Shopping list 😁

[North End Bees]

And back to the 'Shopping list', even if you've decided on a hive type, wait till the Jan sales.

Thornes do a very good one just after Xmas when they sell seconds much much cheaper than their first quality hives. (English Cedar instead of Canadian but otherwise almost identical.)

You can buy the components for 3 hives for the price of one 'first'. Three might sound a lot when you've not even got one yet, but you'll soon be glad you've got them!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Leaving aside varroa treatment - which is an essential for beginners - I found the advice on cleaning hives and frames etc to be totally contrary to other facts ( that is : known facts , not made up ones).

Propolis acts as an antiseptic and bees cover most of the inside of the hive and the frames with it.
So why would any sane person want to remove it? (unless it is very thick and then remove the surplus).
Cleaning floors: takes all of 5 minutes with a scraper. (see also propolis above).

I am afraid to say beekeeping in the UK reminds me of the Middle Ages and the Enlightenment. People believed what they were told in the Middle Ages and conformed. The Enlightenment encouraged thinking and understanding why you do things and junked a lot of old thoughts.

BIBBA and the BBKA fall into the Middle Ages camp as there as many opinions on subjects as beekeepers and the more voluble ones tend to be unaware of the words "evidence" and "facts". And neither organisation practise any quality control on their publications so tend to issue proven rubbish at times..

If you have read any books for beekeeping beginners, you will have noticed what is called 'spring cleaning' is almost always recommended. I don't think spring cleaning, as usually understood in connecion with bees, is a bit of good, except that it keeps enthusiastic amateurs happy in the belief that they are doing something to help their bees..............

The practice of what is usually referred to as 'spring cleaning' is really quite unneccessary............. but hobbyists pay great attention to this operation, making a regular field day of it. I remember seeing a lady beekeeper do it some years ago. She only had two hives of bees, but made great preparation for the job and attached it armed with smoker, veil, scraper, soda and water, scrubbing brush, spirit level and a whole battery of tool. Dressed in breeches and a white bee-suit, she looked most impressive and awe inspiring; but it was all quite unneccessary

Many years ago, a prominent amateur bee-keeper made a statement that afterwards became quite famous through constant reiteration. She said 'Bees do nothing invariably.'

all from ROB Manley's 'Beekeeping in Britain' published in 1948

The fathers of beekeeping in England, who demonstrated in frock-coat and top hat, considered that that it was not possible to make a living from bees, but recommended it as a profitable hobby, a source of entertainment and possibly pocket money for the cottager.......They were quite correct in saying that [it] was not possible using the equipment and technigues they advocated. Their teaching held British beekeeping in thraldom for fifty years until a few hardy types.............casting off the traditions of the exponents [and orthodox teachings] of hobbyist beekeeping.......are today the commercial beekeepers of Britain

Dr Francis G Smith Head of beekeeping Division - Forestry department of Tanganyika, founder member of IBRA
'Beekeeping in the tropics' 1960

 

[ericbeaumont]

(slightly cheaper than Sherriff but as good imo.)

BBWear better, I reckon: had one Sheriff for two seasons and the veil concertinas already.

 

[Swarm]

I've had the wind cause that with a BBWear suit, the mesh was blown against my face.

 

[Swarm]

Hi,
Thanks. Having been a beekeeper for a relatively short number of seasons I've learnt there are many answers to the same question and they can all be right. I religiously followed my teachers and mentors advice at the beginning. As I gain experience, I find shortcuts and find different ways of achieving the same goal that work better for me, or my bees. This is the great benefit of this forum, sharing alternative ways of beekeeping, whilst doing it in a polite way. Difficult at times, when passion for the subject runs high.
E

And remember of course, nobody is always right

 

[The Poot]

I've had the wind cause that with a BBWear suit, the mesh was blown against my face.

Hi Swarm, that’s actually why I mentioned the cap inside the hood. I didn’t fully explain my point. I have a Sherriff which is only an issue in wind, (not as was assumed, a cheap suit). I would think it would be an issue with any suit.

 

[BeeKeyPlayer]

all from ROB Manley's 'Beekeeping in Britain' published in 1948

I've had Manley's Honey Farming on a wish list for some time and now you've alerted me to this other book. Would you recommend one over the other?

 

[Nannysbees]

Thank you....I've just been to Nature's Little Helpers website....I didn't know they were there....Lisvane is only a half hour drive from me.....I notice they sell nucs of bees.....did you get your bees from them???

Yes we did get one of the colonies from Tim, and they have been great, very calm lovely bees to work with, he is so supportive, tell him Melanie and Clive recommended him he'll know us straight away as he's helped us every step of the way

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I've had Manley's Honey Farming on a wish list for some time and now you've alerted me to this other book. Would you recommend one over the other?

Can't really say. Honey Farming is a classic but 'Beekeeping in Britain' being, as Manley himself maintained a book aimed at beginners and hobbyists in general (he also said, that even back then that there were more than enough books aimed at beginners.) Is wwll worth keeping in your library.

 

[Amari]

Bees... please try to buy locally bred ones

OUT APIARY... guess you now know that this is another nice accessible and secure site to keep your bees.
It needs to be at least THREE MILES from you main site. so you can move bees around to relocate etc.
Chons da

I can't agree with your three miles - another example of endlessly repeated dogma IMHO. My main apiary is 400m from my home [another bit of advice to beginners: don't keep bees in a small garden especially if there're other dwellings adjacent] and two out-apiaries all in the same parish. Each site is about 1km apart.

Over 20 years I've moved colonies freely between these sites without problem. Maybe a few flying bees return to base but what evs???

 

[North End Bees]

Over 20 years I've moved colonies freely between these sites without problem. Maybe a few flying bees return to base but what evs???

Yes, probably not too much of a problem if you have bees at all the sites (and one doesn't get EFB, say).

But if someone has to completely move their bees from the garden apiary one day because they're being a bit horrible, then the returners to base will be a problem.

I think best to keep the sites separate by a few miles flying distance.

 

[madasafish]

Yes, probably not too much of a problem if you have bees at all the sites (and one doesn't get EFB, say).

But if someone has to completely move their bees from the garden apiary one day because they're being a bit horrible, then the returners to base will be a problem.

I think best to keep the sites separate by a few miles flying distance.

I have moved bees less than a mile with no issues.
BUT undulating terrain and woods in between .

 

[ericbeaumont]

Would you recommend one over the other?

If you ask Mr Northern Bee Books - Jerry Burbidge - he'll tell you that although Manley wrote the finest beekeeping books on this planet, he was wont to repeat himself, which is why Honey Farming has been in constant print but not the other two (Honey Production in The British Isles and Beekeeping in Britain).

Add Donald Sims' 60 Years with Bees and you'll have four fine books that'll make lockdown a surprising pleasure.

 

[Nick Lang]

So is there a big difference between using 14x12 brood boxes and two standard brood boxes?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

So is there a big difference between using 14x12 brood boxes and two standard brood boxes?

Personal preference really - running brood on two deeps is always preferable to brood and a half some of us don't like jumbo frames but it is a personal thing, some love them.

 

[ericbeaumont]

So is there a big difference between using 14x12 brood boxes and two standard brood boxes?

Yes: weight.

Though a 14x12 box gives 41% more comb area than one deep, two lighter deeps give more space than one 14x12 and way, way more management flexibility.

 

[thorn]

& your SO starts complaining to you & anyone who will listen that they’re a ‘Bee widow’

Or a bee bore.

 

[thorn]

Remember to always have sufficient matchsticks with you.

 

[pargyle]

Yes: weight.

Though a 14x12 box gives 41% more comb area than one deep, two lighter deeps give more space than one 14x12 and way, way more management flexibility.

Although a lot of us prefer the flexbility of having all the brood in one box (14x12 is effectively equivalent to Brood and a half) so you can overwinter in one box, there's usually enough space for any queen to lay and you only have to inspect one box of frames on inspections and you don't need to lift a top box of brood off and put it somewhere whilst you inspect the bottom box. I rarely have to lift any brood boxes whereas those with nationals and double brood are always swapping boxes around or adding more ...

Pays yer money and takes yer choice ... just make sure BEFORE buying kit that you have chosen the right format for you because mis-matched kit doesn't work well and it gets expensive having to change from your initial choice if you change your mind.

The discussion about what is best in hive types will still be running long after I'm gone but the best advice is to get alongisde beekeepers with all types of hive and get involved with inspecting them - you wlll discover first hand what format you like or dislike ... it's one of the most important decisions you will make when you start out ...

 

[North End Bees]

the best advice is to get alongisde beekeepers with all types of hive and get involved with inspecting them - you wlll discover first hand what format you like or dislike ... it's one of the most important decisions you will make when you start out ...

My mentor when I started out had nationals, commercials and 14*12 (she had inherited hives over the 40 years she'd been beekeeping before I came along).

I realised early on I didn't like the 14*12 frames as I have RA in my wrists. Ditto the commercial supers with non-existant hand holds.