Making a Long Hive without plans ...

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Little John

Drone Bee
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The Mk.II All-Weather Long-Hive

Key features:
# maximum flexibility in use
# uses top bars, standard size frames, or both
# economical to build
# no plans required


The All-Weather Long Hive described here is intended for 'stand-alone' use, but could equally be housed or stacked. It could also be fitted with legs for more comfortable 'back-garden' use.

It is principally a 18-19 frame one-piece hive with an integral floor fitted with mesh ventilation, a three-piece crown board and telescoping cover, and can be used in this minimal, low-profile configuration.
However, there are several advantages to be gained by fitting an upper box which can house several inches of insulation during winter, and a maximum of four one-pint insulated inverted jar overhead feeders in both autumn and early spring. In late spring and early summer, this upper box may be used to house one or more dedicated 'honey supers', or several cut-down supers could be inserted between these two boxes, as per the Dartington Hive..

The hive is so easily made that plans are not necessary: the dimensions being determined by working around an existing frame - and so needless to say, this frame must be accurately dimensioned - and be aware that most frames are not, and so first check and double-check it's dimensions. That, I'll call point 1.


The following building notes relate to Long Hives dimensioned for the National Deep (or Brood) Frame, typically denoted as DN(x). For other frame sizes, you'll obviously need to adjust the measurements accordingly. Two existing 8"(nominal) by 1" thick planks were used, from which 4 sides and 2 ends were cut without waste, with the remaining two ends being made from 1" thick planks sourced from pallets. This resulted in the construction of one 29" and one 31" hive.


Ok - point 2. The end pieces, which sit inside the side pieces, MUST be cut square, of exactly equal length, and as near to 370mm (for standard National frames) as possible. This will ensure that an accurate bee space is created on either side of the hanging frame.

Here then is the first picture: the box on the left is too shallow by around 15mm. The box on the right was the same, and so has had trimming pieces added to the tops of the sides to bring their height up to 215mm.


11h71om.jpg



So - point 3: any (side) height between 212 and 215mm is acceptable (for standard National brood frames), so that when a frame is placed on top of the adjusted sides, a bee space is created below the bottom of the frame - as shown.

You will also notice that an additional piece has been added to the box end, immediately behind the frame top bar.
Point 4: this piece needs to have a height of 18mm : this height is made up from 10mm to accommodate the frame top bar (the standard is actually 9mm, but in practice most frames are 10), and 8mm to provide a top bee space.

Point 5: a top bee space is essential, as these Long Hives contain a large number of frames (typically 18-19), and a divider is highly desirable in order to reduce the volume when initially housing small colonies. But - as the position of the divider is variable, the only way of effectively creating a seal between it and the crown board is for the crown board under-surface to be flush - thus a top bee space is mandatory.


In this next photograph, both of the 18mm vertical end pieces have been attached, and the 2 upper side pieces are being held in place by clamps. As can be seen, the 17" frame top bar straddles these upper side pieces, and by careful measurement the amount of rebate to be cut into them can be determined - in this case 6mm. An alternative to cutting rebates would have been to secure 6mm spacing pieces to the sides, and attach the upper side pieces to those. So - Point 6: determine the amount of rebate to be cut, allowing for (say) 1mm top bar end float each side, by placing a frame top bar across the box.


2hqe5bp.jpg



In the next photograph, the basic boxes are for-all-intents-and-purposes 'finished'. The rebate gaps will be plugged with scrap wood, entrance holes (4 x 22mm dia) will be cut into one end, and any holes, splits etc, being filled with automotive body filler before being finally painted.


2niclt2.jpg



Floors can either be solid, or a strip of mesh inserted to one side.
The next photograph shows a floor, made over-size (to be trimmed after fitting) with mesh stapled into shallow rebates which have been cut into pallet planks.
Imperfections being filled as before with automotive body filler before the floor is fitted.


2vulxuc.jpg



Point 7: if ventilation mesh is to be fitted, then it should be located to one side of the floor, and not centrally - in order that the hive may be tilted a few degrees during winter, to allow any condensation to exit the hive via the mesh, rather than 'pooling' on the hive floor.


Floor in place - top view

2v9s09t.jpg



and bottom view showing the added 'feet'.

2wgdkm1.jpg



The next pic shows the upper or top-box in place above the three-piece crown board. The telescopic roof frame is also shown, onto which will be secured a sheet of plywood, before finally attaching the aluminium cover.


2wh1lio.jpg



Here are the 2 hives, with the 29" on the left, sitting comfortably on their pallet, with division boards in place.


15x5zkh.jpg



Finally, two finished hives just waiting for the paint to 'season' before joining the rest of the circus ...


9rj8ua.jpg



Hope somebody finds this stuff of interest or inspiration. :)

LJ
 
Knew I forgot something ....

"Any resemblance between the paint I used, and the paint used on the type 47 Destroyers is purely concidental".

I know that 'cause the bloke in the Naval Dockyard Stores, Portsmouth, told me so.

LJ
 
This would be too shallow, at least by my opinion. I like idea for 27 frame long hive for two queen system, but with deeper frame ( DB or Lang jumbo or simmilar). I like when older beeks overhere call long hives " recruitment center". And when they talk how they manage these hives, they talk with great passion ( sometimes in a moment reminds me on kids when they are overjoyed to make something by their own and it works and completely fullfilled their goal - perfect result).
The energy in story is more precious than hive itself made by couple of planks.
Enjoy in your long hives:)
 
I made a similar structure using old scaffolding planks to increase the insulation, and put 100mm Celotex in the roof space.

The floor had to be added on site as it was all rather heavy!
 
I made a similar structure using old scaffolding planks to increase the insulation, and put 100mm Celotex in the roof space.

The floor had to be added on site as it was all rather heavy!

If You are interested to see some other longhives, type in google picture search: pološka
 
3 yrs later, and a bit of an update ...

Although I still have a few Long Hives housing 14"x9" frames, and which are proving ideal for the production of combs for donation, I very much agree with Goran's comment that the use of deeper frames is desirable - and indeed, during the last 2 years I've converted several Long Hives to take the deeper 14"x12" frame format, which has resulted in superior performance.

However, a word of caution: installing relatively small colonies into such large cavities can be problematic. But - within his 1920 book 'System of Beekeeping', Charles Dadant described a special type of division board - the use of which he considered essential during the initial stages of installation - which I think could more properly be described as being a Thermal Divider 'Curtain':

jkit8x.jpg



Dadant used oilcloth to create flexible seals at the sides of his divider, whereas in the first version I made, strips of PVC sheet were used (from a supermarket 'special offer' banner) wrapped around some soft foam rubber instead:

2ce3mtv.jpg



This divider has worked reasonably well, but it's top has remained a problem area, for when using hard Crown Boards (unlike Dadant), there is a reliance upon an exact match between the depth of box rebate (rabbet in the US) and the top bar thickness to create a perfect thermal seal. However, it occurred to me recently - why not employ exactly the same method used to create a flexible seal at the sides to create a similar flexible seal at the top as well ? And here's the result:

21dmxy0.jpg



This example was made during mid-winter 2017/18 in something of a hurry, and still requires a lick of paint, as well as some tightening-up of the PVC - but it was installed without any difficulty and appears to be doing rather well the job it was designed for.
LJ
 
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Welcome back, nice to hear your progress.
Keep us informed


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I always use dividers in my LDH - you just then move them to suit the size of the colony - I've put a nuc with bees on three frames into mine with diviiders to limit the space to what they need - just adding a frame or two at a time as the colony expands and moving the dividers as it goes on. I usually fill the outboard space with lumps of celotex but in an emergency I've used bin liners filled with rags - anything will do to fill the empty space.

I agree that the dviding boards need to be sealed at the top and edges - I just use foam rubber strips on the edges and bottom of the division boards which compress and the bees don't seem to mine into the foam rubber. On the top of the division board I have timber strips that butt up against the underside of the crown board.
 
Hope somebody finds this stuff of interest or inspiration. :)

LJ


Thank you for the post!

Him indoors built me one on legs. I really should find a photo and post it.

I do like your plastic pallet. Where did you acquire that from?
 
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Him indoors built me one on legs. I really should find a photo and post it.
I do like your plastic pallet. Where did you acquire that from?

"Him indoors" ... love it ! Yes - take a photo and let's have a look.

Plastic pallets ? From my local pallet yard. They buy and sell standard Euro-Pallets only, so are glad to get rid of anything which doesn't fit the EU specification. During one visit I noticed a single stack of nested plastic pallets about 8ft high which was looking a tad 'odd' and unloved amongst all the other wooden pallets, and duly enquired whether they were wanted or not ...
Long story short - for a nominal donation to the 'tea fund', the whole stack was duly loaded onto my trailer. A good day's work !


Forgot to mention - just as Blacky50 said - scaffold boards really are ideal for constructing Long Hives. Standard boards are typically 38mm thick x 225mm wide & 13ft long, so with that width all they really need then are some trimming pieces for a very fast and straightforward DN(x) build. If you're planning to install 14"x12" frames, then sawing a board down the middle then provides pieces to add for the extra height.

I've made several L/Hs this way - total cost per hive is negligible, certainly less than £10 when using additional pallet wood and other recycled materials.

LJ
 
I am glad that You enjoy working with long hives. Couple weeks ago I read one " article" on 7 pages where one good beek explained his work with long hives. Must say I enjoyed reading as can feel his love/passion to work with them. He worked with langs also but long hives are what he feels are right for him. If anyone would be " guilty" for me to have long hives on the apiary - he is the one " to blame".
 
What a peculiar frame size! Why not use normal Natinal frames of 14” x 8 1/2”?

S’pose there is nothing like continually re-inventing the wheel!
 
I am glad that You enjoy working with long hives. Couple weeks ago I read one " article" on 7 pages where one good beek explained his work with long hives. Must say I enjoyed reading as can feel his love/passion to work with them. He worked with langs also but long hives are what he feels are right for him. If anyone would be " guilty" for me to have long hives on the apiary - he is the one " to blame".

About half of Finnish hives were long hives 50 y ago. Now they are all burned. Frame size was 30 x 30 cm.
.
 
About half of Finnish hives were long hives 50 y ago. Now they are all burned. Frame size was 30 x 30 cm.
.

Presumably because all Finnish beekeepers are like you .. Just in it for the honey. Fortunately, a few people on here recognise that there is more to just keeping bees for the honey ... long hives are a useful addition to an apiary and are very interesting ... but, of course, if you have been keeping bees for 85 years and have five degrees, there is probably nothing more you need to find interesting ...except how to harvest 200kg from each hive.
 
Presumably because all Finnish beekeepers are like you .. Just in it for the honey. Fortunately, a few people on here recognise that there is more to just keeping bees for the honey ... long hives are a useful addition to an apiary and are very interesting ... but, of course, if you have been keeping bees for 85 years and have five degrees, there is probably nothing more you need to find interesting ...except how to harvest 200kg from each hive.

That is true.

.
 
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Of course it is ... that's why I said it !!:icon_204-2::icon_204-2:

Your sense of humour improves every year that goes by ...

You cannot win stupid in debating. That is fact too.

But I know that you never lie.
 
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What a peculiar frame size! Why not use normal Natinal frames of 14” x 8 1/2”?

S’pose there is nothing like continually re-inventing the wheel!

... and people wonder why I stopped posting here ...

Too much pedantry (by those who've obviously never heard of rounding-up), too much anal retention, too much testosterone, too much negativity, too much unpleasantness all round ...

I may call in again in another 3 years. But then again, maybe not.
LJ
 
I think some people need to get out more, I suppose with age change and experimentation becomes an uncomfortable process for some.


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