The perfect creature?

[northernsoul]

Not according to BIBA - they are still very much a work in progress

http://www.bibba.com/origins_milner.php

Top Article
thanks

 

[user 6228]

Not according to BIBA - they are still very much a work in progress

http://www.bibba.com/origins_milner.php

Needs some updating to reflect the following:

The Origin of West European Subspecies of Honeybees (Apis mellifera): New Insights from Microsatellite and Mitochondrial Data Evolution 1998 vol 4 1119-1134 Franck et Al

From where did the Western honeybee (Apis mellifera) originate? Ecology and Evolution 2012 vol 8 pages 1949-1957 Fan et AL

 

[Finman]

.
There are 11 honeybee races (Apis mellifera) in Africa

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ecies_originating_in_the_Middle_East_and_Asia and more in Near East


And one is special:

Relocation of the Cape honeybee, Apis mellifera capensis, by bee-keepers from southern to northern South Africa in 1990 has caused widespread death of managed African honeybee, A. m. scutellata, colonies1. Apis mellifera capensis worker bees are able to lay diploid, female eggs without mating by means of automictic thelytoky2 (meiosis followed by fusion of two meiotic products to restore egg diploidy), whereas workers of other honeybee subspecies are able to lay only haploid, male eggs. The A. m. capensis workers, which are parasitizing and killing A. m. scutellata colonies in northern South Africa, are the asexual offspring of a single, original worker in which the small amount of genetic variation observed is due to crossing over during meiosis3 (P. Kryger, personal communication). Here we elucidate two principal mechanisms underlying this parasitism. Parasitic A. m. capensis workers activate their ovaries in host colonies that have a queen present (queenright colonies), and they lay eggs that evade being killed by other workers (worker policing)—the normal fate of worker-laid eggs in colonies with a queen4, 5, 6, 7, 8. This unique parasitism by workers is an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

.

an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.

Sounds suspiciously like humans

 

[Finman]

Sounds suspiciously like humans :

Originally Posted by Finman View Post
.

an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.



(

Sounds perfect but

.

 

[Finman]

Sounds suspiciously like humans : an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.



(

. Original text was : Cape bees' unique parasitism by workers is an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.

......... Parasites have selfish actions? Sounds human poetry.

.

 

[Apple]

. Original text was : Cape bees' unique parasitism by workers is an instance in which a society is unable to control the selfish actions of its members.

......... Parasites have selfish actions? Sounds human poetry.

.

Did not a chap called Dawkins write a novel on this theme?



James

 

[REDWOOD]

Selfish or not so selfish the survival of the fittest will evolve

 

[bontbee]

Selfish or not so selfish the survival of the fittest will evolve

Why have altruistic humans survived? They'd have been the first to go if fitness was the only criteria, wouldn't they?

 

[oliver90owner]

Humans are now surviving in a completely different way than Darwinian principles.

Technology is the name of the game. Over populate at the expense of the eco-habitat; drugs to combat disease ; vaccines to avoid death by naturally occurring pathogens. Using up the natural resources of the planet. So it goes on. All these cannot maintain the species forever. Something will give eventually - likely some gene or virus modification will open Pandora's box.

There were no trans-globe wars before humans changed their cultural systems from local hunter/gatherer to organised societies.

Humans as a species is not altruistic at all. Humans prefer to destroy, rather than live in harmony with the other species of the globe. Only those plants and animals which are deemed to improve the wealth of humans are encouraged to thrive (but are 'modified' to suit the humans, all the same). Scant 'reservations' are reserved as small areas which limit wildlife, but just sustain it from extinction.

Think about it simply.

 

[YorkshireBees]

Humans are now surviving in a completely different way than Darwinian principles.

Technology is the name of the game. Over populate at the expense of the eco-habitat; drugs to combat disease ; vaccines to avoid death by naturally occurring pathogens. Using up the natural resources of the planet. So it goes on. All these cannot maintain the species forever. Something will give eventually - likely some gene or virus modification will open Pandora's box.

There were no trans-globe wars before humans changed their cultural systems from local hunter/gatherer to organised societies.

Humans as a species is not altruistic at all. Humans prefer to destroy, rather than live in harmony with the other species of the globe. Only those plants and animals which are deemed to improve the wealth of humans are encouraged to thrive (but are 'modified' to suit the humans, all the same). Scant 'reservations' are reserved as small areas which limit wildlife, but just sustain it from extinction.

Think about it simply.

Well said!

 

[BeeBeeKa]

. Parasites have selfish actions? Sounds human poetry.

There is a country, both of us know pretty well about The country applied huge efforts in order to get rid of it’s selfish members – “the parasites on the body of society”. They ended up in poverty and bankruptcy as the whole state. As soon as they changed their attitude to their “selfish members” (businessman alike), they started to rise.
Oil prices infatuated their heads, but it`s a different story.
The key word, IMHO, is efficiency. The more efficiently the country can use both aspects of a human nature: the altruism and the selfishness, for the common good, the more it will thrive.As simple as... hard

 

[BeeBeeKa]

Technology is the name of the game.

Using up the natural resources of the planet. So it goes on. All these cannot maintain the species forever.

While technology is the name of the game, it can maintain the species forever imho Reserves of deuterium, tritium, lithium and helium on this planet are enough to provide the humanity with the energy for hundreds of thousands years. Just invent the technology. As simple as hard

Humans prefer to destroy, rather than live in harmony with the other species of the globe.

In different parts of the globe people live different ways… Some prefer to destroy, while some – to create. It`s a matter of an education and a management system, IMHO. If institutes of a particular state are able to ensure it`s people that creation is more beneficial than destroying, it will change an attitude of majority.
In the end of the day, if there is nothing been created, there is nothing to be destroyed, and that`s how the destroyers end up and die out, IMHO

Think about it simply.

Personaly I tried

 

[REDWOOD]

If you read genesis you will find the selfish gene started all them years ago

 

[Amari]

Humans are now surviving in a completely different way than Darwinian principles.

Technology is the name of the game. Over populate at the expense of the eco-habitat; drugs to combat disease ; vaccines to avoid death by naturally occurring pathogens. Using up the natural resources of the planet. So it goes on. All these cannot maintain the species forever. Something will give eventually - likely some gene or virus modification will open Pandora's box.

There were no trans-globe wars before humans changed their cultural systems from local hunter/gatherer to organised societies.

Humans as a species is not altruistic at all. Humans prefer to destroy, rather than live in harmony with the other species of the globe. Only those plants and animals which are deemed to improve the wealth of humans are encouraged to thrive (but are 'modified' to suit the humans, all the same). Scant 'reservations' are reserved as small areas which limit wildlife, but just sustain it from extinction.

Think about it simply.

I would argue that the whole chain of events described above is Darwinian. Homo sapiens is an animal evolved by natural selection. If he destroys his environment the species will perish. Other species, even if only slime moulds, may survive and so survival of the fittest reigns supreme.

 

[Bee Bumble]

I would argue that the whole chain of events described above is Darwinian. Homo sapiens is an animal evolved by natural selection. If he destroys his environment the species will perish. Other species, even if only slime moulds, may survive and so survival of the fittest reigns supreme.

I thought slime moulds were already running every country.

 

[REDWOOD]

It's quite funny that evolution has as many arguments Creationism, who's right or who's wrong, not even Oxford and Harvard can agree

 

[Apple]

I thought slime moulds were already running every country.

Slime moulds do have a level of intellectual ability then?



James

 

[Amari]

Slime moulds do have a level of intellectual ability then?
James

Depends on your parameters.

 

[charlie king]

The Selfish Gene is now being argued against again by scientists such as E.O Wilson in favour of group selection.

Perhaps the church of Richard Dawkins is not so infallible as it first claimed....(!)

Search for Group selection and Richard Dawkins on google and you will find the article published by the independant ( cant post links yet)

As for man lacking altruism I don't buy it at all. Just a way to justify ones own selfish urges and failings. Man has lived in harmony with the earth for a very long time. It is only recent history (post industrial revolution ) that paints a darker picture and that is a very small fraction of human existence indeed.

Cheer up!