Splitting hive

[Newbeebeekeeper]

Hi everyone,

I have a hive that barely made it out of winter and have maybe a quarter of a frame of bees but the queen is laying in a full sized hive. I have another full sized hive doing well and another I was given as a friend gave up which is huge but 12 miles from my house

My thoughts are to take 3 frames of bee from the huge hive and make a nuc in my garden when I move it to my garden.

Then leave it for a few days and introduce the queen to it after a few more days.

I would probably put a super on the huge hive and if the other big hive does well then I would put a super on it too.

Any thoughts or feedback would be very welcome

 

[pargyle]

Firstly, What are you trying to achieve ?

Getting more colonies or saving/building up a hive with only a few bees in it ?

Where is your 'new' queen going to come from - are you going to buy one in ?

Bit more information would help the suggestions for a way forward.

 

[Murox]

You have multiple options of course. Personally I would get that weak colony into a nuc pronto and give it some help. If no nuc box then dummy down and insulate significantly. Then move quickly to move/sort/increase the other hives.

 

[Newbeebeekeeper]

I have 1 strong hive
1 good hive
1 barely there hive with a laying queen.

Plan was to take 2 frames from strongest hive and put into a poly nuc with the queen of the barely there hive.

I have an empty poly nuc and all ready to go for this.

Would the best bet to move the big hive home and then take the 2 frames of bees out to home to the nuc let it sit for a few days then add the queen

Or

Take the nuc from the big hive while it's still at a distance and move it back and mix the queen then. And move the big hive back home a few days later. I like this more as I wont have help lifting the hive

Do I need to leave a few days between adding the queen so the scent of the old one is gone or just put her in the queen cage with fondant and she should be ok?

 

[pargyle]

1. It's rarely a good idea to bolster a weak hive with frames from a strong hive. If the queen in your 'barely there hive' has a laying queen then she ain't that good a queen, if she's any good then the colony will recover - do as Murox says - get them into a Nuc or dummy down the existing hive to give them less space to heat and see if she gets going. Some queens just take a while to get going.

2. Bring the hive that is 12 miles away back home - at least then you have all your stock in one place.

After that ... we still don't know what you are trying to achieve - if you want more colonies then take a split (might still be a bit early still) from one of the strong hives - you can take a frame of brood and eggs with the nurse bees on them from each of the strong hives and frames of stores put them in your nuc and they will make queen cells and raise a new queen - effectively a walk away split and let them get on with it.

There's a dozen ways to make increase, Demaree on one of your big hives is an option ... but it all comes down to what you are trying to do ...

 

[Angry_Mob]

If you want to try and rescue the weak colony then I'd take the Queen in a cage and a poly nuc to the "huge" hive, put in your 2/3 frames (make sure they have stores) and Queen in the cage, close it up and bring it home and place on the weak hive spot and shake the weak colony out. They should beg into the nuc then.

 

[pargyle]

If you want to try and rescue the weak colony then I'd take the Queen in a cage and a poly nuc to the "huge" hive, put in your 2/3 frames (make sure they have stores) and Queen in the cage, close it up and bring it home and place on the weak hive spot and shake the weak colony out. They should beg into the nuc then.

I don't think the OP has a spare queen ? He's talking about saving one weak colony by weakening a strong colony - makes no sense.

Better to just kill the queen in the weakest colony and shake them out in front of his strong hive - bring the hive that is 12 miles away home and then do a walk away split with a frame from each of the two hives in a few weeks when there are more drones about.

 

[Newbeebeekeeper]

Ideally I would like 3 hives for the summer. It seems a shame to waste a queen this early in the season.

My thoughts were if she makes a good go of it then she would be ok with the extra frames of bees. If not then I give her a p45 in a few weeks.

The weather is good today so I plan on putting her in my poly nuc for now and going to get the other hive tonight or tomorrow night

Plan is for 3 strong hives for honey this year

 

[pargyle]

Ideally I would like 3 hives for the summer. It seems a shame to waste a queen this early in the season.

My thoughts were if she makes a good go of it then she would be ok with the extra frames of bees. If not then I give her a p45 in a few weeks.

The weather is good today so I plan on putting her in my poly nuc for now and going to get the other hive tonight or tomorrow night

Plan is for 3 strong hives for honey this year

OK .. I would not waste bees or time on a weak colony .. get her into a Nuc with what she has - she will either make it or not. If she doesn't you can split one of your stronger hives, if you want a quick result, spend £35 on a decent queen and you will have three strong hives going into summer. I would not hold your breath that a colony as small as you suggest will thrive and develop .. even if she is laying.

Look at doing a Demaree on one of your strong hives and grow your own if you don't want to spend a few quid and have the certainty of a producer hive in the summer.

 

[Poly Hive]

This queen as demonstrated such sterling qualities that you want to reuse her?

So next Spring and she is a year older you are hoping for a miracle? I strongly suspect you will have a dead colony.


Her performance is rubbish. To borrow from a strong colony to bolster what you are telling us is near dead is a complete waste. Forget it full stop

Work with your good colony and down the line take of a couple of nucs and there are your three colonies for next season, and with new queens.

There is a time to cull and this is one of them.

PH

 

[BeeSpace]

I wouldn't sacrifice brood from a strong colony to save the weak one, but would pop the weak one into a nuc as advised above and see what happens. If it comes to life, it's a bonus and if not, you haven't lost anything.

I had a nuc that went into winter very weak - it was the workers left from two drone laying colonies with a queen chucked in very late in the season to see if I could get them through (I'm still too sentimental!). I didn't expect them to survive winter, but to my surprise, they did. Around one frame of bees. A week ago, they were limping along with some tiny patches of brood across three frames (really small patches) and I closed them up, accepting there just weren't enough bees and they wouldn't make it. A cursory check yesterday astonished me as the queen has been laying like a machine, nectar and pollen stores much increased and I've had to give them some more frames to play with. Remains to be seen if they'll become a productive colony, but it's been an interesting one to observe and learn how they can progress given good luck.

 

[enrico]

I was once told by an old beekeeper, if you have three hives one will always be good, one medium, and one pretty useless. Seems you have just proved him right!

 

[Newbeebeekeeper]

I moved the smallest hive into a poly nuc and will see how they do.

The big hive will come down tonight or tomorrow night then get a super next warm day we have.

Thanks everyone

 

[Murox]

Hope it all goes smoothly.

 

[pargyle]

Keep us posted .. best of luck with it all.