Super under?

[Ailsaboat]

After collecting my first honey(yey!!) I was advised to put the super with the frames in under the brood box for the bees to clean.

Now I've read on hear that it is recommended to leave the super under for the winter - maybe helps with drafts etc??

But my question is, do you leave the frames in the super over winter, and if so, at what point in spring do you remove it?

Cheers

 

[Luminos]

Before they fill it full of pollen ...

 

[Amari]

My practice (Nationals with one Brood box per colony): August - remove honey. Return empty 'wet' super above BBox. Sept - feed c. 15kg 2:1 syrup per colony after reducing hive entrances. October: remove super (now full of capped syrup) and put below BB. REMOVE QUEEN EXCLUDER. BB is now on top and accessible for oxalic acid treatment at new year.

 

[enrico]

Only do what a amari says if you can fill both bb and super with syrup! Otherwise bees are just moving syrup from one place to another!
I put them under bb on a cold day.... Like today... I gently lift the bb and if the super is nearly empty of bees I brush the remainder off and take the super off. If however there are loads of bees in it the chances are that there is syrup in there too, so I leave it until January and have another go then. It is best done with two people. One to lift the bb and one to check the super and remove if necessary.
E

 

[Amari]

Only do what a amari says if you can fill both bb and super with syrup! Otherwise bees are just moving syrup from one place to another!

Ah, I agree this is what happens but that is good. With super full of syrup beneath BB I do no further manipulations until late March. By then the bees have almost invariably removed all the stores from the super = clean empty super (swapped back to top of BB) ready for the honey flow.
If I leave the super full of stores above the BB, come spring there is almost invariably some sugar stores still in the super. Then you have a problem of what to do with super frames containing sugar- -improper to use this for honey flow.

 

[For want of a better word]

My practice (Nationals with one Brood box per colony): August - remove honey. Return empty 'wet' super above BBox. Sept - feed c. 15kg 2:1 syrup per colony after reducing hive entrances. October: remove super (now full of capped syrup) and put below BB. REMOVE QUEEN EXCLUDER. BB is now on top and accessible for oxalic acid treatment at new year.

Only 15 kg of 2:1... hardly enough

minimum of 24 litres of 2:1 syrup providing 20Kg of sugar, and half as much again for a decent size colony on double brood std Nationals.
Possibly colonies housed in warmer polly hives may need less.... no intention of losing valuable colonies to starvation caused by fiscal tight fistedness.

As for opening any colony to pour acid on in the worst of mid winter... foolhardy in the extreme!

 

[Amari]

Only 15 kg of 2:1... hardly enough

minimum of 24 litres of 2:1 syrup providing 20Kg of sugar, and half as much again for a decent size colony on double brood std Nationals.
Possibly colonies housed in warmer polly hives may need less.... no intention of losing valuable colonies to starvation caused by fiscal tight fistedness.

As for opening any colony to pour acid on in the worst of mid winter... foolhardy in the extreme!

Amazing how we all differ! A post about 10 days ago (can't find it) scorned feeding at all and relied on ivy with back-up fondant if needed in spring!
As for oxalic acid in new year, my feeling is that most forumites use it. Is there a poll facility on this forum?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

As for oxalic acid in new year, my feeling is that most forumites use it. Is there a poll facility on this forum?

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=15237

 

[Ailsaboat]

Thanks everyone, seems as with most things in beekeeping it's personal preference!!
I think I'll remove it so I don't cause myself any probs if they start to use it.
As for feeding, I'm following the approach of keep feeding them until they stop taking it approach.

 

[Amari]

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=15237

Thanks for that

 

[Tonyatcwfarm]

Is it not possible to demaree the super in spring

 

[hiveabee]

A very experienced keeper in our branch, always recommends putting a super (either full or empty) under the brood box for winter. His theory is; which I think is correct, is the fact that the cluster will be a suitable distance away from the OMF so as not to get chilled. This does seem to make sense.

 

[Amari]

Is it not possible to demaree the super in spring

Sorry, not sure what you mean. Please expand.

 

[Tonyatcwfarm]

I'm stuck with a full super above bb at the moment and was planning on going brood and a half next year but with the amount of negatives I read about that system now I'm not so sure.I was thinking it might be possible to smoke/brush or shake the super clear to make sure Q is in main bb,cover with qx add a super or 2 another qx then the brooded half. crown board and roof
Maybe my thinking is flawed but I'm sure I'll find out soon

 

[Les]

I'm stuck with a full super above bb at the moment and was planning on going brood and a half next year but with the amount of negatives I read about that system now I'm not so sure.I was thinking it might be possible to smoke/brush or shake the super clear to make sure Q is in main bb,cover with qx add a super or 2 another qx then the brooded half on top crown board and roof
Maybe my thinking is flawed but I'm sure I'll find out soon

It’s best not to go into winter with a qx in the hive as the queen could get separated from the bees.
At this stage of the year I would leave things as they are.

 

[Tonyatcwfarm]

It’s best not to go into winter with a qx in the hive as the queen could get separated from the bees.
At this stage of the year I would leave things as they are.

Sorry les
I thought it was clear that these manipulations I was considering were for next year

 

[Swarm]

If you'd put the half underneath it would be free by next Spring, allowing you the option to go double brood, which has its advantages.

 

[For want of a better word]

This could get confusing.....

Super above "THE CROWN BOARD " to clean up... that is OK... possibly not above the brood box?

Super full of stores above " THE BROOD BOX "....

If you want to put the super under the brood box for winter.. leave the frames... full or not in !

Whatever Do feed them and ensure queen excluders are removed before winter !

Good Luck

 

[mbc]

A very experienced keeper in our branch, always recommends putting a super (either full or empty) under the brood box for winter. His theory is; which I think is correct, is the fact that the cluster will be a suitable distance away from the OMF so as not to get chilled. This does seem to make sense.

Good advice for omf's IMHO

 

[Stickyfingers]

Bees move sideways then up. Let them follow there natural path.....super above.