scavenged frames after extraction

[matstones]

I was given one hive of bees this summer, which so far has been very successful.

I do have a question...

I harvested the honey last weekend and read in several of my bee books to let the colony scavenge/clean off the frames and equiment after extraction.

I left the empty, sticky frames outside the the hive - and the bees went wild for it as expected, but it also attracted 1000's of wasps. We made a few honey traps, (which interestingly only attracted wasps, not a single bee) - but although we killed many wasps, it didn't make a dent on the wasp problem.

So I put the sticky frames, still in their 2 supers in the hive (comprising of: brood chamber, 2 framed supers, 1 empty super (gap for feeding) then these 2 sticky supers - on the basis the bees could clean up from inside.

This worked - after 2 days the frames were "dry" - but still full of bees.

So the question is how do I extract the 2 supers without upsetting the bees.

Today I removed them, and set up as a separate hive - ie added roof and floor to 2 supers.

I am not expecting this sub-colony to survive, having too few bees, no brood and not enough food, but will the bees leave this hive and return to the proper hive - which is a few feet away...?

Or should I "shake" the bees off each frame into to the proper hive, or on the ground in front of it.

Any advice greatly received

 

[TBRNoTB]

I was given one hive of bees this summer, which so far has been very successful.

I do have a question...

I harvested the honey last weekend and read in several of my bee books to let the colony scavenge/clean off the frames and equiment after extraction.

I left the empty, sticky frames outside the the hive - and the bees went wild for it as expected, but it also attracted 1000's of wasps. We made a few honey traps, (which interestingly only attracted wasps, not a single bee) - but although we killed many wasps, it didn't make a dent on the wasp problem.

So I put the sticky frames, still in their 2 supers in the hive (comprising of: brood chamber, 2 framed supers, 1 empty super (gap for feeding) then these 2 sticky supers - on the basis the bees could clean up from inside.

This worked - after 2 days the frames were "dry" - but still full of bees.

So the question is how do I extract the 2 supers without upsetting the bees.

Today I removed them, and set up as a separate hive - ie added roof and floor to 2 supers.

I am not expecting this sub-colony to survive, having too few bees, no brood and not enough food, but will the bees leave this hive and return to the proper hive - which is a few feet away...?

Or should I "shake" the bees off each frame into to the proper hive, or on the ground in front of it.

Any advice greatly received

Put the 'Dry' supers on top of a clearer board on the original hive. Wait one/two days and remove bee free supers! Simples (I think!)

 

[Haughton Honey]

Put the 'Dry' supers on top of a clearer board on the original hive. Wait one/two days and remove bee free supers! Simples (I think!)

Erm, no.

If you put the supers above a clearer board then the bees won't be able to get up to the frames that you want cleaning.

Put the extracted supers above the crown board with the feed hole open - possibly on top of an eke or an empty super, thereby getting the bees to take the scraps back down in to the brood box to store.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

A word of advice for the future - don't leave extracted frames out in the open for bees to 'clean out' it encourages robbing and can spread disease.
Next time, after extracting the honey, put the supers back on the hive with a feeder board (crown board with hole in) below - the bees will then go up and clear the frames as they think it's 'outside' the hive.
The books aren't always right

 

[taff..]

Erm, no.

If you put the supers above a clearer board then the bees won't be able to get up to the frames that you want cleaning.

Put the extracted supers above the crown board with the feed hole open - possibly on top of an eke or an empty super, thereby getting the bees to take the scraps back down in to the brood box to store.

Erm, yes.

the OP says that the supers have been cleaned out and are dry.

poping a clearer board underneath the empty supers will clear them of bees allowing them to be removed

 

[TBRNoTB]

Erm, yes.

the OP says that the supers have been cleaned out and are dry.

poping a clearer board underneath the empty supers will clear them of bees allowing them to be removed

Thanks Taff!

 

[itma]

A word of advice for the future - don't leave extracted frames out in the open for bees to 'clean out' it encourages robbing and can spread disease.
Next time, after extracting the honey, put the supers back on the hive with a feeder board (crown board with hole in) below - the bees will then go up and clear the frames as they think it's 'outside' the hive.
The books aren't always right

but even better if you can put a completely empty super between feeder board and the supers to be scavenged.


And there is also the possibility of storing the frames 'wet'. Which has the advantage of being less attractive to Wax Moth.

 

[Haughton Honey]

Erm, yes.

the OP says that the supers have been cleaned out and are dry.

poping a clearer board underneath the empty supers will clear them of bees allowing them to be removed

My apologies to the OP and to taff, who heroically pointed out my error.

That'll be too much red wine.

 

[tonybloke]

to the OP, (original poster)

can i suggest that you read a good, up-to-date book on beekeeping, such as Ted Hoopers, 'Guide to Bees and Honey'

 

[oliver90owner]

and read in several of my bee books

Could the OP list these books and quote from them, please?

That way a lot of other beeks could be warned about these books and avoid the folly of reading and acting on rubbish advice. Any book that recommends that sort of thing needs burning.

 

[matstones]

Put the 'Dry' supers on top of a clearer board on the original hive. Wait one/two days and remove bee free supers! Simples (I think!)

Thank you for your advice, that's essentially what I did, but when I removed the supers they were full of bees....so my issue was how to deal with that.

Currently they are beside the original hive, and I am hoping the bees will find their way home to the other hive...

 

[matstones]

A word of advice for the future - don't leave extracted frames out in the open for bees to 'clean out' it encourages robbing and can spread disease.
Next time, after extracting the honey, put the supers back on the hive with a feeder board (crown board with hole in) below - the bees will then go up and clear the frames as they think it's 'outside' the hive.
The books aren't always right

Thanks jenkinsbrynmair,

So the bees will know the supers above the board are not part of the hive, and won't try to include them as part of the hive... Clever !

Thanks

 

[matstones]

Erm, yes.

the OP says that the supers have been cleaned out and are dry.

poping a clearer board underneath the empty supers will clear them of bees allowing them to be removed

Taff,

...that seems to make better sense.....

Thanks

 

[george]

Pretend they are supers that need clearing . Put them back on above a clearer board and in 48 hrs bee free supers .
As above dont leave supers out in the open for all to feed on . Lots of fighting and dead bees will be the result and a chance of disease transfer .
As Rab points out , stop reading those particular books . Bad advice .
G

 

[matstones]

My apologies to the OP and to taff, who heroically pointed out my error.

That'll be too much red wine.

The Escape Board worked a treat (obvious solution really!) - only a handfull of bees left upstairs after 2 days. There seem to be lots of drawings of escape boards on the internet - for what it's work I used this design and it worked very well. Was considering using Benzaldehyde, but with hindsight - a good clearer board seems much more versatile...

wasn't allowed the post the link for the escape board - google " vortexescape " for drawing if interested

Thanks for all the advice

 

[BeeJayBee]

The Escape Board worked a treat (obvious solution really!) - only a handfull of bees left upstairs after 2 days. There seem to be lots of drawings of escape boards on the internet - for what it's work I used this design and it worked very well. Was considering using Benzaldehyde, but with hindsight - a good clearer board seems much more versatile...

wasn't allowed the post the link for the escape board - google " vortexescape " for drawing if interested

Thanks for all the advice

One of these? http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/vortexescape.html

 

[Madge]

... So I put the sticky frames, still in their 2 supers in the hive ...
This worked - after 2 days the frames were "dry" - but still full of bees.

So the question is how do I extract the 2 supers without upsetting the bees.

...

Or should I "shake" the bees off each frame into to the proper hive, or on the ground in front of it.

Yes - gently brush the bees off into their own hive. That's what I would have done. It will be a disturbance, but won't last that long. (Or use a clearer board - I think somebody's already suggested that.)

 

[Bungalow]

to the OP, (original poster)

can i suggest that you read a good, up-to-date book on beekeeping, such as Ted Hoopers, 'Guide to Bees and Honey'

Sure, Hooper is good. But not up to date. My copy says hardly anything about varroa or OSR.

 

[MuswellMetro]

and read in several of my bee books

Could the OP list these books and quote from them, please?

That way a lot of other beeks could be warned about these books and avoid the folly of reading and acting on rubbish advice. Any book that recommends that sort of thing needs burning.

i bet they are american books or links to USA web sites, it is very common to open feed in the USA

I know an old beekeepers who does it...he has just lost a hive through robbing because he allowed open scavenging of supers on top of his hive..we are still trying to convince him of his error but i expect he will do the same next year

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Sure, Hooper is good. But not up to date. My copy says hardly anything about varroa or OSR.

get a later edition then