Too late to comb change?

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SunnyRaes

House Bee
Joined
May 26, 2012
Messages
195
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0
Location
Devon
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
5 planned, in reality 7 + 1 nuc + 1 A/S into a commercial for a friend
We have a hive with fairly dirty comb that ideally we'd like to do a comb change on. I thought we were aiming to do it at the beginning of next season, but it appears my other half was planning to do it about now.

Coincidentally, we're also out of supers, and this hive needs a new super.

I understood that comb changes should take place early in the season. However as it needs a super, would it be worth considering instead of supering?

Now to be really cheeky.... If this was worth considering, would it be too much to ask of the bees to shift from National to 14x12?
 
We have a hive with fairly dirty comb that ideally we'd like to do a comb change on. I thought we were aiming to do it at the beginning of next season, but it appears my other half was planning to do it about now.

Coincidentally, we're also out of supers, and this hive needs a new super.

I understood that comb changes should take place early in the season. However as it needs a super, would it be worth considering instead of supering?

Now to be really cheeky.... If this was worth considering, would it be too much to ask of the bees to shift from National to 14x12?

that early comb change is humpug. It only spoils build up of the hive.

This time is the best to draw new combs. Then you have new combs.
You use foundation box as super and bees build it.

Then you have fresh combs to be give when ever.

.
 
Q

Thanks again Finman - yep, I see the logic there!

Now to decide whether to go 14x12 or just stick with National!
 
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I gove to my procuctive hives foundation boxes when I took them a few days ago to turnip rape. Now foundations are half drawn. When I extract the frames, there they are.
 
Can I ask what you mean by changing comb? We are new to this. One hive has old comb that came with the colony that we were given. We don't have any clean comb only foundation. I would like to change as it is difficult to see the eggs and also looks smaller (?) some has brood in but some has only stores
 
Tabby, you can change comb slowly by working old frames to the outside and replacing one by one with new or you can do something like a Bailey change outlined below

From the NBU


National Bee Unit
FAQ Sheet 32

Replacing Brood Comb


1.Why should I change old brood combs?
Combs should be changed regularly as they become damaged, contain extensive amounts or inconveniently placed drone comb, but mostly because used comb may contain the causative organism of many bee diseases, such as EFB, AFB, Nosema, etc.

2. How often should I change them?
There are many opinions as to this question but no brood comb should be used for more than three years. Used comb should be rendered or disposed of rather than being used in a different colony. For the small cost involved it is not worth ANY risk.

3. Is it easy?
Yes, providing you approach the change with a plan.

4. Are there different plans for single or double brood management?
These should be approached in different ways to gain the best results. The next Q. & A’s will help you decide how to do it.

5. Can I just replace the odd brood comb with foundation?
This is the most common system used by beekeepers and probably creates the most problems especially in single brood chamber management systems with the smaller types of hive. Foundation placed in a bottom brood chamber is invariably spoilt unless a powerful swarm with a good honey flow is drawing it out.
Foundation put into a bottom brood chamber is drawn out from the top downwards, as a result it becomes travel stained and covered in propolis. The bees then nibble the foundation away leaving holes between the comb and the bottom bars of the frame.
In double brood chamber systems the foundation can be put into the upper chamber so this problem does not occur.

6. What are the best systems?
There are two easy and effective systems, these are a) to replace old comb with prepared drawn comb and b) to perform a ‘Bailey Comb Change’.

7. How do I prepare drawn comb?
This is only practical for the smaller types of brood chamber. A clean brood chamber is filled with frames of foundation and placed over a queen excluder during a honey flow. i.e. used as a super. When the combs have been drawn and filled with honey they can be carefully extracted and stored for use as replacement combs.

8. How do I use these combs?
Towards the end of the bee keeping season frames that you wish to replace are moved to the ends of the brood chamber. During winter these frames become free of brood so in early spring, before the colony is expanding rapidly, they can be removed and replaced with drawn combs. Use of foundation at this time is not possible, as without a honey flow or extensive feeding the bees will not draw it out. (See also Q12) This exchange can take place on a warm day in March. Ensure that sufficient stores remain, if not feed the bees.

9. How do I perform a Bailey comb change?
Prepare a clean brood chamber filled with frames of foundation. Place this chamber over the existing brood chamber. Unless there is a strong nectar flow feed with winter strength sugar syrup i.e.1/2 ltr. of water to 1 kg. of sugar. When the bees have drawn out some of the foundation, find the queen and place her on this comb. Put a queen excluder over the old brood chamber and under the new, thus trapping the queen in the upper chamber. If possible arrange a new hive entrance between the two brood boxes and close off the old. (This helps to reduce the amount of pollen stored in the old lower combs. After three weeks remove the old brood chamber. The brood will have hatched and the comb can then be rendered to recover the beeswax.
This system is ideal for replacing all the combs at once and is best performed in early spring often, with clement weather, March is suitable, but remember to keep feeding so the bees can build comb.

 
Thank you very much. I think initially I will start to work them to the outside as you suggest. Will bear bailey method in mind though not sure when we last had clement weather in march!
 
Forget March. Now would be good. June gap is good too provided you haven't had to AS already.
Another great way to get new comb is AS if you are going to unite for the winter.
Yet another is to put a comb of foundation in the middle of the brood box in late summer, early autumn, to grow those winter bees.
 
Presumably that method can help prevent swarming too as gives extra brood box? Not keen on double brood but as this only temporary could be good solution.
Bit confused by your reference to AS if you are going to unite for the winter. Why AS before uniting?
 
I think there is no rush and doing it will of course divert some of your honey crop. You could do it in the mild way... just put a 14 x 12 BB under the current box. Then if there are enough of them and they need more room for the queen to lay, they will draw it. If there is a dearth of nectar or not enough bees, they will just leave it and nothing lost and bees not stressed.
 
Presumably that method can help prevent swarming too as gives extra brood box? Not keen on double brood but as this only temporary could be good solution.
Bit confused by your reference to AS if you are going to unite for the winter. Why AS before uniting?

I meant if you AS and re unite back to one colony for the winter you have an empty old box and a box full of new frames :)
 
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