planning to get more hives and most here have Nationals. Once I started researching them I read that poly hives have many advantages. (I've lost bees every year with Smiths) then on researching Poly hives I find many positive comments on getting Langstroths. Nothing I'm totally confused!!
If you've had or used Langstroths why are they better?
Put it another way, if you were starting out what would you buy?

I've seen a few poly designs now and see whatever I buy I'll be stuck with buying products only from them

Regarding poly Nationals, that's not quite true.

I think the ModBeek/BeeBox poly 'national' is indeed unique. So lets leave that aside.

The Swienty/CWJ/Solway design only takes 10 hoffman brood frames, otherwise, being standard external dimensions, it is interoperable with standard wooden nationals and anything that interoperates with them. (Pity about the lack of proper bottom beespace over the frame lugs.)

The Paynes and BHS designs are standard 11 hoffman size inside - so bigger outside (500mm square rather than 460mm).
They interoperate with each other and standard wooden parts.
The only two exceptions being that a standard wooden roof won't fit over, and the (unmodified) Paynes floor only takes Paynes broods (or 460 mm - eg wood - parts).

Moving frames from Smith to National can be as simple as putting a (dome-head) screw into each end of the topbar and adjusting for total length and equal extension at each side!



However, if you are happy with short lugged hives (as with your Smiths), maybe you should just go Langstroth.
But Langstroth is not well-standardised, and I am not the one to guide you through the subtle differences in box and frame sizes!

 

[BeeJayBee]

Don't like short lugs, especially with big frames.

Mine are jumbo langs, with frames just a smidgeon different from Dadant. The bees seem happy enough with them, and so am I.

I've never had any problems lifting the frames, although frames full of stores are quite heavy. I've never had a frame lug break off when trying to get a frame out of a heavily propolised hive. It can happen with longer lugged frames, especially during the first inspection of the year.

 

[madasafish]

Mine are jumbo langs, with frames just a smidgeon different from Dadant. The bees seem happy enough with them, and so am I.

I've never had any problems lifting the frames, although frames full of stores are quite heavy. I've never had a frame lug break off when trying to get a frame out of a heavily propolised hive. It can happen with longer lugged frames, especially during the first inspection of the year.

Mechanically, the heavier the frame is, the more stress on the lugs - obviously - and the longer the lugs the more stress if you lift them by their ends.

I use jumbo langs and have had no difficulty..

 

[mbc]

smiths ....

Currently I run nationals and commercials, but starting afresh I think I'd go with Smith's, iirc c wynne used to offer a poly Smith similar to the denrosa poly national, now if I were given my wish this would be what I'd choose.
Nothing wrong with the nationals (in poly or wood)or commercials, there's very little in it, each comes into their own at some point, but I admire the simplicity of the Smith.