Swienty vs Abelo poly

[Angry_Mob]

Just looking to know if anyone has experience with both these hives and which they prefer? Last year when I was researching hives I opted for the Swienty poly national hives as the reviews seemed very favourable.

I then realised I should of went 14x12 and was set on the Swienty however earlier this year Abelo launched their 14x12 hive. I've seen a lot of favourable reviews but is it worth the added expense?

A 14x12 from C.Wynne Jones with 2 supers costs £106 and a feeder is £26. Total: £132

Main pro is that it would match my existing kit and is cheaper. Con is that its bottom bee space and only 10 frames.

The Abelo 14x12 is £114.50, extra super is £22 and a feeder is £32. Total £168.50

They come pre assembled and painted all be it in garish colours. Much more dense (although seem more prone to condensation?) and have the plastic runner rails built in. Also 11 frames and I believe top bee space.

TIA

 

[mbc]

Both are bottom bee space, I have both, loads of the swienty boxes and a couple of abelo ones to try. The major advantage of the Abelo is they're ready to go out of the box, swienty need varnishing top and bottom and a couple of coats of paint.

 

[Madge]

There is no space above the top-bar lugs in the Swienties. That means the frames are often propolised to the box above it, and that can cause problems resulting in very angry bees. Abelos do not have any such problems. I have not found condensation to be a problem in either hive. Abelo’s plastic rails are easy to clean. The two hives have the same footprint, which means components are interchangeable. Abelo is made with a denser polystyrene - so, slightly less insulating (I’ve been told), but my bees do well in them.


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[fatshark]

I've got bees in both now. Swienty are softer, lighter and smaller (10 vs 11 frames). Abelo have an irritatingly large number of inserts and plugs. However, being ready-painted is a bonus.

It's not a like with like comparison as I use some wooden components mixed with the Swienty boxes, however I do see appreciably more condensation in the Abelo boxes. I'm not aware that this is a problem, just an observation.

 

[Madge]

... Swienty are softer, lighter and smaller (10 vs 11 frames). ...

The outside of the boxes are the same size - which is what I meant with ‘same footprint’ - but the floors and roofs of Abelos are much larger.


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[BMH]

Oh dear - please dont knock the Swienty boxes when Poly Hive is about.

You're inbox will be full!

KISS

 

[Madge]

...however I do see appreciably more condensation in the Abelo boxes. I'm not aware that this is a problem, just an observation.

I’m quoting you again, FS. When you see so much more condensation in the Abelos, do you mean the puddles of water gathering behind the frame lugs? I’ve seen that, but I think that’s because water condensing there can’t escape, whereas with Swienties the lug risers are inserts, and water can flow away. I haven’t yet found bees drowned in the gullies.

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[Finman]

I’m quoting you again, FS. When you see so much more condensation in the Abelos, do you mean the puddles of water gathering behind the frame lugs? I’ve seen that, but I think that’s because water condensing there can’t escape,

Those puddles are at the end of frames usual, because the plastic frame holder makes the pool in polyhives. I often break a little bit the end of the plastic frame holder that water can dribble onto floor and then drill out of hive.

The corner between between inner cover and the wall leaks so much cold, that it condensates water.

The site makes often mold because the pool has crasched bee bodies too, like as protein soup.

Bees stand many things and this is one of those.

 

[Swarm]

Of the two, I would say abelo is nearer a finished offering than swienty.
Must say that swienty messed up when they made their new design, they failed to address the lack of bottom bee space with their boxes and with each wall scalloped the way they are, it seems they saved themselves some poly. Thanks for posting the pics Kitta, they show the thin, weak outer wall at the lug ends, they are rounded off as well so only about an eighth of an inch is in contact with anything above at this point.
Worst part though, is the bee space, I run them TBS to avoid squashed bees but that means no runners so far more potch.
The abelo is alright but it is brittle so be careful not to bump them. I set the roof down with no weight stacked on it and a small stone managed to dig into it, the poly doesn't give, it crumbles. Too many bits to lose as well but it does have a nice roof.
I'm going back to tried and tested cedar boxes from now on, I'm fed up with compromises and the bees in my cedar boxes are every bit as healthy and vigorous as those in poly. With an abelo roof on them, they have all the insulation they could ever need.

 

[fatshark]

Good point Mellifera Crofter ... that's where I've been most aware of the condensation. It's a long time since I opened these boxes but thought I'd seen it on the (overengineered) crownboards as well. I'll look more carefully when I next check things.

I think Into The Lions Den has also commented on the 'fragility' or crumbly nature of the Abelo boxes. Not something I've noticed, but it's still early days.

Many of my hives just have a block of Kingspan underneath a folded Correx roof - all the warmth for about £3/hive.

And a strap!

 

[bee82]

I think Into The Lions Den has also commented on the 'fragility' or crumbly nature of the Abelo boxes. Not something I've noticed, but it's still early days.

Into The Lions Den = Denrosa/Swienty Poly Hives??? Don't expect any positive feedback.

 

[Etton]

Delighted with my Abelo hives which to me are strong & sturdy

 

[Madge]

Into The Lions Den = Denrosa/Swienty Poly Hives??? Don't expect any positive feedback.

As far as I know ITLD isn’t linked with Swienty any more (not for Nationals, anyway). Swienty’s design changed after he had left as somebody has already mentioned. And anyway, even if he was still linked, that wouldn’t have affected his assessment of Abelos.

 

[Finman]

.
If you want to test your different polyhives, put inside a handfull of major wax worms, and look how fast they go through the wall.

.

 

[Poly Hive]

The Abelo product is denser for sure and as Derek has explained less insulated for that reason.

Personally to me they feel odd and not for me thanks.

If they work for you then great.

PH

 

[Beefriendly]

The thermal differences between hard extruded and soft expanded poly are so negligible as to produce a red herring for anyone claiming one has significant thermal advantages over another.
http://www.greenspec.co.uk/building-design/insulation-materials-thermal-properties/

Phenolic Foam
Thermal conductivity/ λ (lambda)  W / m . K = 0.020
Density kg / m3 = 35

Polyurethane foam (PIR/PUR)
Thermal conductivity/ λ (lambda)  W / m . K = 0.023–0.026(18)
Density kg / m3 = 30 – 40

Expanded polystyrene (EPS)-Soft weak.
Thermal conductivity/ λ (lambda)  W / m . K = 0.034–0.038
Density kg / m3 = 15 - 30

Extruded polystyrene (XPS)-Hard, stronger
Thermal conductivity/ λ (lambda)  W / m . K = 0.033–0.035 (18)
Density kg / m3 = 20 - 40

 

[Finman]

.
And after all this your floor is widely open. Calculations do not work.

Warm air goes up, but same does the wind.


And like said, Nacka poly boxes had only 2 cm wall. Nowadays many poly boxes have 4 cm wall.

Bees wintered as well with 2 cm polywall in -30C temps.

 

[Beefriendly]

.
And after all this your floor is widely open.
.

Speak for yourself...my floors are firmly closed.
The point is simple; to claim one poly hive has far superior thermal properties to another is deeply flawed when the differences between materials creates such a small difference in thermal properties.

 

[mbc]

The Abelo product is denser for sure and as Derek has explained less insulated for that reason.

Personally to me they feel odd and not for me thanks.

If they work for you then great.

PH

I like the Abelo boxes I've got, the reinforced top and bottom seem robust and the insulation is plenty good enough. The roof is also good, I'm not so sure on the crown board or floor but it's not essential to buy the complete hives.

 

[Angry_Mob]

I don't mind painting the hives, I actually enjoy it but then again I don't have many yet.

Has anyone painted the Abelo hives as I'd be tempted to do that. I'm think I'll try an Abelo given the feedback here.