Strike

[For want of a better word]

I will be supporting the picket line at my local primary school tomorrow so you will all be pleased to know I will not be posting !

 

[countryman]

I WILL NOT!!!!!!! lol

 

[The Cumbrian]

I will be supporting the picket line at my local primary school tomorrow

Good for you! The government are trying to pull a fast one on teachers. In 2007 their pension payments were increased and from 2013 will be self financing so all this talk of needing to take more because people are living longer and the other tax payers supporting their pension is frankly B******s.

Incidentally you might like to be aware that for every £1 of tax payers money which goes to support public service pensions £2.50 of taxpayers money goes to support the top 1% of earners pensions and fill in gaps in private pensions where employers have fallen down on the job.




















[/QUOTE]

 

[countryman]

my pension payments had to double to keep the same payments when brown abolished the private pension aid and increased my retirement to 67 not a bad deal hey unlike the public sector who can retire at what age! i will get some abuse but so what each to there own but i could not strike and hold everyone to ranson!!!!!!

 

[Karol]

Good for you! The government are trying to pull a fast one on teachers. In 2007 their pension payments were increased and from 2013 will be self financing so all this talk of needing to take more because people are living longer and the other tax payers supporting their pension is frankly B******s.

Incidentally you might like to be aware that for every £1 of tax payers money which goes to support public service pensions £2.50 of taxpayers money goes to support the top 1% of earners pensions and fill in gaps in private pensions where employers have fallen down on the job.

[/QUOTE]

Just out of interest, how can they be self financing?

 

[Storm™]

I support the strikers. We will be very inconvenienced today by these strikes but good on them. This government is using every dirty trick in the book and out of it to support champaign Charlie lifestyles and are using every desperate measure to tar these people with some kind of traitor like image to shame them into towing a very naff line. This government has bombastically trodden people's opinions, and hopes into the ground with a "what's the matter with you get on with it" attitude. Teachers teaching at 68 - art fair enough, maths, perhaps. Games/P.E. er no. Fire fire fighters or nurses. Removing choices again. Not on. Up with the strikers. And I hope though doubt Cameron will listen. Because he is a to55er.

Edit - Fire fire fighters??? Wtf. Bloody iPhone predictive txts. Well whoever strikes it's fair do's. I only hope that if anyone else who in future should need to strike gets support. Instead of vilified by the government for doing so.

 

[The Cumbrian]

Just out of interest, how can they be self financing?[/QUOTE]

BY payments made by the workers and presumably investing those payments. The statement was from the treasury in 2006/7 so perhaps you had better ask them.

Incidentally these "gold plated" pensions amount in the case of teachers to an average pension of £10,000 per annum. Most people would recon that is very thin gold plate.

 

[RoofTops]

A teacher retiring after a full career will get a pension of about 24k, the 10k average quoted by NUT includes teachers who only worked a few years.

 

[Appinpiper]

I feel that the strike is not valid as the private sector are not paid more these days and are in the main unable to get the equivalent pension of the public sector.
What is unfair is that the poorer members of society are paying more as a percentage of their income than the richer members and of course the pigs in the trough!

 

[Drew]

My only comment in such an obviously political thread is:

Isn't this the wrong Section? Off Topic Chat - Shirley!

 

[OXFORDBEE]

my pension payments had to double to keep the same payments when brown abolished the private pension aid and increased my retirement to 67 not a bad deal hey unlike the public sector who can retire at what age! i will get some abuse but so what each to there own but i could not strike and hold everyone to ranson!!!!!!

Same here, I've experienced no pay rises, changes to pension yield and increased contributions. I'm in the real world, work longer and get less....

 

[drstitson]

Rooftops 100%

The media repeatedly let the unions trot out these figures of AVERAGE public sector pensions without qualification (ie that that includes all wage levels PLUS all terms of employment from 2-40+ years).

The lowest paid public servants have in fact seen improvements in pension provision in recent years (move to 60ths scheme) and any proposed changes are likely to have little impact on them in terms of increased contribs. career averaging is irrelevent if you have slaved away in a bottom tier job with little or no scale progression.

For years employers, unions and financial advisers have promoted the public schemes as shockingly generous - nowhere else could (in many cases) less than 5% of salary buy you a pension of upto 50% of final salary, far from it. In the grand scheme of things we're talking levels of personal contributions little different to that put away into xmas hamper schemes with high chance of failure. £100 a week pension is surely better value than a bottle of baileys, a stodgy fruit cake, a tin of ham and a jar of quality street (oh plus/or the promise of high street ie woolworths vouchers!).

This should have been sorted gradually over the last 25 years.

Likewise the state pension age should be increased much faster than proposed towards 70 PLUS incorporate the ability to review life expectancy say every 5 years and make changes as necessary.

 

[countryman]

when the public pensions were brought out that was because they were poorly paid so they got the pension and earlier retirement which was fair but under the lst government that all changed they are now paid about 12.5% more in comparison than private sector in simular jibs until recenctly could retire after 30 years service whereas private had to do 50 years a lot can still retire at 55 get there pension and get another job (double bubble)in the health service 1 medical staff - 2 pen pushers, private sector 20 staff - 1 penpusher buisness would be bust at that rate in the public sector

 

[The Cumbrian]

A teacher retiring after a full career will get a pension of about 24k, the 10k average quoted by NUT includes teachers who only worked a few years.

SO you are suggesting that an ordinary classroom teacher at the top of the scale earns 48,000 per year?

Wrong! The main professional pay scale runs up to 31,552 plus a couple of thousand for having crossed the "Threshold" so say 34,000 which gives the rare teacher who has done 40 years 17,000.

The majority of teachers these days haven't done 40 years in a classroom having either come in after a previous career or leaving before the end of their career many due to "nervous breakdowns" so the average could be near the 10,000 quoted.

The pension is also deferred pay. In that teachers are qualified to a level which can pay considerably higher than teaching. I recently knew a young lady who started as a teacher and continually pointed out she had taken a 10,000 a year pay cut for the privilege . My own daughter (still in her 20s) earns about what the 40 year teacher mentioned above would be earning.

 

[countryman]

evan on 10,000 pension that is still DOUBLE the state pension of the private sector fair or not

 

[drstitson]

"In that teachers are qualified to a level which can pay considerably higher than teaching"

Yes - but one of the most important choices one makes employment wise is re the whole package (ie including job security AND pension). For many people previously then it has been a no brainer - satisfactory pay level plus job for life and excellent pension - or take a chance out in the real world.

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

My only comment in such an obviously political thread is:

Isn't this the wrong Section? Off Topic Chat - Shirley!

 

[Nose Ma]

Don’t we all simply make choices – about career, about pension, about lifestyle? I work in the private sector because I chose to. My sister is a school teacher because she chose to. I chose the private sector because it paid better (at the time) and for me offered a more varied career path. I realised I could, if I wished, move to the public sector later. I don’t, because every time I deal with the public sector it all annoys with endless committees and the general feeling that one is always trying to turn an aircraft carrier with a small stick.

My sister chose teaching because of the relative security, long holidays, convenient working hours, good union support, well above median salary, and pension. She is annoyed about the pension changes, which I understand, but its similar to me being annoyed about my public sector equivalent being paid at least the same as me, and still getting a better pension. She can, if she wishes, leave teaching and join the private sector, just as I could do the reverse.

Striking, I think, is just divisive. It entrenches the position of the striker, and annoys those dependent upon the striker, just widening the gulf.

As a genuine question – do the Union Bosses who call for these strikes also forgo a day’s pay today, or do their members’ subs keep them happily paid their £100k a year (plus housing, plus pension, plus expenses)?

Oh, and I agree. Wrong section of the forum. Unless the bees are on strike too.

 

[countryman]

i return to my former point that public sector was lower paid so they got the better retirement package i am a fully skilled welder/fabricator done my 5 year apprentership v poor wages for 5 years well below that of everyone else but what did brown do DESTROYED the private sector penshion schemes and lavished the public sector WHY?

 

[The Cumbrian]

evan on 10,000 pension that is still DOUBLE the state pension of the private sector fair or not

Surely the point should be for the private sector to be doing something to ensure that it has pension plans in place for its workers rather than pulling down public sector pensions where unions have had the sense to negotiate over the years to ensure a reasonable pension.

The alternative is that workers in the private sector take the proportion of their wages which are taken by public sector employers and save for their retirement. Remember the public sector worker has in effect 20 to 25% of their pay taken for pensions before they get it. (Somebody is bound to question this so that is the total of the workers contribution i.e. listed on their pay slip and taken out before they get it and the employers contribution, which is part of the cost of employing the worker and would go to the worker in other circumstances. See my examples of people and their pay above).