VSH Carnica

[Truble]

I think (for what it is worth) that bee breeders do amazing jobs that us amateurs simply cannot do. I'm happy to buy their end products.
When are yours going to be available? Not a criticism ...just how much do you want???...that's humor...I haven't quite figured out how to add a smiley yet. doesn't seem to work.

 

[Finman]

Finman, I think you know that my motivation for doing what I do is very personal. Money isn't everything.

That is nonsense. You know it yourself. You cannot do that without money, what you do now

Money is not everything, if you have it more than you can spend it.
I have done all my life perdonal things. Freedom is my first leading star. Money makes me free.


30 km from my summer cottage there is big city. Its several paper mills have stopped and there are 20% unemployment in the city. To another direction 25 km there is a town, which has second cheapest houses in the country.

In every two of the houses of this rural village have unemployed young people. Workers come from Estonia, Russia, Ukraine and from Thailand and do the cheap works. Our young people do nothing . Just lay on soffa and play computer games. Greetings to Do Nothing Pargyle!

The youngest paper mill has been built in Finland 1997. Twenty years ago. Mills have moved oversees.

B, I hope that you never say that again that money is not everything. It is if you do not have work place, or your fee is small.

You and me, we are lucky that we can do what we want.

But without money, what you loose? First your independency and human rights.

You are hard boy to teach, but think first ornidary life, what most other people live.

But say something about climate, please.


This summer cottage village is far from happy place. I have been here 35 years and I have seen thise young jobless boys as babies. Girls move some how away from here and seek work from somewhere else.




.

 

[Finman]

I think (for what it is worth) that bee breeders do amazing jobs that us amateurs simply cannot do. I'm happy to buy their end products.
.

Best breeding work goes when the breeder has over 500 hives. That guy knows what to do. He has material from where to select. Often breeders co operate with other breeders.
.
As a small keeper, it is up to you how you can use those bred queens.
.

 

[Fusion_power]

Finman had to search long and hard to find that rich wife so he can live a life of comfort, ease, and beekeeping.

Each of us is passionate in some way about what we do, especially beekeeping.

My only critique is, What took so long? We've had VSH in the U.S. 15 years or more. Why aren't more EU beekeepers getting VSH bees to move the trend in the direction of mite resistant genetics?

What does it take to get some enterprising group of beekeepers to work on bees with grooming traits to add to the VSH?

 

[B+.]

Often breeders co operate with other breeders.

Precisely!
The hardest thing is learning to work together. When we co-operate, big problems can be overcome. Perhaps you noticed in my post above that varroa is just one of several traits that members of BeeBreed are working on. Those who have visited my apiaries have commented on how gentle and productive my bees are. I see this as confirmation that we are doing the right thing by developing a portfolio of traits rather than focussing only on varroa.
The figures are comparisons againgst a 5-year moving average so, in answer to an earlier question, the benchmark is always increasing (i.e. the only way to get breeding values above 100% is to strive for continuous improvement).

 

[B+.]

My only critique is, What took so long? We've had VSH in the U.S. 15 years or more. Why aren't more EU beekeepers getting VSH bees to move the trend in the direction of mite resistant genetics?

Oh, but they are. If you look at the Coloss and Arista Bee Research websites, you will see that this isn't a Europe versus USA competition. There is co-operation at all levels.

 

[Cussword]

I
On another thread I'm being denigrated for providing a link to an alternative Oxalic acid delivering device....apparently it's not suitable for the average beekeeper on this forum.
It speaks volumes, alas.
I shall go back to being a passive observer.

You were not denigrated, it was said that the equipment would not be suitable for many of the folk on this forum, hobby beekeepers.

If you are going to take every remark that doesn't agree with your opinion personally, then maybe your last sentence should be the way forward.

Calm down.

 

[Finman]

Why aren't more EU beekeepers getting VSH bees to move the trend in the direction of mite resistant genetics?
?

Why, because you do not know what beekeepers are doing in Europe

Do you know, what is difference with EU and Europe?

.

 

[Cussword]

I've read some of your other posts about what you do. Do you really think other beekeepers will even try to do the same? Or even want to?
On another thread I'm being denigrated for providing a link to an alternative Oxalic acid delivering device....apparently it's not suitable for the average beekeeper on this forum.
It speaks volumes, alas.
I shall go back to being a passive observer.

Have you been a member on this forum before?

Maybe with a fishy name?

.

 

[beebopper]

Have you been a member on this forum before?

Maybe with a fishy name?

.

I am pretty sure you are onto something there.
Was thinking the same myself.

 

[Fusion_power]

Why, because you do not know what beekeepers are doing in Europe

What little I know about breeding programs to improve bees in Europe is from these websites:

http://www.toleranzzucht.de/home/
http://www.voralpenhonig.at
http://www.resistantbees.com
http://www.elgon.se
http://www.wolnepszczoly.org

And of course B+'s favorite: https://aristabeeresearch.org/

There is also quite a bit written about Kefuss in France and there is Juhani Lunden in your country.

 

[B+.]

And of course B+'s favorite: https://aristabeeresearch.org/

This is one of the pdfs I got from Arista which forum members might find useful. It gives a nice comparison of varroa and worker pupa stages. Note the length of the outer "legs" for the male and female protonymphs and also the shape of the curve at the bottom of each image. This is how you can differentiate between the male and female varroa mite.

The optimum age for checking mite reproduction (and hence VSH tendency) is 7+ days post capping (puple to black eye stage worker)

 

[Cussword]

This is one of the pdfs I got from Arista which forum members might find useful. It gives a nice comparison of varroa and worker pupa stages. Note the length of the outer "legs" for the male and female protonymphs and also the shape of the curve at the bottom of each image. This is how you can differentiate between the male and female varroa mite.

The optimum age for checking mite reproduction (and hence VSH tendency) is 7+ days post capping (puple to black eye stage worker)

Printed out and put in my book. Thanks for that.

.

 

[B+.]

For those of you who may not have seen VSH workers in action
https://vimeo.com/37533182

 

[Erichalfbee]

Thanks for posting that B+
Ugh!!!! Straight out of a capped cell onto the bee cleaning the pupa out. She wasn't having it but she couldn't get it off herself.....What self sacrifice

 

[B+.]

.....What self sacrifice

Indeed.
Infested workers will often fly away from the colony to minimise the infestation too.

 

[Fusion_power]

Seeing it in a video is impressive. Seeing it firsthand is even more so. Seeing a bee chewing on a mite is another eyebrow raising experience.

 

[Finman]

For those of you who may not

Difficult to look

 

[B+.]

a bee chewing on a mite is another eyebrow raising experience.

I often see the chewed carapace of a varroa mite on the sticky insert I place under the floor in the spring. I suspect that this behaviour is a lot more common than people believe. However, it is only useful against phoretic mites, so, reproducing mites in the cells have to be evicted if the colony is to manage the growth in the population

 

[Fusion_power]

However, it is only useful against phoretic mites, so, reproducing mites in the cells have to be evicted

We are in agreement on this statement. Both VSH and Grooming have to be present for effective levels of mite resistance to express. VSH by itself is useful but can lead to a yin/yang situation. If too much VSH is expressed, the bees will remove healthy brood which severely limits colony buildup. If moderate levels of VSH are expressed, the bees will still need treating though not as often as susceptible bees. Combine moderate levels of VSH and moderate levels of Grooming and varroa go down to almost undetectable levels.

There are other mite tolerance traits. Cutting the egg to adult interval from 21 down to 19 days is one such.